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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 06:37 AM
I know that 49 out of 100 citizens of the United States voted against Bush, but Bush has been the president who had more votes from people in the history of USA... that's really depressing....it's similar like hitler, he arrived at the power of legal form (then he did his illegal things of course)

I try to explain that Hitler started the II World War.... Bush will start III World War if he continues doing the same in another countries, and american people had to see this when the was voting Bush

Bush only makes bigger the feeling of anti-americanism in the world
What are you talking about, if a 1% victory is the largest victory in the history of the United States...well the only victory I can think that was smaller than 1% was the first time Bush 'won'. Seriously I haven't had math in 2 years, but if you couldn't see through that, then you need some extra courses.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 07:14 AM
I didn't say that Bush had the largest victory in the history of the United States, I said that he was the president who was more voted, it's not the same... and I think that Bush had 4000000 of votes more than kerry, 58.000000 of people who voted Bush, who voted a genocide.... Do you understand me when I say that I am an anti-american?? How is possible that there are 58000000 of people pro bush???
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 07:32 AM
I didn't say that Bush had the largest victory in the history of the United States, I said that he was the president who was more voted, it's not the same... and I think that Bush had 4000000 of votes more than kerry, 58.000000 of people who voted Bush, who voted a genocide.... Do you understand me when I say that I am an anti-american?? How is possible that there are 58000000 of people pro bush???
You fail to understand the power a propaganda machine has over the uneducated masses that is the united states. You hate Americans because you believe they hate Iraqis? It's alright to be anti-war, but that doesn't mean you have to sound like an idiot. Italy's population has supported far worse wars for instance? You don't see many anti-Italians.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 08:02 AM
You fail to understand the power a propaganda machine has over the uneducated masses that is the united states. You hate Americans because you believe they hate Iraqis? It's alright to be anti-war, but that doesn't mean you have to sound like an idiot. Italy's population has supported far worse wars for instance? You don't see many anti-Italians.


You have to read and understand better guy, tell me when I said "I hate Americans because I believe they hate Iraqis"?? never, and I never said that iraqis are better people than american, or that the americans are the worst people in the world.... I only said that I don't agree like many americans think about the world, and in this moment, USA is destroying the world
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 08:04 AM
Do you understand me when I say that I am an anti-american??

This is what bothers me. The Americans, just half of them support Bush. Yet you are anti-American. It makes you look stupid. Cause Italians themselves have had stupid leaders and stupid wars.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 08:09 AM
Maybe I look stupid, but wichever way you look at it, Bush is the president of USA, and it is for one reason.... americans voted him
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 08:10 AM
I hate all Italians for bringing Mussolini into this world. Fascist scumbags.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 08:23 AM
What happend to you with Italy?? if you are trying to fucking me, you should know that I am spanish... and I hate all fascist too, I hate Mussolini, I hate Hitler and I hate Franco.... but the difference with USA is that we have learned, and in Spain there isn't a new Franco (Zapatero is a socialist), in Germany there isn't a new Hitler (Schroeder is a socialist)....
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 09:52 AM
Ah Spanish, sorry.

How is Bush being President any different than Franco being the leader? How is better? Just because it happened 60 years ago? It's been less than 30 years since Franco died, yet you all still love the King for bringing democracy (despite the fact that the King was raised and trained by Franco.)

Leo_ARG
01-09-2005, 10:09 AM
Americans are stupid...errr...no, just 51% of them :D

pOpe
01-09-2005, 10:13 AM
Ah Spanish, sorry.

How is Bush being President any different than Franco being the leader? How is better? Just because it happened 60 years ago? It's been less than 30 years since Franco died, yet you all still love the King for bringing democracy (despite the fact that the King was raised and trained by Franco.)


yeah, and I'm not agree with the king, I always say that Spain should be a republic.... and although Franco died 30 years ago, Bush is similar than he, and it shows that bush is a fascist, genocide and criminal conservator
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 11:09 AM
So why are you anti-American but not anti-Spanish? Or for that matter anti-most of the world who has ass-hole dictators for leaders.

wtf_mate?
01-09-2005, 11:19 AM
This is pretty entertaining...

I agree with wheelchairman here. Are you saying you hate all Americans because Bush was elected? Buddy, that means you even hate the ones that voted against Bush. Are you listening to yourself? I have no intention of causing an argument, but WCM is right.

By the way wheelchairman. Even though he's not Italian, I still like the analogy you made about hating Italians.

LOL, that was priceless...

wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 11:35 AM
Well technically, Francisco Franco is every bit as bad, if not worse than Benito Mussolini.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 02:10 PM
So why are you anti-American but not anti-Spanish? Or for that matter anti-most of the world who has ass-hole dictators for leaders.


'Cause in Spain we had a peaceful transition to democracy, and we throwed Aznar... and americans don't throwed Bush
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L2L1
01-09-2005, 02:14 PM
This is pretty entertaining...

I agree with wheelchairman here. Are you saying you hate all Americans because Bush was elected? Buddy, that means you even hate the ones that voted against Bush. Are you listening to yourself? I have no intention of causing an argument, but WCM is right.

By the way wheelchairman. Even though he's not Italian, I still like the analogy you made about hating Italians.

LOL, that was priceless...
http://www.ebaumsworld.com/forumfun/newbie.jpg

wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 02:17 PM
'Cause in Spain we had a peaceful transition to democracy, and we throwed Aznar... and americans don't throwed Bush
We will only have 8 years of Bush. You had 40 of Franco. The scale is uneven.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 02:38 PM
We will only have 8 years of Bush. You had 40 of Franco. The scale is uneven.
You talk like I want that Franco will be alive now... and many spanish died in the dictatorship trying to change Spain (my family too), but to change USA the only thing that americans needed was don't vote Bush... I think that is a little bit more easy, don't you?
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 02:48 PM
You really think so? What makes you think that Bush was even elected in 4 years ago?

It's easier to vote a dictator into power than it is to vote him out.

Besides the war in Iraq makes it almost impossible to change a president, no matter what his fuckups.

But you should understand, half of Americans are against Bush, and you are anti-American. Not only is that a stupid idea, but it makes you look like an idiot too. You can't judge half a population for the actions of the other half.

If the majority of people were against Franco, why didn't they overthrow him?

pOpe
01-09-2005, 03:30 PM
'cause Franco was a dictator, and he controlled the army, and if you said something against Franco, he killed you... if an american says something against Bush, he don't kill you, it's so simple

On the one hand I didn't say never that Bush is a dictator, I say that Bush is a genocide, an arrogance and stupid, and if americans were against Bush, they didn't have to die, they only had to vote against Bush... there are more stupid americans than americans who want a peaceful world

On the other hand, like I said before, Hitler arrived at the power of legal form.... what will happend with Bush?? time will tell
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 04:27 PM
'cause Franco was a dictator, and he controlled the army, and if you said something against Franco, he killed you... if an american says something against Bush, he don't kill you, it's so simple

On the one hand I didn't say never that Bush is a dictator, I say that Bush is a genocide, an arrogance and stupid, and if americans were against Bush, they didn't have to die, they only had to vote against Bush... there are more stupid americans than americans who want a peaceful world

On the other hand, like I said before, Hitler arrived at the power of legal form.... what will happend with Bush?? time will tell
If you actively try to overthrow Bush you will be labelled a terrorist, the entire RCP has and probably several other communist parties. Bush uses many similar methods.

It's ridiculous to be anti-American because of Bush, as it is ridiculous to be anti-Spanish because of Franco.

Skate Rat 19
01-09-2005, 04:57 PM
That would be a different argument, you presented your ideas, and I showed you how you were wrong. Either take my rejections of your 'facts' and show how they are wrong, or else quit arguing.


Well this is getting stupid anyways so, cya.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 05:11 PM
It's ridiculous to be anti-American because of Bush, as it is ridiculous to be anti-Spanish because of Franco.

You don't see... Franco was spanish's leader, but most spanish people didn't want Franco, Bush is americans' leader 'cause most of american people wanted Bush, that's a difference very important

You can't say "I'm anti-Spanish because of Franco" 'cause most of spanish people didn't agree with this dictator, but I can say "I'm anti-american because of Bush" 'cause most of americans voted him... I know that many americans voted against Bush, but I'm talking about the most of the USA people, I'm talking about why Bush is the president...'cause MOST of americans are stupids... for that I am anti-all these people... anti-most americans... anti-american
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wheelchairman
01-09-2005, 05:18 PM
Ah I see there is no talking with you.

Bush was not elected. On the foundation of being an unelected president, his re-election, while he started a war (and you have to take that into account, no people change presidents or leaders during a war) was re-elected.

And voting Bush doesn't make you an idiot. I can think of people who voted for Bush who are smarter than you.

Only idiots discriminate against entire populations. Especially when your socialist leader isn't particularly great, the occupation of Basque territory for example is nothing to be proud of.

pOpe
01-09-2005, 05:44 PM
Ah I see there is no talking with you.

Bush was not elected. On the foundation of being an unelected president, his re-election, while he started a war (and you have to take that into account, no people change presidents or leaders during a war) was re-elected.

And voting Bush doesn't make you an idiot. I can think of people who voted for Bush who are smarter than you.

Only idiots discriminate against entire populations. Especially when your socialist leader isn't particularly great, the occupation of Basque territory for example is nothing to be proud of.

JAJAJAJA, you are so interesting :p

Well, Basque is a spanish community, but, I agree with (against my goverment and most spanish people) like basque's politics want, that people go and voted if they want the independence, 'cause I belive that the goverment is a institution to satisfy people.

I agree with people voted all they want, but paecefully... do you know Basque history? there are group of terrorist called ETA (I'm sure that you know them), and I say terrorist yes, 'cause they killed more of 850 innocent people because of the independence... at the beggining, ETA was a liberal terrorist movement ('cause they only kill politics... it was bad of course, but it's not the same that put a bomb in a supermarket in christmas like they did) but the days were passing and ETA killed more and more innocent people...

The politic who wanted the independency is Ibarretxe, a person who wants a independent "country" but with the spanish money...I agree with the independence if they want, of course, and I'm not agree with declaring illegal ETA's politic group (because with this actions my goverment is quite similar like franco's dictatorship).... but I'm not agree with you when you say that Spain is occuping Basque, bacuse it's the same that think that Italy is occupating Milan, this is ridiculous
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pOpe
01-09-2005, 05:59 PM
I forgot to say this, jeje, a illegal occupation is like Bush is doing now in irak, or like Sharon is doing now in Palestinian..... Spain is not occuping anything, and when you said "people can't change of leader in the war" well... we do it with Aznar, and the war finished for spanish army
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wtf_mate?
01-09-2005, 06:49 PM
Ah I see there is no talking with you.

Bush was not elected. On the foundation of being an unelected president, his re-election, while he started a war (and you have to take that into account, no people change presidents or leaders during a war) was re-elected.

And voting Bush doesn't make you an idiot. I can think of people who voted for Bush who are smarter than you.

Only idiots discriminate against entire populations. Especially when your socialist leader isn't particularly great, the occupation of Basque territory for example is nothing to be proud of.

WCM, you just might possibly be the smartest person I have ever seen on a message board.

I couldn't say it better myself.

wheelchairman
01-10-2005, 05:06 AM
I know very well who the ETA are.

The ETA however is not a terrorist organization, they are only pegged so because the current government is naturally against Basque independence.

The ETA does not target civilians, or in chances when civilians may be targeted they often give warning calls beforehand so that the area can be evacuated, it is only when a mistake is made, that civilians are killed, like in every war.

For about 50 years of existence, I would say 850 civilian deaths is rather small.

A recent study by the Université del País Vasco, 33% of the population want independence, 32% want federalism (more independence but not complete independence) 32% autonomy (another form for more independence) and 2% agreed with being a part of the current system.

In light of this, I would say that the lack of ability to administrate their own government makes the Spaniards an occupational force. As well as the fact that Madrid has made it impossible for certain candidates of certain parties to be elected. Stuff like this you know?

And you know very well that the PP lost during the election because the terrorist attack in Madrid happened before the election, that's why public opinion changed so quickly, in America it happend after and that is one of the most important differences, no?

pOpe
01-10-2005, 05:55 AM
Are you defending ETA?? you said "The ETA does not target civilians" well, the bomb in a supermarket, that they killed 25 people... is not a civilians target?? tell me if you think that a supermarekt is a political or military target, 'cause if you think so you are a completly stupid guy

And the goverment is not occupating Basque, show me any picture of a tank, of a military ore something like this in Basque, please....

I say that I agree with the independence if they want, but peacefull independence, it's true that my goverment and most of spanish don't like independence (I'm not agree with them) but, if you think that is a important reason, you can say "I'm anti-spanish" and I won't say nothing, 'cause 90 % of spanish don't like the independence.

I wish and I hope that this conflict will be resoluted (resolved... I don't know the right word) like IRA in Great Britain (when negociations started IRA didn't kill noboody) but it's too difficoult
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wheelchairman
01-10-2005, 05:58 AM
Did the ETA claim that attack? Because I really don't believe you. You live in Spain, you know very well that there are no supermarkets open on Christmas.

It doesn't matter what 90% of the Spanish people think about the independence of the Basque Country, it matters that the people of the Basque country think.

pOpe
01-10-2005, 05:59 AM
WCM, you just might possibly be the smartest person I have ever seen on a message board.

I couldn't say it better myself.


I agree with wheelchairman here


By the way wtf_mate? can you think about yourself?? Do you have any opinion or you only can say this stupids things?? You should stop being a today and say something in your own
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pOpe
01-10-2005, 06:10 AM
Did the ETA claim that attack? Because I really don't believe you. You live in Spain, you know very well that there are no supermarkets open on Christmas.


Well, I wanted to say on christamas holidays (not the 25 of december), and yes, they claimed tha attack (if you want more information, it happened in Barcelona, in a supermarket called Hipercor, and it was the worst action of ETA) and I agree with you in that:


It doesn't matter what 90% of the Spanish people think about the independence of the Basque Country, it matters that the people of the Basque country think.

For that I want that people of the BAsque country vote in a referendum, I always said that, but I only tried to say that, like I said I anti-amerian, if you want to say you are anti-spanish because of that I won't say nothing
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wheelchairman
01-10-2005, 08:01 AM
The Hipercor bombing apparently happened in 1987, this doesn't change my opinion. I told you they try to get the areas evacuated, but mistakes are made at times.

The entire point of this discussion, was that being an Anti-American is a retarded reactionary opinion, you obviously don't care. You've made it onto my list of 'ignorant fucks with stupid opinions.' Congratulations.

pOpe
01-10-2005, 08:15 AM
wow, that's an honour for me, thanks :D

If you don't have nothing to say about this, I'll think that I'm right... I change my opninion when I feel that I was wrong... but this is not that case

You've made it onto my list of 'ignorant fucks with stupid opinions.' Congratulations
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pOpe
01-10-2005, 08:18 AM
Oh, I forgot it, ETA didn't call to police in this action...so it was a civilian target 100%
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wheelchairman
01-10-2005, 09:46 AM
Oh, I forgot it, ETA didn't call to police in this action...so it was a civilian target 100%
Back this up with evidence.

pOpe
01-10-2005, 09:57 AM
I haven't got evidences, 'cause when it happened I was 1 year old... but it's true

a question.... are you agree with defending ideologist ideas with violence?? I am against ETA, but I'm not against ETA's politic group, do you understand what I'm trying to say?
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wheelchairman
01-10-2005, 09:59 AM
I haven't got evidences, 'cause when it happened I was 1 year old... but it's true

a question.... are you agree with defending ideologist ideas with violence?? I am against ETA, but I'm not against ETA's politic group, do you understand what I'm trying to say?
Well surely you have read about it, cause I doubt you rsaw this and remembered it from the news at the age of 1.

I have no problem with violence, without violence countries would never have their independence. Without Nehru, Ghandi would've been rather meaningless.

wtf_mate?
01-10-2005, 12:38 PM
By the way wtf_mate? can you think about yourself?? Do you have any opinion or you only can say this stupids things?? You should stop being a today and say something in your own

I answered your stupid fucking question you had at your first post didn't I? I have quite a political opinion, but I have no need to go blabbering on about what I believe. But, you still want me to say something on my own. Calling yourself anti-American because the acts of 51% of the population of this nation is just retarded. When you are "anti" something, it means you are not only the opposite of that thing, but you are almost to the point of working against it. Is there some Spanish political message board you could be at?

Again...


You should stop being a today and say something in your own

Thanks, I'll be sure to work on that...

pOpe
01-10-2005, 02:20 PM
I answered your stupid fucking question you had at your first post didn't I? I have quite a political opinion, but I have no need to go blabbering on about what I believe. But, you still want me to say something on my own. Calling yourself anti-American because the acts of 51% of the population of this nation is just retarded. When you are "anti" something, it means you are not only the opposite of that thing, but you are almost to the point of working against it. Is there some Spanish political message board you could be at?

Again...



Thanks, I'll be sure to work on that...

I'm anti-american 'cause Bush is now the president again, I'm anti-american 'cause USA didn't sing the pact of Kioto (treaty? I don't know the word) (I'm talking about global warming) , I'm anti-american bacuse USA didn't sing the pact who forbids children work and go to wars..... USA is the most important world of the world, and USA can't have this kind of politic... is not because Bush, is not because Clinton, is because USA do only what they want

Egypt was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Greece was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Rome was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Spain was the most important civilization in the world, and we fall down... USA is the most important civilization in the world now, and they'll fall down... I hope that I can see that day

wheelchairman you said before that "I have no problem with violence" well, are you agree with Al-Quida too?
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wtf_mate?
01-10-2005, 02:50 PM
I'm anti-american 'cause Bush is now the president again

You hate every American because of Bush's actions? Even those Americans who agree with you?


I'm anti-american 'cause USA didn't sing the pact of Kioto (treaty? I don't know the word) (I'm talking about global warming)

Again, *sigh*, see above


I'm anti-american bacuse USA didn't sing the pact who forbids children work and go to wars

Speaking that child labor is illegal in the United States, and that you can't go to war until you are 18 years old, maybe you should take an American Studies class or something.


Egypt was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Greece was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Rome was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Spain was the most important civilization in the world, and we fall down... USA is the most important civilization in the world now, and they'll fall down... I hope that I can see that day

You forgot Rome.


Spain was the most important civilization in the world, and we fall down

Actually, I'm pretty sure England had you beat.

Phillip II, 1587: Ah...what a beautiful armada...

Phillip II, 1588: Aw Fuck...

wtf_mate?
01-10-2005, 02:54 PM
Oh, yeah. Almost forgot...

Here you go pOpe.

http://www.madridman.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi

Here's a place where you can argue, and those you are debating will actually know what you're saying.

wheelchairman
01-10-2005, 03:08 PM
I'm anti-american 'cause Bush is now the president again, I'm anti-american 'cause USA didn't sing the pact of Kioto (treaty? I don't know the word) (I'm talking about global warming) , I'm anti-american bacuse USA didn't sing the pact who forbids children work and go to wars..... USA is the most important world of the world, and USA can't have this kind of politic... is not because Bush, is not because Clinton, is because USA do only what they want



wheelchairman you said before that "I have no problem with violence" well, are you agree with Al-Quida too?
And what makes you think the American people have any responsibility over this? Foreign policy has nothing to do with the American elections, it's based on morals because the system dumbs people down into uneducated religious zombies, and it's done a good job too. So why don't you hate the system that created the people, and not the people? That's what bugs me, your system lacks logic. You don't hate the Spanish people for the actions of El Cid for example, you shouldn't have hated the Spanish people for once being an empire. You can hate the system, and the leaders, but hating the people is ridiculous xenophobia that shouldn't exist in today's educated world.


Egypt was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Greece was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Rome was the most important civilization in the world, and they fall down, Spain was the most important civilization in the world, and we fall down... USA is the most important civilization in the world now, and they'll fall down... I hope that I can see that day
And this is COMPLETELY irrelevant to being anti-American.

I don't support Al-Qa'ida, why should I? I am not Wahhabist, but I think Bush is a worse terrorist, by far.

SicN Twisted
01-10-2005, 06:54 PM
It's more of a statistical fact that Bush is a worse terrorism, if we judge both by American standards that define terrorism.

.TripGirl
01-10-2005, 10:25 PM
shut the fuck up you dumshit
bush is the worst terrorist, worst that al-quida.. worst that osama bin laden, worst that evrone

pOpe
01-11-2005, 12:03 PM
And what makes you think the American people have any responsibility over this? Foreign policy has nothing to do with the American elections.
You are wrong, there was another candidate, I don't remember the name, who wanted to sign the pact of Kioto, and that is foreign policy


So why don't you hate the system that created the people, and not the people?
'cause the system was created for people, and if they would be against the system, they will change it


You don't hate the Spanish people for the actions of El Cid for example

What fuck is this?? Tell me now one spanish action like El Cid did?? spanish people have learned about our actions in the past, when USA stop doing this kind of foreign policy (when americans say "stop") I won't be anti-american


I don't support Al-Qa'ida, why should I? I am not Wahhabist, but I think Bush is a worse terrorist, by far.
You said before "I have no problem with violence", this is the reason about my question.... and yes, I agree with you that Bush is the worst terrorist

The world will be a better place if won't be more wars... and I'm sure that you'll be agree with me that now, with USA's foreign policy that is impossible

Pd: another sign of USA's arrogance... why they don't recognize The Hague's international court (international court of The Hague.. I don't know what is the better form to say)?? Why they have fear?? because of his genocide??

Si todos los paises fueran iguales ante la ley, si todos los paises tuvieran el mismo poder, si todos los paises tuvieran las mismas oportunidades y no hubiera estas politicas capitalistas y globalizadoras, el mundo seria un lugar mejor y mas justo... esto concierne a todos los gobiernos del mundo, unos lo hacen mejor que otros, pero el que va en camino contrario para conseguir la igualdad mundial y la paz mundial es EEUU, de eso no me cabe duda, y con el apoyo de la mayoria del pueblo norteamericano a la politica llevada a cabo por Bush demostrada mediante su reeleccion, los americanos no demuestran sino su arrogancia, prepotencia y su egoismo
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sKratch
01-11-2005, 01:28 PM
Si todos los paises fueran iguales ante la ley, si todos los paises tuvieran el mismo poder, si todos los paises tuvieran las mismas oportunidades y no hubiera estas politicas capitalistas y globalizadoras, el mundo seria un lugar mejor y mas justo... esto concierne a todos los gobiernos del mundo, unos lo hacen mejor que otros, pero el que va en camino contrario para conseguir la igualdad mundial y la paz mundial es EEUU, de eso no me cabe duda, y con el apoyo de la mayoria del pueblo norteamericano a la politica llevada a cabo por Bush demostrada mediante su reeleccion, los americanos no demuestran sino su arrogancia, prepotencia y su egoismo
Not really arrogance... it's more a matter of ignorance and apathy; only between %50-%60 of the nation voted, and Bush narrowly won. So you can't say that the US as a whole is at fault for the re-election of Bush.

Moose
01-11-2005, 01:40 PM
is anyone else tired of pope? he hates americans (who knows if he ever met one,) says bush is the worst terrorist (i always found this claim stupid,) and he says obvious, but unrealistic things such as: the world would be better with no wars...he pretty much is just ignorant.

I mean basically just read his first post, there are more errors than I could mention and that I probably even realize.

sKratch
01-11-2005, 01:41 PM
English is not his first language.

wheelchairman
01-11-2005, 01:43 PM
Despite the fact that Moose is a retard, I agree with him about p0pe.

p0pe, One candidates opinion on Kyoto does not mean the election was about Kyoto, there was no discussion of Kyoto, I gaurantee you that. Or if there was, it would fill about 3 paragraphs of a side column next to a full page article on the victims of homosexual marriage.

Moose
01-11-2005, 01:51 PM
Despite the fact that Moose is a retard, I agree with him about p0pe.

p0pe, One candidates opinion on Kyoto does not mean the election was about Kyoto, there was no discussion of Kyoto, I gaurantee you that. Or if there was, it would fill about 3 paragraphs of a side column next to a full page article on the victims of homosexual marriage.


thank you ol' fucking great one.

pOpe
01-11-2005, 02:03 PM
is anyone else tired of pope?

If you are tired of me, go away, 'cause I started this thread and I'm going to write more messages
________
Glass pipe pictures (http://glasspipes.net/)

pOpe
01-11-2005, 02:06 PM
Not really arrogance... it's more a matter of ignorance and apathy; only between %50-%60 of the nation voted, and Bush narrowly won. So you can't say that the US as a whole is at fault for the re-election of Bush.

Are you saying that all these people who didn't vote are against Bush?? sorry but I don't belive what you say
________
RENT GUARANTEE FORUM (http://www.insurance-forums.org/rent-guarantee/)

Moose
01-11-2005, 02:09 PM
youve had this thread over a month, at least...ive rarely posted, if at all, i just had to say something...sorry to be another american to annoy you so much...how much do you hate me? kill me, i know you want to kill me, kill me, do it, do it, come on, im a terrorist, i didnt vote, so im also to blame, kill me. im american, I ill the world, kill me, do it before its too late. kill me.

Strider
01-11-2005, 02:11 PM
Are you saying that all these people who didn't vote are against Bush?? sorry but I don't belive what you say

Not necessarily, but it's a possibility, don't you think?

pOpe
01-11-2005, 02:12 PM
youve had this thread over a month, at least...ive rarely posted, if at all, i just had to say something...sorry to be another american to annoy you so much...how much do you hate me? kill me, i know you want to kill me, kill me, do it, do it, come on, im a terrorist, i didnt vote, so im also to blame, kill me. im american, I ill the world, kill me, do it before its too late. kill me.

No, you are an stupid and an arrogant.... I'm against kill people and I'm against death sentence....
________
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Strider
01-11-2005, 02:13 PM
youve had this thread over a month, at least...ive rarely posted, if at all, i just had to say something...sorry to be another american to annoy you so much...how much do you hate me? kill me, i know you want to kill me, kill me, do it, do it, come on, im a terrorist, i didnt vote, so im also to blame, kill me. im american, I ill the world, kill me, do it before its too late. kill me.

You didn't vote...but I suppose you're against bush and his terrorist policy. If so, you're to be blamed only because your opinion didn't count in order to revert this situation, since you didn't vote. That is, there's nothing wrong with being American. Just watch out for those with the power of the govt.

pOpe
01-11-2005, 02:15 PM
Not necessarily, but it's a possibility, don't you think?
Maybe, but it's not probably that ALL of these people are agaisnt Bush
________
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Moose
01-11-2005, 02:19 PM
You didn't vote...but I suppose you're against bush and his terrorist policy. If so, you're to be blamed only because your opinion didn't count in order to revert this situation, since you didn't vote.

actually i agree with the war on terror, i disagree with the wat on iraq...but kerry wouldnt have changed anything, he didnt even make up his mind on many issues...both candidates were weak, and i live in new york, so my vote didnt count anyway.

Strider
01-11-2005, 02:22 PM
actually i agree with the war on terror, i disagree with the wat on iraq...but kerry wouldnt have changed anything, he didnt even make up his mind on many issues...both candidates were weak, and i live in new york, so my vote didnt count anyway.

Oh pardon me, I forgot your election system is different from mine.

pOpe
01-11-2005, 02:24 PM
Well, I never said that kerry would be a good president
________
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wtf_mate?
01-13-2005, 08:26 PM
Good, then you have some intelligence inside of you...

wtf_mate?
01-13-2005, 08:27 PM
wtf mate- you're an idiot too if you think Bush is an honest nice guy.

Until someone can provide some actual honest PROOF and EVIDENCE basing this claim, instead of the usual rumor-bidden propaganda...he is a fucking saint.

SkunkIt
01-13-2005, 09:30 PM
Until someone can provide some actual honest PROOF and EVIDENCE basing this claim, instead of the usual rumor-bidden propaganda...he is a fucking saint.
Watch the Rock Against bush DVD vol.1 (The green CD) Remember Enron? Remember how in the election lots of people's voted weren’t counted? Remember how this year in the election there were dead votes? Remember hoe osama turned into saddam? Remember how bush handled the environmental problems? Remember how bush went on vacation golfing while the war just started a while ago?

Moose
01-13-2005, 09:37 PM
Watch the Rock Against bush DVD vol.1 (The green CD) Remember Enron? Remember how in the election lots of people's voted weren’t counted? Remember how this year in the election there were dead votes? Remember hoe osama turned into saddam? Remember how bush handled the environmental problems? Remember how bush went on vacation golfing while the war just started a while ago?


eh hem...voter fraud always occurs on both sides and will always occur...so everyone is at fault there...and umm the real reason i wantedto respond was when did osama turn into saddam...im assuming you mean how he made saddam look like a terrorist...it just sounded a bit weird. anyhow...bush isnt a saint...but the way the comment was said was quite funny...but kerry wouldnt have done anything good for this country either...we were and are fucked either way.

wtf_mate?
01-13-2005, 11:13 PM
Watch the Rock Against bush DVD vol.1 (The green CD) Remember Enron? Remember how in the election lots of people's voted weren’t counted? Remember how this year in the election there were dead votes? Remember hoe osama turned into saddam? Remember how bush handled the environmental problems? Remember how bush went on vacation golfing while the war just started a while ago?


Well, I WAS being sarcastic. But, in the tactics of Mr. Wheelchairman...

Here I Go...


Watch the Rock Against bush DVD vol.1 (The green CD)

Oh...that is some hard fuggin evidence right there. Hard.


Remember Enron?

Good call. When ever someone is elected to a position, make them dump all their stock down the drain. That is one amazing way to persuade people to run for president. Yeah! Robin Hood in 2008! And anyways, there is no actual evidence that there was a conspiracy due to the Enron-Cheney connection. Just some raw rumors.


Remember how in the election lots of people's voted weren’t counted?

Remember when the DNC lawyers gave each other high five when Samuel Vaughn's ballot was tossed into the trash? Yes...he was the one who saved lives at the USS Cole.


Remember how this year in the election there were dead votes?

Doesn't it suck when you lose by a shit load? Even if all the uncounted Ohio votes went to Kerry, he STILL would have lost. Way to not give up though. I am shedding tears for you right now.


Remember hoe osama turned into saddam?

Let us say, an FBI agent is hunting down a serial killer, but cant find him. During this investigation, another group of murders is commited by a different serial killer. They launch two separate investigations against both of the murderers. Using your tactic, we should say, "Fuck Iraq, let those dirty faggot innocent sons of bitches die. We are trying to catch a man that is cooped up in the mountains with 90% of his force dead. He has nothing but the same clothes he wears day in and day out, a few AK-47's, and a video camera. Maybe some postage stamps. He is SUCH a fucking threat...oh and by the way. Fuck the people Saddam is killing. Fuck them."


Remember how bush handled the environmental problems?

Yeah, 90% less calls about polluted air. Damn Bush.


Remember how bush went on vacation golfing while the war just started a while ago?

And what might you have done? Sat in your Oval Office all day watching the TV screen, seeing the war unfold? Yes...one of your top 6 reasons Bush is an asshole is...he played a game of golf. Damn him.

You must have seen Fahrenheit 9/11. That movie is so full of loopholes, even I could lay everything Michael Moore states in that movie face flat in the mud. Just try me. Also, you should see Fahrenhype 9/11. Good movie. And these are actually real experts. Not just some fat guy who I think I saw bowling at one point or another. Oh! He was bowling! He must be right!

Seriously people.

wheelchairman
01-14-2005, 02:36 AM
Don't ever say you are copying my tactics you miserable excuse for a debater.


Good call. When ever someone is elected to a position, make them dump all their stock down the drain. That is one amazing way to persuade people to run for president. Yeah! Robin Hood in 2008! And anyways, there is no actual evidence that there was a conspiracy due to the Enron-Cheney connection. Just some raw rumors.
The entire first half of this paragraph, is completely irrelevant. The entire second half ignores how the Bush administration has close amicable ties to Ken Lay (you remember him yes?). For a company, as miserable as Enron was at the time, for the government to even touch it, is bizarre.


Doesn't it suck when you lose by a shit load? Even if all the uncounted Ohio votes went to Kerry, he STILL would have lost. Way to not give up though. I am shedding tears for you right now.
This is the smallest victory in presidential history.


Let us say, an FBI agent is hunting down a serial killer, but cant find him. During this investigation, another group of murders is commited by a different serial killer. They launch two separate investigations against both of the murderers. Using your tactic, we should say, "Fuck Iraq, let those dirty faggot innocent sons of bitches die. We are trying to catch a man that is cooped up in the mountains with 90% of his force dead. He has nothing but the same clothes he wears day in and day out, a few AK-47's, and a video camera. Maybe some postage stamps. He is SUCH a fucking threat...oh and by the way. Fuck the people Saddam is killing. Fuck them."
Great, why don't we investigate who is funding the Columbian death squads? Saddam hadn't hurt anybody in any severe way since the early 90's, taking him out for humanitarian reasons is the worst excuse for a lie ever. Especially since we had countries like Uzbekistan help take him out, what are we stupid? Wouldn't that directly blow our cover for being peace-loving?


And what might you have done? Sat in your Oval Office all day watching the TV screen, seeing the war unfold? Yes...one of your top 6 reasons Bush is an asshole is...he played a game of golf. Damn him.

You must have seen Fahrenheit 9/11. That movie is so full of loopholes, even I could lay everything Michael Moore states in that movie face flat in the mud. Just try me. Also, you should see Fahrenhype 9/11. Good movie. And these are actually real experts. Not just some fat guy who I think I saw bowling at one point or another. Oh! He was bowling! He must be right!
He's the commander in chief retard, it's his job to run the war.

Moose
01-14-2005, 07:57 AM
Just to comment on one thing. Even if there is no solid evidence that saddam had recently been killing off and hurting people, he still killed many people, and that is a timeless crime, which one can be punished for at anytime...i still feel he was hurting people and taking out potential threats all the time in the 90's and up to recently...they he was a very paranoid man, im sure he had to kill a few others he thought were out to get him. he isnt exactly the nicest guy...but im just commenting on that, of course there arent too many practical reasons of why this war ever should have taken place. but as far as the war on terror, that i feel is necessary. We must show some action and try to break down these terrorist groups and at least make things difficult for them. If someone close to me died in that attack, id want to go and take those bastards out as well...but the iraq war and the war on terror are two totally different issues and two totally different wars...i think some people miss that point.

wheelchairman
01-14-2005, 08:29 AM
The war on terror is impossible. It's foolishness from the start, we are trying to kill an idea by killing people, this is a time-tested method that failed every time.

I would say there are worse criminals in the US than Saddam. Henry Kissinger for example, when he is arrested and put on trial, then I will also cheer when Saddam is put on trial and gets his inevitable execution.

pOpe
01-14-2005, 08:33 AM
he still killed many people, and that is a timeless crime, which one can be punished for at anytime...

I agree with you in that... now tell me, when Bush, Blair, Aznar and Sharon will be punished?? because I think that law should be the same for all people
________
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RXP
01-14-2005, 10:09 AM
Don't ever say you are copying my tactics you miserable excuse for a masturbater.


Corrected...

Moose
01-14-2005, 01:51 PM
I agree with you in that... now tell me, when Bush, Blair, Aznar and Sharon will be punished?? because I think that law should be the same for all people

sorry to tell you that although you may not see it as one, this is a war.

wheelchairman
01-14-2005, 05:15 PM
sorry to tell you that although you may not see it as one, this is a war.
All of Saddam's deaths happened with reason of war.

pOpe
01-14-2005, 05:34 PM
sorry to tell you that although you may not see it as one, this is a war.
a war... yes, and in wars many people die..... but why have to die innocent people? I don't know how many people have died, and I don't know how many of these people were innocent, but I know that the leaders who'd started the war are not innocent, and they should be punished. Do you know that american's army has killed more people than any terrorist group? and do you know that american's army has killed more people than Saddam? Do you know that George W. Bush has killed more people than Saddam?? Why Saddam has to be punished and why Bush can be free???

All lifes have the same value, remember that (value? sorry, I don't know the right word, please tell me and I'll correct that)
________
FIESTA RS TURBO (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Ford_Fiesta_RS_Turbo)

Moose
01-14-2005, 05:40 PM
All of Saddam's deaths happened with reason of war.

then what's the excuse for the rape and torture chambers?

pOpe
01-14-2005, 05:42 PM
then what's the excuse for the rape and torture chambers?
Saddam's torture or american's torture?
________
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SkunkIt
01-14-2005, 05:50 PM
eh hem...voter fraud always occurs on both sides and will always occur...so everyone is at fault there...and umm the real reason i wantedto respond was when did osama turn into saddam...im assuming you mean how he made saddam look like a terrorist...it just sounded a bit weird. anyhow...bush isnt a saint...but the way the comment was said was quite funny...but kerry wouldnt have done anything good for this country either...we were and are fucked either way.

I don't like Kerry either, cause i'm an anarchist, but anything's better than bush.

Moose
01-14-2005, 05:58 PM
Saddam's torture or american's torture?

i was replying to wcm...i was talking about saddam...from what i know we dont put people in rape chambers here in america...but then again maybe im just blind to it.

wheelchairman
01-14-2005, 06:15 PM
then what's the excuse for the rape and torture chambers?
Rape chambers is probably a lie, and Americans use torture as well as Israel and most countries in the world today.

lousyskater
01-14-2005, 06:26 PM
i was replying to wcm...i was talking about saddam...from what i know we dont put people in rape chambers here in america...but then again maybe im just blind to it.

you obviously haven't been keeping up with news on the prisoner abuse going on in the army right now.

wtf_mate?
01-16-2005, 02:13 AM
The entire first half of this paragraph, is completely irrelevant.

Actually I was talking about the significant rights you have to being a shareholder WHILE also being in office.


This is the smallest victory in presidential history.

Sorry buddy, wrong again. In 2000, President Bush actually LOST the popular vote, but won the electoral college vote. Some people say he cheated. But...again...lack of proof has been a serious retraction in the Democratic party since.

And, The election this year was the first time since 1984 that a president won the majority of the votes. Again...you guys can't turn your back on this one.


Saddam hadn't hurt anybody in any severe way since the early 90's

And this is a reason Saddam should have remained in power? Too fucking bad.


He's the commander in chief retard, it's his job to run the war.

The last time a president actually ran a war, was in Vietnam. Yeah...Johnson. And we got caught with our pants down. And you think President Bush is making all the calls in Fallujah? Nasiryah? Baghdad? I don't think so. Try Tommy Franks, and General Myers. Man, I was wrong about you. You think President Bush's job as the commander in chief of this nation is to cancel all of his tee times because we are at war? What could he do to please you? Punch out hey hey U.S.A. pushups while humming the Star Spangled Banner while watching CBS all day? Or, maybe he should just pull a "Johnson" and reenact the no fire regulations of that time. Man wcm, you're a fucking genius.

wtf_mate?
01-16-2005, 02:16 AM
All of Saddam's deaths happened with reason of war.

Yeah, those damn kids were gonna rise against me. So...in an act of war...I stuck them in plastic shredders. Because...it was war. Um...did I mention this was an act of war?

wtf_mate?
01-16-2005, 02:17 AM
I don't like Kerry either, cause i'm an anarchist, but anything's better than bush.

Think about what you're saying you fucking retard.

wtf_mate?
01-16-2005, 02:19 AM
Rape chambers is probably a lie

Yes...because it proves that Saddam was a murderer...it must be a lie. You know...Saddam DID have sons?

wheelchairman
01-16-2005, 05:24 AM
Actually I was talking about the significant rights you have to being a shareholder WHILE also being in office.
That still doesn't make it relevant.




Sorry buddy, wrong again. In 2000, President Bush actually LOST the popular vote, but won the electoral college vote. Some people say he cheated. But...again...lack of proof has been a serious retraction in the Democratic party since.He didn't win the electoral college vote either. The proof is there, the black communities were disenfranchised, as were several jewish communities (both of these communities are typical democratic party vanguards). Although what really got Bush elected was the Supreme Court, there was nothing even remotely democratic about that. The electoral college is also a largely undemocratic institution as well.


And, The election this year was the first time since 1984 that a president won the majority of the votes. Again...you guys can't turn your back on this one.
Sure we can, people always keep their leaders during times of war. The fact that the demonstrations against Bush, are the largest they've been since the peak of Vietnam, is something you can't turn your back on.




And this is a reason Saddam should have remained in power? Too fucking bad.

Strawman argument, reply to my actual argument, instead of pretending you can answer it by ignoring it.



The last time a president actually ran a war, was in Vietnam. Yeah...Johnson. And we got caught with our pants down. And you think President Bush is making all the calls in Fallujah? Nasiryah? Baghdad? I don't think so. Try Tommy Franks, and General Myers. Man, I was wrong about you. You think President Bush's job as the commander in chief of this nation is to cancel all of his tee times because we are at war? What could he do to please you? Punch out hey hey U.S.A. pushups while humming the Star Spangled Banner while watching CBS all day? Or, maybe he should just pull a "Johnson" and reenact the no fire regulations of that time. Man wcm, you're a fucking genius.
Do you think Roosevelt just twiddled his thumbs and let his commanders run the war? Cause technically that was the last real war America was in. Vietnam was never officially a war, an excuse which really helps us save face when we say we never lost.

Bush is the man responsible for all military actions in Iraq, this is his job as commander in Chief, it makes no difference if the day-to-day work has been delegated to someone else. It is his responsibility.
And your use of sarcasm is truly miserable, try to make it more coherent next time.


Yeah, those damn kids were gonna rise against me. So...in an act of war...I stuck them in plastic shredders. Because...it was war. Um...did I mention this was an act of war? You support the war, and yet you ignore the killing of women and children by American soldiers. It's really no different. It's just a crime when Saddam does it.



Yes...because it proves that Saddam was a murderer...it must be a lie. You know...Saddam DID have sons?
Why do you think I support Saddam? Why do you think that I think he wasn't a murderer?
I'm just using an ounce of logic, and not believing every ridiculous thing the media tells me. Let's see, a fiercely morally conservative ideology like Ba'athism, supporting rape? Not likely. That's a lie. There is nothing we can prove about Saddam's sons since they were killed (in defiance of Geneva Convention).

The more you use "wcm ur st00pid" as an argument, the more it will show others that you have no real arguments, that your logic is flawed, and that your debate technique is utter incompetence.

pOpe
01-16-2005, 05:38 AM
The only thing that is clear is that american soldiers kill many people, and Saddam killed many people... the difference is that with Saddam people have houses, water, schools etc, and with american soldiers they don't have nothing
________
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wtf_mate?
01-17-2005, 12:24 PM
That still doesn't make it relevant.


He didn't win the electoral college vote either. The proof is there, the black communities were disenfranchised, as were several jewish communities (both of these communities are typical democratic party vanguards). Although what really got Bush elected was the Supreme Court, there was nothing even remotely democratic about that. The electoral college is also a largely undemocratic institution as well.


Sure we can, people always keep their leaders during times of war. The fact that the demonstrations against Bush, are the largest they've been since the peak of Vietnam, is something you can't turn your back on.




Strawman argument, reply to my actual argument, instead of pretending you can answer it by ignoring it.


Do you think Roosevelt just twiddled his thumbs and let his commanders run the war? Cause technically that was the last real war America was in. Vietnam was never officially a war, an excuse which really helps us save face when we say we never lost.

Bush is the man responsible for all military actions in Iraq, this is his job as commander in Chief, it makes no difference if the day-to-day work has been delegated to someone else. It is his responsibility.
And your use of sarcasm is truly miserable, try to make it more coherent next time.

You support the war, and yet you ignore the killing of women and children by American soldiers. It's really no different. It's just a crime when Saddam does it.



Why do you think I support Saddam? Why do you think that I think he wasn't a murderer?
I'm just using an ounce of logic, and not believing every ridiculous thing the media tells me. Let's see, a fiercely morally conservative ideology like Ba'athism, supporting rape? Not likely. That's a lie. There is nothing we can prove about Saddam's sons since they were killed (in defiance of Geneva Convention).

The more you use "wcm ur st00pid" as an argument, the more it will show others that you have no real arguments, that your logic is flawed, and that your debate technique is utter incompetence.


That still doesn't make it relevant.

The discussion at the time was on Cheney's connection, through stock shares, to the Halliburton corporation. So, it is relevant. Go back a few pages and begin reading.


He didn't win the electoral college vote either.

Yes...actually...he did.

wheelchairman
01-17-2005, 02:51 PM
You cannot merely answer a part of my reply, and believe you have negated my opinions. That is a strawman fallacy.

Madhouse
01-18-2005, 12:58 PM
Bush is an IDIOT.He couldn't rule a country if the instruction book fell on his head(if he knows what an instruction book is).

pOpe
01-18-2005, 04:06 PM
yeah, and he didn't die through the fault of a bisquit miracolously :D
________
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wtf_mate?
01-19-2005, 10:31 AM
I had to go to class. I will complete my reply to wcms post when I get back. It is not a complete post.

Madhouse
01-20-2005, 04:44 AM
Bush should go back home to his little mummy in Texas(by the way Texas seems to have a wonderful landscape:sand,sand,sand and, oh petrol reffinerys,just wonderful :D )

pOpe
01-20-2005, 09:05 AM
I had to go to class. I will complete my reply to wcms post when I get back. It is not a complete post.
We are waiting.... I want to see what you have to say
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