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Back in Black
11-17-2005, 06:26 AM
I'm not a hunter but I wish all the dear hunters the best of luck.

the_offsprings_monkey
11-17-2005, 06:27 AM
ohh I know what I'm hunting.

JoY
11-17-2005, 06:30 AM
"dear hunters". *giggles* aw.

I don't know a thing about hunting seasons, all I know is that the activity of hunting steals my boyfriend away from me. *sniffs* so unfair.

Back in Black
11-17-2005, 08:09 AM
ohh I know what I'm hunting.
I don't want to know.

the_offsprings_monkey
11-17-2005, 08:35 AM
Pfffft liked I tell you :p

Sunny
11-17-2005, 09:29 AM
No offence to anybody, but I fucking hate hunters. Surely there has to be ANOTHER way of proving your masculinity that doesn't involve shooting of powerless fuzzy things?

JohnnyNemesis
11-17-2005, 09:30 AM
Surely there has to be ANOTHER way of proving your masculinity that doesn't involve shooting of powerless fuzzy things?

One word:

cunilingus

Sunny
11-17-2005, 09:31 AM
I like how you think. :D

<<Angry Kid>>
11-17-2005, 09:44 AM
I throwrocks at hunters and spit on there big red cheeks :p

JoY
11-17-2005, 09:47 AM
No offence to anybody, but I fucking hate hunters. Surely there has to be ANOTHER way of proving your masculinity that doesn't involve shooting of powerless fuzzy things?
I know I don't need to defend myself, or my boyfriend & I know I've already had this conversation a million time with dozens of people, but Huibert doesn't hunt to prove his masculinity. at all. he just.. grew up with it. & he loves it. he adores nature, knows so fucking much about it & just overal enjoys being in it. most of the times, when he goes out hunting, he comes home with nothing. but that's fine, because his day was well spent. when he does come home with something, he & his family eat it. (so like, there is a purpose) & frankly, I feel better eating a hare, that's lived its whole life in a happy forest, than a chicken, that was overfed & stacked in some kind of factory with millions of other chickens.

the_offsprings_monkey
11-17-2005, 09:51 AM
No offence to anybody, but I fucking hate hunters. Surely there has to be ANOTHER way of proving your masculinity that doesn't involve shooting of powerless fuzzy things?
I agree with this, shooting poor defenceless animals is cruel.

JoY
11-17-2005, 09:52 AM
& I suppose making their life absolutely miserable & then slaughtering them is completely fair?

the_offsprings_monkey
11-17-2005, 09:54 AM
& I suppose making their life absolutely miserable & then slaughtering them is completely fair?
True but it's...oh shit I'm at a crossroad.

Sunny
11-17-2005, 10:01 AM
Making animals live in cages and then slaughtering them for meat is fucked up too. It's mostly just... gross. Which is why I rarely ever eat meat.. and when I do, I make god damn sure it's free range organic.


Huibert doesn't hunt to prove his masculinity. at all. he just.. grew up with it. & he loves it. he adores nature, knows so fucking much about it & just overal enjoys being in it.

i wasn't saying that *he* was. =p but it is true with most hunters i've come across. and of course, what you grew up with kind of becomes second nature, i don't blame him... but i don't understand the "i love nature so much that i'm gonna shoot its natural components for FUN!" standpoint. If you love something, leave it intact... that's how I see it, at least.

JoY
11-17-2005, 10:26 AM
Mags -I understand your point, that was exactly how I viewed it first too. I'm definitely an animal lover & can't even look at mice, that were caught in our mousetrap. their little black eyes are.. rahh, so cuties.

but one time I was walking through the supermarket & suddenly, at the meat-section, it kind of hit me. just.. people are omnivores, no matter how much we love animals. vegetarians refuse to eat meat, but they can't escape buying things an animal was hurt for, because that's just the way our society & nature works. veganists can't even *really* escape it. human instinct tells us to eat vegatables, but also to eat meat. we've wildly exploited that by the way we treat animals, that we think belong on the dinnertable.

& like billions of other people my boyfriend really enjoys a good steak, a pheasant-chest, a deer's ass & the like. he combines that with his passion for nature by going out to hunt it. he doesn't see walking dinner when he walks through the forest, he sees the animals for what they are & knows real well what they are & how magnificent life is. like all hunters here, he follows extremely strict guidelines on what he can shoot & how much he can shoot, so the natural balance will never be disrupted.

it's a very strong personal feeling of right & wrong inside me, that screamed "wrongwrongWRONG" when I heard he hunts as his hobby. but I couldn't help but feeling like an enormous hypocrit with my chicken-sandwitches, Filet Américain, eggs with bacon, when I saw he definitely doesn't care any less than I do for animals. & his prey lived a happy life, unlike what we all buy in the store. (not that my boyfriend never buys meat from the store..)

I guess he kind of does get a kick out of that. of course there's the kick of being a good shooter, but also knowing what's on the table is what -he- successfully shot, that it isn't supermarket stuff, but that it came right from nature & is as pure as can be. the remembrance of a successful day in the forest, out in the fresh air, out where he loves it the most. it's just a combination of passions. I'm now tempted to believe it's the best way to get food on the table; go out & get it. at least you can't escape from knowing exactly what you're eating & how it died. it's realistic & pure.


...essay-alert?? ;p

JoY
11-17-2005, 10:27 AM
Making animals live in cages and then slaughtering them for meat is fucked up too. It's mostly just... gross. Which is why I rarely ever eat meat.. and when I do, I make god damn sure it's free range organic.

that's fabulous. =)

memento
11-17-2005, 10:34 AM
No offence to anybody, but I fucking hate hunters. Surely there has to be ANOTHER way of proving your masculinity that doesn't involve shooting of powerless fuzzy things?

It's natural and it's humane. And it's not about proving your masculinity, it's the very base of it. Masculine = hunter/gatherer

<<Angry Kid>>
11-17-2005, 10:36 AM
It's natural and it's humane. And it's not about proving your masculinity, it's the very base of it. Masculine = hunter/gatherer
Fuck you ignoramus

JoY
11-17-2005, 10:42 AM
you know? that oxygen you're breathing? you're wasting it.

Sunny
11-17-2005, 10:48 AM
Bella - I do understand what you're saying. :] I guess I know a lot of hunters who don't even eat their prey, they just shoot it, go "yay!" and dispose of it. I find it sickening. It's killing for the sake of killing, and I despise that. But if you actually eat the animal, like your bf does, it seems more legitimate. Still somewhat unnecessary.. (in my book) but necessarily WRONG. And obviously, when you compare growing animals in tiny cages and killing them in the wild, the latter is definitely more humane.. because at least they had the opportunity to live a free life. So yah, I know where you're coming from. Thanks for explaining. :]

And it's definitely true that it's hard to escape hurting animals, even if you don't eat meat. I go through hell finding cruelty-free products.. but it's virtually impossible to always avoid stuff that's animal-tested.

eugh. upsetting.


It's natural and it's humane. And it's not about proving your masculinity, it's the very base of it. Masculine = hunter/gatherer

A lot of things are natural and instinct-based, yet we refrain from them.

First of all, people don't NEED to be hunters/gatherers in the literal sense of the word anymore. If there were no grocery stores, hey, fuck, go ahead, kill your own food. I wouldn't say a word then. But you really don't need to these days.

As for other primitive instincts, if I wanted to follow what's natural, every time another woman hits on my partner, I'd have to go for her throat/eyes. That's widely acceptable in the animal world. Do I want to? yes. do I? er, not quite.

memento
11-17-2005, 10:52 AM
So you prefer grocery stores to deer hunting? wtf. You realise everything bella just said yeah? one shot, one kill, no pain. Free range organic meat at its best.

I'm an animal lover. Not a pro hunter. I'm anti fox hunting becuase of the cruelty but things like Deer hunting are fine.

Sunny
11-17-2005, 11:01 AM
And as I said earlier, many people don't hurt for food, they hunt to kill and then dispose of their prey. Which is a complete waste. If all hunters hunted to put food on their tables, I wouldn't really care. And yeah, fox hunting is hunting too, and in my opinion there's no way to justify it as "humane" or "natural".

memento
11-17-2005, 11:03 AM
Do I want to? yes. do I? er, not quite.

That's cause you're like 5ft2" 90lbs! But seriously...

it's lame wanting to. You're always gonna be the one that leaves with him.

memento
11-17-2005, 11:05 AM
And as I said earlier, many people don't hurt for food, they hunt to kill and then dispose of their prey. Which is a complete waste.

What about over-production of food on farms? What about the tons of meat that is thrown away due to out of date food?

It's not even cruel. It's not cruel if a sniper 1 mile away is looking at me through his scope and eliminates me. I don't even see it coming. Nor does the animal. They just run around and wham. If that's cruel we have different definitions of cruel.

Fox Hunting with hounds (I meant) is different, they chase the foxes with dogs until they like boil and get so tired. It's so cruel.

Bacterium
11-17-2005, 11:08 AM
i'm not too much into the what-meat-should-we-eat thing, but I don't like certain hunters, cause they hunt way too close to where people actually are living. a few weeks ago the hunters' dog came running from the woods and over the garden, barking and following haretracks. then the hunters are too near.
and once i was out riding in the woods, and I was still on the roads where people walk with dogs and all every day, and some hunter fired a shot and my first reaction was to duck and then I got frightened I was gonna get killed so I hade to ride home again. and I hate not to be able riding on everyday-used roads in the woods, not even a half mile from my home. sucks.


And by the way: for a few weeks ago a hunter killed another hunter while hunting. by mistake. my experience is now that hunters shoot everything that moves.

memento
11-17-2005, 11:09 AM
HaHa hunters hunting hunters.

HH H H H

Bacterium
11-17-2005, 11:15 AM
there's a swedish movie called "the hunters" and it's freaking scary

JoY
11-17-2005, 11:24 AM
As for other primitive instincts, if I wanted to follow what's natural, every time another woman hits on my partner, I'd have to go for her throat/eyes. That's widely acceptable in the animal world. Do I want to? yes. do I? er, not quite.
haha, aw, you said that in the most cute way.

the best thing I suppose about the whole hunting-scene (or at least, my boyfriend's hunting scene) is the total awareness. you know what you're shooting, you know what you're killing (& will be eating) & you understand as a 21 year old perfectly fine the worth of life. it's nothing like the lifeless steak you buy in the supermarket, it's walking around with a fucking fur. he'd never dispose it. whoa. he doesn't shoot around like a madman & leaves it there to rot. that's why I mentioned there are such strict guidelines here (& mostly everywhere, I think). the whole challenge & sport is to hit something from a (rather great) distance as painless as possible (one hit, one kill), knowing exactly what you're doing/being skilled, follow the guidelines (almost like sportsrules, like with.. golf, or.. football. only that doesn't involve life-death. mostly just life, heh) & the whole victory is having a delicious, pure dinner & saving your mother a trip to the supermarket. & of course having spent a day outdoors.

but I've already explained this with a massive post, so *slaps herself*.

on the other point of hunting being unnecessary; (going to turn around things big time, by the way) it's a bit like fois gras. you know how that's made? personally that absolutely disgusts me; the in vivo stuffing of geese untill their stomachs burst & they're so incredibly fat, they have organ-failure. I really can't eat that stuff. that killing method is similar to some torture-methods the nazis practiced on Jews in the Second World War. it's ultimate torture. it's, rarr, it's cruel. so I refuse to ever eat fois gras. but guess what? it's still for sale everywhere & anywhere.

with the strict rules on how much we can hunt, it's impossible the man of every household goes out all day to hunt for dinner. it's also impossible with our society, ambitions, etc.. it's overal just the most rediculous idea ever. BUT.. hunting once a month, not eating supermarket-meat for at least once a month, or even a year, is still better than buying meat from the supermarket every day of every week of every month of every year.

of course it can't make supermarket-meat redundant, like it doesn't help the poor geese if I stop eating fois gras, but.. yeah.. you get my point. I understand you'd say hunting is unnecessary with supermarkets all around us, but if it's your hobby, your way of getting out, getting exercise, you get a kick out of it & it's a way to treat yourself on a lovely dinner (personally I love wild meat, or however you say that), I guess the satisfaction it gives is righteously better than that of a trip to the supermarket.

so no, we don't need to hunt. as a society hunting is superfluous. but on a personal level it can be important. like any hobby/passion. & most certainly if it's what's familiar to you & you grew up with it.

Rag Doll
11-17-2005, 11:25 AM
And as I said earlier, many people don't hurt for food, they hunt to kill and then dispose of their prey. Which is a complete waste. If all hunters hunted to put food on their tables, I wouldn't really care. And yeah, fox hunting is hunting too, and in my opinion there's no way to justify it as "humane" or "natural".

yeah. and here the government actually endorses deer & bear hunting because they say there is an overpopulation. and then there are news reports of dead animals being found in the woods because the hunters just shoot them and then leave them. or they shoot them but don't kill them...and then the wounded animal wanders into a neighborhood and dies in someones backyard. that's fucked up. *bang* yay *bang* yay *bang* yay....bah. it's not quite as bad if the hunter actually uses the meat or whatnot. but to kill just to kill? pff.

JoY
11-17-2005, 11:27 AM
It's not even cruel. It's not cruel if a sniper 1 mile away is looking at me through his scope and eliminates me. I don't even see it coming. Nor does the animal. They just run around and wham. If that's cruel we have different definitions of cruel.

that isn't cruel to you, but it is cruel to people who like you. *frownie face*

& yeah, having heard everything about Fox Hunting, I don't think I could ever justify -that-. not to me, or anyone else.

memento
11-17-2005, 11:28 AM
I wasn't aware that Deer had deep social connections. Maybe they do.

JoY
11-17-2005, 11:36 AM
yeah. and here the government actually endorses deer & bear hunting because they say there is an overpopulation. and then there are news reports of dead animals being found in the woods because the hunters just shoot them and then leave them. or they shoot them but don't kill them...and then the wounded animal wanders into a neighborhood and dies in someones backyard. that's fucked up. *bang* yay *bang* yay *bang* yay....bah. it's not quite as bad if the hunter actually uses the meat or whatnot. but to kill just to kill? pff.
that's somewhat sickening.

sometimes the hunters in my boyfriend's region get a message to shoot hares, because they're flooding the forests & eating everything on their way. meh, I suppose our entire society has distorted the natural balance. not that hunters could/would ever fix that, but yeah.

JoY
11-17-2005, 11:37 AM
I wasn't aware that Deer had deep social connections. Maybe they do.
Bambi did.

& you took yourself as an example. I'm sure you noticed. ;p