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StayInTheHouseCarl
12-21-2004, 09:36 PM
what do you guys think about celebrities speaking out about their opinions? i know there's a lot of people that get irked by it, and think that these people should shut up and play or act, or etc.
everyone has an opinion, and everyone can speak their mind, famous or not. i think people get mad that the famous get easier access to speak their mind, but they can help speak for us.

"when i picked up my guitar, i didnt put down my citizenship" tom morrello

the original pyro
12-21-2004, 09:48 PM
It's a shame that two years ago anyone who said anything remotely nonsuportive about the bush regime, even if factually true, was viewed as unpatriotic and therfor faced horrible criticism. As a mucisian, you should have something to say anyway.

Noodles
12-21-2004, 10:12 PM
I think that everyone in a band should just shut the fuck up. Especially if they are going to try to get me to question my world view. Can't they see that everything in the world is just peachy? If my country does it then it can't be wrong, unless it comes out of my pocketbook in the form of taxes. That's what being a patriot means, right?

shatskater
12-21-2004, 10:30 PM
I think that everyone in a band should just shut the fuck up. Especially if they are going to try to get me to question my world view. Can't they see that everything in the world is just peachy? If my country does it then it can't be wrong, unless it comes out of my pocketbook in the form of taxes. That's what being a patriot means, right?

Although I like you alot Noodles I disagree. This world isn't peachy and the country...your country as you put it isn't doing it's job. It is doing the opposite. Being a patriot doesn't mean being a geinuy pig of the government. It is doing your role as a citizen to make the country better not just for you but for everyone. And that cannot be achieved with this government.

ShutUpYouFuckingMime
12-21-2004, 10:42 PM
Although I like you alot Noodles I disagree. This world isn't peachy and the country...your country as you put it isn't doing it's job. It is doing the opposite. Being a patriot doesn't mean being a geinuy pig of the government. It is doing your role as a citizen to make the country better not just for you but for everyone. And that cannot be achieved with this government.

I think he was being sarcastic, yo.

shatskater
12-21-2004, 10:44 PM
oh, i dunno lets see if he will post here and find out.

Tired_Of_You
12-21-2004, 10:44 PM
It was funny. Especially if shatskater thought it was true.

shatskater
12-21-2004, 10:45 PM
ya its a shame, i should stop comeing in the middle of a convo.

Betty
12-21-2004, 11:26 PM
Okay, this is a theory, and I feel I have to say it... please don't attack me too much.

So, generally a difference between republicans and democrats is that republicans know the value of money. This is of course in the economic sense and does not have to do with the more moral/social issues. This can be argued all you want, and yes there are some/many republicans that are just brought up that way and don't really question why they think the way they do.

Anyway, if you look at groups of people that are strongly democratic you've got: celebrities (musicians, actors, etc), professors (I'm thinking more arts/humanities), punkrockers, media, college students...

And so what do these groups have in common... well... celebrities have been able to be very successful in doing what they love. They may not see the full value of their money and the hard work it takes for some people to earn it. You can argue that they face hardships as well all you want, I realize that, but it's still different I think. College students have still not really had to take care of themselves yet and also may not realize the value of money. I don't know, I just see some hypocrisy in it I guess. I think many of their hearts are in the right place, but that they are very idealistic. I respect those who truly practice what they preach and those who are truly selfless in their way of life. That is amazing and inspiring.

RXP
12-22-2004, 12:11 AM
Betty, marry me?

So fucking true what you said.

Noodles
12-22-2004, 12:23 AM
Yeah, I suppose I would really appreciate how hard-earned my money was if I only I was born in the House of Bush. Those thirteen years I spent as a janitor didn't teach me a damn thing about just how important money really is, even though I worked like a dog for relatively little of it.

RXP
12-22-2004, 12:35 AM
Talking generally dude, your views do change once you start rolling in the money and forget where you came from. Not saying you do but the majority do*. College kids are fucking stupid mostly idealist fucks.



*IMHO of course.

wheelchairman
12-22-2004, 05:02 AM
That's odd though, since the majority of musicians (and painters too I believe) are left wing. And the same I think can be said of painters. Don't know about movie stars or anything, but I'd guess that the trend continues.

I mean even in country music (the Dixie Chicks) which is notoriously redneck.

And Shatskater, you made my day.

RonWelty
12-22-2004, 05:20 AM
Yeah, I suppose I would really appreciate how hard-earned my money was if I only I was born in the House of Bush. Those thirteen years I spent as a janitor didn't teach me a damn thing about just how important money really is, even though I worked like a dog for relatively little of it.
now u earn a lot of it and work in one thing u really like ! thatīs good life ...HEY THATīs the american dream! HEY can i enter in it too? :p :cool:

StayInTheHouseCarl
12-22-2004, 06:39 AM
there are some republican punks, look at joe escalante.

most politicians didint have to have the crap jobs when they were a kid, and i'd like to see george bush clean up kids puke, or work as a character at disneyland, (like me). and they'd learn the real value of a dollar damn quick. :)

StayInTheHouseCarl
12-22-2004, 06:41 AM
but until then, i guess billions of dollars will be wasted on a war we shouldnt have started, instead of healthcare, education, and social security. god bless america.

Noodles is gay
12-22-2004, 06:46 AM
'God bless America'

*snigger*


I love it. :D

SicN Twisted
12-22-2004, 10:10 AM
I don't think spending billions of dollars on unneccesarily beefing up the military constitutes knowing the value of money.

the original pyro
12-22-2004, 02:33 PM
I don't think spending billions of dollars on unneccesarily beefing up the military constitutes knowing the value of money.

when you consider how important the military is to our economy, yes it does.

Betty
12-22-2004, 09:02 PM
I agree that those who are born into rich families (e.g. many politicians) may not appreciate the value of hard-earned money either, but that the republican system just benefits them more. That's not cool.

Noodles, you would fall into both the "punkrocker" and "celebrity musician" category. I think I would respect some "punkrockers" or other types of indie musicians more than many of the others mentionned because they are generally struggling to earn money, content with making little of it, and a lot will actively do things to support their fellow human being. However some are just totally ignorant about what's going on... mostly the young 'uns ("fuck the president! go anarchy!" etc)

But like, so many super rich actor and musician celebrities preach on and on about helping the poor and the needy, etc... while they are raking in the dough and living the high life, and not doing anything to contribute themselves besides the occasional high profile charity event, etc. That just seems really hypocritical.

meaning_of_life
12-23-2004, 05:01 AM
i think famous people are allowed to have an opinion, but i think that they shouldnt use there profession to broadcast political views which are shoved down your throat. greendays single 'american idiot' pissed me off after a while, hearing billy joes political rant again and again on the radio. il forgive them though as the rest of the album was brilliant

Izie
12-23-2004, 11:10 AM
But like, so many super rich actor and musician celebrities preach on and on about helping the poor and the needy, etc... while they are raking in the dough and living the high life, and not doing anything to contribute themselves besides the occasional high profile charity event, etc. That just seems really hypocritical.

(Jesus)

That's hypocritical indeed, just like it's hypocritical to say you're going to bring democracy to Iraq and at the same time applaud new europe for their support (while the populations of those countries were against it).

Although how can you be so sure that those celebrities don't give anything besides those "high profile charity events" maybe they just want to do the right thing without getting attention for it like most people do.

Anyway about the famous giving their opinions, here's something Howard Zinn said about Michael Moore at the oscars. I pretty much agree with this:
This rule about not going outside the boundaries of one's profession is of great use to those in power. I have come up against it myself as a historian. I am supposed to talk just about history. When I showed up at the meeting of the American Historical Association in 1970 and proposed that we historians should speak out against the war in Vietnam, there was shock. "We're historians," people said. "We're supposed to talk about history and present our papers and leave politics to the politicians."

In the late eighteenth century, the French philosopher Jean Jacques Rousseau had something to say about this sort of abdication of social responsibility. He said, "We have all sorts of specialties; we have engineers, we have scientists, we have ministers, but we no longer have a citizen among us" -- that is to say, somebody who will go beyond his or her professional prison and take part in the battle for social justice.

The people who do break out of that prison, like Michael Moore, deserve an enormous amount of credit. Entertainers have the ability to reach far greater numbers of people than the rest of us do, and if they don't take advantage of it, they deprive us all of an opportunity for greater communication.

Noodles is gay
12-23-2004, 02:04 PM
I think that if famous people do make their opinions known it can have a very good influence on what they're trying to change. However, if they do it just for a publicity stunt, they should just shut the fuck up because it's not morally right.

Betty
12-24-2004, 12:32 AM
Yes, Jesus, I agree with you that they may do stuff that isn't high profile, etc, that they really want to do. Good point. But this can't apply to everyone.

Still, the issue does not sit right with me, and I've tried to explain it numerous times and just keep backspacing. So I guess I'll leave it for now. Just that an incredibly rich person preaching some of the things they do seems unsettling...

T-6005
12-24-2004, 01:16 AM
Having celebrities speak out about things they believe could cause other people to follow them... simply because they ARE celebrities.

I think it's great that famous people speak out for what they believe in, though, it kind of opens up the options when people really try to get the word out that there's a choice involved.

Although maybe ranting about the opposition isn't the way to do that.

Noodles
12-24-2004, 01:18 AM
Betty, incredibly rich people don't spout off as much as I do because it's easier to keep that money if you fly under the radar. I'm not part of that group. I don't have all that you might think I have. I don't live that differently than the way I was raised. I'm a lucky man, yes, but not as financially lucky as you seem to think. Nor have I ever touted what I've done, or not done, for other people, here or anywhere else. I merely treat this forum as a place to voice my opinion on matters that affect us all. If you, or anyone else, want to pigeon-hole me as somebody who can't or won't understand how you must struggle to live, then I can't argue with that. But you'd be wrong, I think. I just like spouting off here, and I appreciate a good argument way more than any kind of pat on the back. If you want to write me off just because I've been lucky enough to be successful, that's fine. But you shouldn't doubt my sincerity or good will until you have good reason to do so. Maybe you do, but if so I'd like to hear why?

I'm wondering if you are as skeptical towards Jessica Simpson and Kid Rock, known conservatives, as you seem to be towards us on the left.

RonWelty
12-24-2004, 01:31 AM
thatīs a good think that u , noodles , admit that you had and have lucky on your great success . many people ( ...me included.) when something good happens say ; " i am really good , iīm the one" (look to MOURINHO at CHELSEA FC) .. anyway that confirm your story that u are not like the rich fro, OC etc ...
to speak about the topic : rich people ARE NOT the famous people ..at least here in portugal ...so why just because they suck "zine directors cocks" to appear on some photos or because they fuck with other famous people , they have to give opinionS? OPINIOS ARE FOR THE people who knows what they talking about!

T-6005
12-24-2004, 01:38 AM
OPINIOS ARE FOR THE people who knows what they talking about!

That's not true, opinions are for anyone with a mouth and some air to spare.

celeen
12-24-2004, 02:33 AM
I think that everyone in a band should just shut the fuck up. Especially if they are going to try to get me to question my world view. Can't they see that everything in the world is just peachy? If my country does it then it can't be wrong, unless it comes out of my pocketbook in the form of taxes. That's what being a patriot means, right?

before saying anything else, i gotta say that you are just great!!! i can't talk about politics in america, it's not my country.i'm french.without any politician consideration, i also think that the world is peachy.talking 'bout france and its politics i'm quite scared, i got kids and i'm not sure that they're going to grow in a world they're gonna like, i think that dexter describes my thought well in "americana" by these lines " my rights are denied, by the least qualified.......". anyway, i think that everyone's untitled to have an opinion some are wrong, some are right, it depends who you're talkin to, but i think that arguing about politics is a waste of time, there are some things much better to do.

T-6005
12-24-2004, 02:35 AM
before saying anything else, i gotta say that you are just great!!! i can't talk about politics in america, it's not my country.i'm french.without any politician consideration, i also think that the world is peachy.talking 'bout france and its politics i'm quite scared, i got kids and i'm not sure that they're going to grow in a world they're gonna like, i think that dexter describes my thought well in "americana" by these lines " my rights are denied, by the least qualified.......". anyway, i think that everyone's untitled to have an opinion some are wrong, some are right, it depends who you're talkin to, but i think that arguing about politics is a waste of time, there are some things much better to do.

Je ne pense pas qu'il etait serieux.

Lullaby
12-24-2004, 04:06 AM
That's not true, opinions are for anyone with a mouth and some air to spare.

yep youre right.....

RonWelty
12-24-2004, 04:29 AM
yep youre right.....
i don īt think that stupid and "uninteligent " opinions count for anything !

Noodles is gay
12-24-2004, 04:37 AM
i don īt think that stupid and "uninteligent " opinions count for anything !

*Unintelligent

Every one is entitled to their own opinion, even if, in your view, it seems wrong. Unintelligent opinions are useless, especially if the owner is only doing it for attention, however, if it is what they believe they have a right to express it.

Freedom of speech, my friend.

Betty
12-25-2004, 04:38 PM
Noodles, not sure if you're gonna read this now, but I hope you do... Anyway, I'm not referring to you as one of the incredibly rich people, regardless of how rich you may be. I don't exactly know, but I'd imagine you live comfortably, although are not extremely rich or anything. Maybe I wasn't clear enough... I'm thinking more of the SUPER rich actors/actresses... you know... wearing the $100 000 dresses/suits, jewellery, expensive wine/food, etc, etc...

I totally respect your opinions and I think you voice them very well. I do not doubt your intentions in the least, as I do not doubt the intentions of many on the left, with certain exceptions of course. And I don't think people should think my intentions are bad either, although I'd imagine they do.

Based on most of what I've heard from you, your big beef is with the war, and I think that is a very valid thing to not support, I don't really support it either. Although economically, I may think differently than many on the left, it's not because I have bad intentions, it's simply because I think certain systems probably work better for most involved. And of course there is a little self interest... which may make me a little worse of a person, I'm not sure.

So yeah, again, I was never referring to you as one of these "rich and famous" people. You're actually one of the most fun, down to earth, and hilarious people I have had the opportunity to hang out with, and hopefully I will have that opportunity again someday.

Noodles is gay
12-25-2004, 04:41 PM
Noodles, not sure if you're gonna read this now, but I hope you do...

Why don't you just send him an email?

Imnotnoodles@fromtheoffspring.com

:D

Maria
12-26-2004, 10:31 AM
Why don't you just send him an email?

Imnotnoodles@fromtheoffspring.com

:D

Good one!
http://free-zg.htnet.hr/marias/lol.gif

nickspring-82
02-25-2005, 06:08 AM
Noodles posts on here, uber cool, and what he said, is said with far more wisdom and experience than anyone else here

p.s i wanna know which school is hiring a janitorial position set to lead into a music career :rolleyes: