View Full Version : Remember when people cried about the pre-pregnant thing?
07-28-2006, 11:51 AM
I hate when the Government makes comments that imply I'm an incubator. It'd be much better if they just drugged our food and said nothing.
07-28-2006, 11:53 AM
I'm glad I live in a socialist paradise where women aren't retards. Unless they are feminists.
07-28-2006, 12:06 PM
Don't be ridiculous, comrade. Women are stupid everywhere.
07-28-2006, 12:14 PM
Hell, I don't mind them adding drugs to food if... y'know, they've already trialed it for more than eight years. And those trials didn't have alarmingly mixed results.
But as for your solution, what is it? Give each nigger ten thousand dollars?
07-28-2006, 12:52 PM
Well, yeah, there's the thing. Education and jobs would be a wonderful thing to bring the communities. Really, it would. And the government is trying. But really, what can they do? Short of clapping the kids into irons and forcing them to school at bayonet-point, there's not a lot they can do. The kids don't show up because they don't care. Because they're braindamaged from sniffing. Because they run away from their drunken parents who rape and bash them constantly. The sad fact is that the most education the average aboriginal kid will get is in a state institution, surrounded by other aboriginal kids who'll rape and bash them.
And as for jobs, Jesus. It's not like the government isn't trying to get aboriginals off welfare. How do they go about it? Cut off their welfare benefits? Assign them jobs and threaten them with jailtime if they don't work them? Put them in Soviet Gulag? I'll admit that in some of the communities there aren't any jobs to be had, but in the cities, there are plenty. And the aboriginals simply won't do them. They end up begging and mugging people instead. I mean, short of Stalin's approach to the gypsies, it's an impossibility to get the majority of this generation aboriginals working. The only hope is to educate the children, which is an impossibility because their unemployed drunken rapist parents won't work.
I mean, I agree that something needs to be done about the poverty. The government agrees. The Aboriginal Elders agree. Everyone agrees. But it's not as simple as 'fixing' it. Nobody has the slightest clue of how to go about fixing it, and there really is no easy answer. Add this to the fact that some elders are claiming there should be more welfare for aboriginals, some elders are claiming there should be less, some are claiming there should be none, some are claiming Aboriginals need to be given their pride back by being allowed to live under traditional Tribal Law, others are complaining that under Tribal Law 8-year old 'wives' are being raped, beaten and tortured by the tribesmen with legal immunity. I mean, shit. It's a fucking mess. And to top it all off, some of the communities are in literal anarchy (http://bulletin.ninemsn.com.au/Bulletin/EdDesk.nsf/All/6D71C6A2570B7DC5CA256E2F007A6745) and the government would need to declare war and carpet-bomb them before any form of social welfare could be brought in.
Basically, all I'm trying to say is ; you don't have an answer. I don't have an answer, the Government doesn't have an answer, the elders don't have an answer. Nobody has an answer. And it's quite possible that there isn't one to be had.
07-28-2006, 12:52 PM
They're trying to solve the problem of neural tube defects in children by doing this. Who's going to come out in favor of babies having birth defects? But this problem could be solved *permanently*, without adding shit to anything, by doing something about the ridiculous poverty of the aboriginals they're pretending to worry so much about.
So you're saying that instead of saving three-hundred people a year from a debilitating birth defect through a cheap method that, as a side effect, gives everyone else a minor vitamin infusion, is a bad idea? And that it shouldn't be done and instead they should embark on a campaign to reverse the conditions of a downtrodden minority, a project of such unbelievably high cost and dubious outcome (when has pulling a race of people out of poverty been either cheap or effective) that it almost certainly won't occur? You're being a bit ridiculous.
Seriously Sarah, I want to see you make your argument against it without writing it off as too hard. As an analogy, the US Senate is currently trying to restrict access to "social networking" sites because they say pedophiles can use them to prey on children. I'm not in favor of pedophiles raping little girls, but I can still argue my position. I don't want to get off on that subject - I'm just saying that you *can* argue tough positions if you truly believe them to be right.
07-28-2006, 12:59 PM
Experience overseas, particularly in the US and Canada where bread fortification has been happening since 1998, show significant decreases in spina bifida. But the same set of figures, obtained from the Centres for Disease Control, also show an upsurge in anencephalus.
I'm not big on being a lab rat. I realise I'm not gonna get anencephalus from this, but the fact that they're still studying the outcome and not even sure whether it raises or reduces the risk of rectal cancer (I'm not big on the idea of rectal cancer, incidently) isn't exactly making me happy about having them putting supplements in my bread.
And I especially don't want to be a lab rat because the government is too afraid to apply solutions to female problems solely on females, and instead forces them on people who don't need them. And you can repeat my last sentence, substituting 'females' with 'niggers' as well.
07-28-2006, 01:49 PM
So we have the problem of poverty so soul-crushing that there is nothign else to do but rape and pillage, etc. Or, that there just isn't anything to do but bone. Tons of kids produced through this, which only perpetuates the cycle--not enough money to support oneself let along a army of unwanted bastards. How about making birth control available for free? It'd certainly stem the tide of babies, thereby also solving the problem of babies born with spina bifida.
I realise this 'free birth control' is some amazingly persistant fixation you have, that you seem to bring up in every argument about anything, but you should probably take closer note of where it doesn't apply. We already give the aboriginals free birth control. They don't use it because having more kids = more welfare money.
Failing that, let's just blow up everyone we don't know what to do with.
I realise you're being facetious, but if the damned English didn't get in our way 120 years ago the Aboriginal people would have been saved a lot of misery.
Yes, I am saying that. Pulling an entire ethnic group out of poverty makes about as much sense and pumping an entire country full of folate to save 300 kids in a country of millions.
Great. Again, tell us how to do that. You're still coming out with ideas to fix things and not making the slightest suggestion of how they might be fixed. Fix poverty! Great, how do we do that? Give them education and jobs! Great, how do we do that? With free birth control!
Seriously though, try to argue Mota Boy's point. You're saying that we should just up and do something that might be possible, even though nobody has the slightest clue of how to go about doing it. That's your argument against this folate thing. Either come up with a viable idea for fixing the problem, or admit you don't have all the answers and concede the damn point to him.
07-28-2006, 03:32 PM
I'm sorry, we were arguing over actual answers? I don't have to have a viable solution planned out to point out that this folate nonsense is a smokescreen for a government beside itself with futility. I said that to say 'fix poverty' makes as much sense as 'pump them full of folate'--not that I knew how to do it.
Well, since you said ; and I quote ; 'this problem could be solved permanantly by doing something about the poverty' I assumed you had some sort of idea lined up. Since you're apparantly as clueless as me and my goverment are, perhaps you should come to terms with the fact that maybe the problem can't be solved anytime in the near future ; and that's why they're trying to get folate into as many potential childbearers as possible. Not as a 'fix', as more of a 'crutch' for a problem that may or may not be fixable.
I mean, shit, you've basically said "That's a stupid idea, they should just fix the problem instead.". Well hell, they should fix a lot of things. UN Peacekeepers are a stupid idea, they should just fix the war between Lebanon and Israel. And solar power? That's stupid, they should fix the greenhouse effect instead. And giving illegal aliens citizenship amnesties? Stupid, they should just fix the illegal immigration problems.
What I'm saying is that it is fucking retarded to fixate on a single vitamin as a political fix to what is a socioeconomic problem.
No more retarded than fixating on free contraception as a political fix to... well, to just about everything.
But seriously, they're not fixating on folate as a blanket solution to ALL the problems. Just ONE problem. I'll agree that putting it in everyone's diet is fucking retarded. And I'll agree that it's a socioeconomic problem. But apparantly it does fix a problem, and it's great the government want to lower public healthcare costs by preventing horrible birth defects. The problem, as I see it, is that they're too westernised and vaginated to do things like... oh, I don't know, giving them to the aboriginal communities in pill form. Or even something as simple as reccomending all women take it, whether pregnant or not ; which is apparantly massively offensive. Because people complain about any kind of discrimination out there, we're ALL gonna get pumped full of supplements ; in unmonitered dosage ; because the government is too weak and pathetic to single out the people who actually need them. Your government has been plying you with folate in this way for eight years to stop birth deformities, and it still comes under fire for reccomending women of childbearing age take it in monitored dosage. It's madness.
07-29-2006, 05:12 AM
There are all kinds of reasons to recommend people keep up with their folate. It's excellent to support heart health, for instance. But no, they have to specify that it's for teh babiez.
Because in this case, it is for teh babiez. Seriously, where's the problem there? They're not trying to reduce heart failure, they're trying to reduce birth defects.
How about looking into community-based programs to create a definition of masculinity that has nothing to do with 'knocking up bitches'?
Hold on there... firstly, they've already tried that. Secondly, this isn't about the man's desire to knock up bitches. This is because they get more welfare the more kids they have. They have a baby a year, throw their one-year-old to the older kids to look after, and start breastfeeding the newborn. The one-year-old ends up malnutritioned and spends about 9 months of the year in hospital until it's about ten ; which the government pays for. And it also pays the family extra welfare for having the kids, despite the fact that the government is paying amazing amounts to feed them and keep them alive. I agree that its a flawed system, but where's the solution?
Just because *I* don't know the answers for *how* to do things doesn't mean that if I or anyone else had an idea, someone else won't have any idea how to execute it.
But you're still working on the premise that there is a better idea out there, so we should scrap the folate idea. There almost certainly isn't. You're holding your breath and wanting to veto the ideas they have in the hope of something better that may never come around. The only solution that has even come close to looking like working (and I'm talking about the Stolen Generation here, not the genocide) are considered a national shame and we even have a National Sorry Day to apologise for it.
The bandaid solutions aren't a fix. They're bandaid solutions, nothing more. But when we don't have a cure, we need all the bandaids we can get.
Birth control is a socioeconomic issue, not a political one, and I reserve the right to feel disgust at governments pushing political bandaids instead of discussing the real issue. The embarassment that this is even an issue is like the elephant in the room for these people.
It's not 'the real issue' here. At all. The only way you'll get free contraceptives to the aboriginals is the Indira Ghandi method. And that's not going to happen because then people would whine about human rights abuses.
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