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3.rockin.decades
11-28-2006, 09:44 AM
Okay, so the username sucks but suffice it to say I'm an old fart with a question.

I've been a fan of hard rock/heavy metal since the seventies.

I now find that I like current bands like The Offspring better than my old stuff but it sounds pretty similar to me. In other words, like heavy rock.

So my question is, why is this music referred to as punk?

The only difference I see in these guys music and the metal of my youth is that most of the current rockers don't have long hair and a few sport piercings.

We had punk in the '80's but it seems that was a lot different from The Offspring. I was always of the opinion that that punk was basically people looking weird and making noise.

Aren't The Offspring (and Breaking Benjamin and Three Days Grace, etc, etc) just the hard rockers of the day? What makes them "punk"?

Thanks for any opinions you might want to post.

Amiralanal
11-28-2006, 09:47 AM
they are not very punk

Evka.pl
11-28-2006, 10:18 AM
what's the point of naming the type of music offspring play. i mean, does it really matter if their music is regarded as punk or hard rock or whatever? defining their music is pointless (as long as they kick ass, look weird, make noise and are NOT green day, right? ;)

Hypodermic_89
11-28-2006, 12:00 PM
I consider The Offspring Alternative Rock/Kinda punk.

Grabbal
11-28-2006, 12:08 PM
I consider them Great music...

EMehl6
11-28-2006, 12:33 PM
Punk, by definition, is stripped down, sped up rock. People are probably going to yell at me and attack me for saying that, and tell me that punk has political and social lyrics, and a bunch of other garbage, but that's not true. So many bands that play punk do that now, so people think that it's just a part of punk rock. When you go back to begining of punk, it was started as a backlash to corporate music labels feeding the public crap for the sole purpose of profit, and many bands formed in response to this without the help of media and corporate music giants, creating what is now known as the "DIY", or do it yourself, technique, and made their own brand of raw, grimy rock, which evolved into punk. The rock that they played was as I said, raw and grimy, and stripped down to power chords, and the drumming was sped up, often played in 4/4 timing, and someone coined the word "punk" as a reference to this music. If you go back into the Offspring's history, they started and clawed their way to the top using the DIY technique and without the help of corporate giants, as they were on an Indie label. Today, they still play the power chord and sped up music, which is what punk essentially is, though they incorporate the elements of many other styles into their music, such as rock, metal, grunge, etc. I hope that helps.

Also, Breaking Benjamin and Three Days Grace aren't considered punk, just alternative rock/grunge.

Bazza
11-28-2006, 12:34 PM
Officially it's Nu-School Punk Rock,
Stuff like Sex Pistols is old school punk, although the stranglers and the clash are classified as punk, but aren't as loud, so I guess even in the past there wasn't a clear defining line between genres.

-=Xander=-
11-28-2006, 02:17 PM
I think its fair enough to say that the first albums like Smash, Ignition were punk and since then it has slowly progressed through the albums to become more of a alter-rock kinda think. Personally, I don't think there is much punk left in the music.

Llamas
11-28-2006, 02:34 PM
Officially it's Nu-School Punk Rock,
Officially? Please tell me where something OFFICIAL says this.

The reason they are considered punk is for the style of their music when they started. What they are now is probably just pop-punk. Punk is defined by being very simplistic. Purely powerchords are used, and most songs only use 3 chords. The drumlines and basslines are supposed be really simple and basic. Really, punk is something that anyone can do because the point was to be different from what was popular. It was to break away from the idea of classical, blues/jazz, disco, etc. Stuff that was really simple and different. The lyrics tended to be rebellious and angry, but I don't think that's necessary. To me, punk lies in the structure of the music, and the offspring's first three albums mostly fit into that idea.

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 02:35 PM
Punk, by definition, is stripped down, sped up rock. People are probably going to yell at me and attack me for saying that, and tell me that punk has political and social lyrics, and a bunch of other garbage, but that's not true. So many bands that play punk do that now, so people think that it's just a part of punk rock. When you go back to begining of punk, it was started as a backlash to corporate music labels feeding the public crap for the sole purpose of profit, and many bands formed in response to this without the help of media and corporate music giants, creating what is now known as the "DIY", or do it yourself, technique, and made their own brand of raw, grimy rock, which evolved into punk. The rock that they played was as I said, raw and grimy, and stripped down to power chords, and the drumming was sped up, often played in 4/4 timing, and someone coined the word "punk" as a reference to this music. If you go back into the Offspring's history, they started and clawed their way to the top using the DIY technique and without the help of corporate giants, as they were on an Indie label. Today, they still play the power chord and sped up music, which is what punk essentially is, though they incorporate the elements of many other styles into their music, such as rock, metal, grunge, etc. I hope that helps.

Also, Breaking Benjamin and Three Days Grace aren't considered punk, just alternative rock/grunge.



You're an idiot. There were a total of about three words in that passage that weren't horse-shit.

As for the original poster, they're not really a "punk rock" band anymore. They have their roots in that scene, but look at it this way: if you just think of the Offspring as a good rock band, nothing more nothing less, just a good solid high-quality modern rock band, you'll appreciate them all the more.

:) Nice to see their music is entertaining to the older crowd, too. Heh, my parents used to rock out to "Hit That" or "Original Prankster" once in a while, but I doubt they'd appreciate the more classic stuff.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 02:40 PM
MMM
I think they are still punk-rock, for the simple stuff on many of their songs (Da hui, Long way home, Never gonna find me, Lightning rod, Million Milles away, etc)

BUt they are great... and fuck, they are NO metal

nameless
11-28-2006, 02:48 PM
dexter once said "its not like we are in auhority as to what punk is, some people might not consider us punk and thats tottaly fine". as others have said, punk is what inspired them in the beginning but even the band wouldnt consider themselves punk these days!

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 02:58 PM
Nor should they. The best work they've ever done has been outside the punk boundaries ("Self Esteem", "Gone Away", "I Choose", "Pretty Fly", "The Kids Aren't Alright", "Defy You", "Million Miles Away", "Vultures", "Denial, Revisited", "Pay The Man", etc.)

HeadAroundU
11-28-2006, 02:59 PM
http://www.allmusic.com
The Offspring:
Alternative Pop/ Rock
Punk Revival
Post-Grunge
Punk-Pop

Punk
Punk Rock returned rock & roll to the basics — three chords and a simple melody. It just did it louder and faster and more abrasively than any other rock & roll in the past. Although there had been several bands to flirt with what became known as punk rock — including the garage rockers of the '60s and the Velvet Underground, the Stooges, and the New York Dolls — it wasn't until the mid-'70s that punk became its own genre. On both sides of the Atlantic, young bands began forsaking the sonic excesses that distinguished mainstream hard rock and stripping the music down to its essentials. In New York, the first punk band was the Ramones; in London, the first punk band was the Sex Pistols. Although the bands had different agendas and sounds — the Ramones were faster and indebted to bubblegum, while the Pistols played Faces riffs sloppier and louder than the Faces themselves — the direct approach of the bands revolutionized music in both the U.K. and the U.S. In America, punk remained an underground sensation, eventually spawning the hardcore and indie-rock scenes of the '80s, but in the UK, it was a full-scale phenomenon. In the U.K., the Sex Pistols were thought of as a serious threat to the well-being of the government and monarchy, but more importantly, they caused countless bands to form. Some of the bands stuck close to the Pistols' original blueprint, but many found their own sound, whether it was the edgy pop of the Buzzcocks, the anthemic, reggae-informed rock of the Clash, or the arty experiments of Wire and Joy Division. Soon, punk splintered into post-punk (which was more experimental and artier than punk), new wave (which was more pop-oriented), and hardcore, which simply made punk harder, faster, and more abrasive. Throughout the '80s, punk was identified with the hardcore scenes in both America and England. In the early '90s, a wave of punk revivalists — led by Green Day and Rancid — emerged from the American underground. The new wave of punk rockers followed the same template as the original punks, but they tended to incorporate elements of heavy metal into their sound.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 03:01 PM
Nor should they. The best work they've ever done has been outside the punk boundaries ("Self Esteem", "Gone Away", "I Choose", "Pretty Fly", "The Kids Aren't Alright", "Defy You", "Million Miles Away", "Vultures", "Denial, Revisited", "Pay The Man", etc.)

Self Esteem sux (musically) all the way... fuking grunge-nirvana sound

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 03:08 PM
Yeah? Well Mariachi bands suck too, Rodriguez.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 03:09 PM
Yeah? Well Mariachi bands suck too, Rodriguez.

Mariachi rules... you get ladies in that way. Boomerangs sux

Grunge sux

AIDS sux

You sux more than I do until the end of the universe, and if you keep bothering me, I will tell mom

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 03:11 PM
:D That...post was strangely...hilarious.

You're cool, champ. *high five*

Haha, boomerangs and AIDS. Tee hee hee.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 03:16 PM
:D That...post was strangely...hilarious.

You're cool, champ. *high five*

Haha, boomerangs and AIDS. Tee hee hee.


mmm... :D

EMehl6
11-28-2006, 03:21 PM
You're an idiot. There were a total of about three words in that passage that weren't horse-shit.

No, you're the fucking moron. Look it up genius. Look at HeadAroundU's post too. It backs up what I said.

Llamas
11-28-2006, 03:27 PM
Venom, you're wrong in this case. HAU's post, mine, and emehl's were all very similar. emehl said some stuff I disagree with, but for the most part, it had the right idea.

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 03:31 PM
Nothing backs up what you say. Ever.

You're a twat.

Llamas
11-28-2006, 03:33 PM
...my post is deeply seeded in definitions from wiki, allmusic, etc. they're broad definitions as to the roots of punk, and aren't an attempt at excluding certain bands from the genre. fundamentally, you can't argue how punk came about and what it was in the beginning.

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 03:39 PM
I wasn't talking to you, you schmuck. :p

Bazza
11-28-2006, 03:44 PM
Officially? Please tell me where something OFFICIAL says this.
Ok, I couldn't find it where it said that.

I guess really there is no set genre, The Offspring fall into to many divisions, so I guess I agree with you, HAU and emehl. At the end of the day, who cares? I never bother labelling up genres on i-tunes because it's too subjective.

Jizzy Jeff Punk Man
11-28-2006, 07:41 PM
Punk and metal are totally different. Punk is a total anti-attitude to what metal stands for. It's not just about musical style, it's also standing points in society and personality.

Breaking Benjamin and Three Days Grace are NOT punk. AT ALL. They're not grunge either, for whatever idiot said that. Grunge was the bands from Seattle in the early 90's and that is it.

The Offspring isn't the greatest example to compare punk and metal.

ACYD
11-28-2006, 08:03 PM
Their chord structures make them punk. There's a definite difference between Offspring and Metallica. I like both, but one is clearly punk, while the other is clearly metal.

WebDudette
11-28-2006, 08:07 PM
I despise conversations about genres. There are so many fucking genres it is rediculous.

noodles_is_cool
11-28-2006, 09:12 PM
IF THIS MATCHES THE OFFSPRING, THEN THIER PUNK, IF NOT, HAVE A CRY

Punk rock
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Punk rock
Stylistic origins: Rock 'n' Roll - Rockabilly - Garage - Frat rock - Psychedelic - Pub rock - Glam rock - Protopunk
Cultural origins: mid-1970s United States, Australia & United Kingdom.
Typical instruments: Vocals - Guitar - Bass - Drums - occasional use of other instruments
Mainstream popularity: Mostly underground; Topped charts in UK. International commercial success for pop punk and ska punk.
Derivative forms: Alternative rock - Emo - New Wave - Post-punk
Subgenres
Anarcho-punk - Christian punk - Crust punk - Garage punk - Hardcore punk - Horror punk - Oi!
Fusion genres
Anti-folk - Chicano punk - Death rock - Folk punk - Funkcore - Jazz punk - Deathcountry - Psychobilly - Ska punk - 2 tone - Pop punk
Regional scenes
Belgium - Brazil - Argentina - Germany
Other topics
Punk timeline - DIY ethic - Punk forerunners - First wave punk - Second wave punk - Punk movies - Punk zines - Punk fashion
Punk rock is an anti-establishment rock music movement with origins in the United States, United Kingdom[1][2] and Australia[3] around 1974-1975, exemplified by bands such as the Ramones,[4] Sex Pistols,[5] The Damned, and The Clash.

The term punk is used to describe the associated subculture, involving youthful aggression, specific clothing styles, ideologies, and a DIY (do it yourself) attitude. The cities of London, Sydney, New York City, Washington DC, Los Angeles and Berkeley have been key locales for punk bands, venues and audiences.

Contents [hide]
1 Characteristics
2 History
2.1 Origins
2.2 Early emergence
2.3 Subgenres of punk
2.4 Legacy and recent developments
3 See also
4 Sound samples
5 References
6 Notes
7 External links



[edit] Characteristics
Punk bands often emulate the bare musical structures and arrangements of 1960s garage rock bands. This emphasis on accessibility exemplified punk's DIY aesthetic, and contrasted with the ostentatious musicianship of many of the mainstream rock bands popular in the years before the advent of punk. In 1976, the English punk fanzine Sideburns included drawings (later reproduced in Sniffin' Glue) of three chords, captioned: "This is a chord, this is another, this is a third. Now form a band".[6] Typical punk instrumentation includes a drum kit, one or two electric guitars, an electric bass and vocals. Drums typically sound heavy and dry, and often have a minimal set-up — with a snare drum, one mounted or standing tom, one floor tom, one bass drum, hi-hats, one or two crash cymbals and a ride cymbal.

In the early days of punk rock, musical virtuosity was often looked on with suspicion; complicated guitar solos were considered self-indulgent and unnecessary, although basic guitar breaks were still common, even in early punk songs. Bass guitar lines are often basic and used to carry the songs melody, although some punk bass players such as Mike Watt put greater emphasis on more technical bass parts. Guitar parts tend to include highly-distorted power chords, although some bands take a surf rock approach with lighter, "twangier" guitar tones. Production is minimalistic, with tracks sometimes laid down on home tape recorders. Punk vocals sometimes sound nasal, and are often shouted instead of sung in a conventional sense.

Most punk songs have a verse-chorus form and a 4/4 time signature. Punk songs are normally about two and a half minutes long, but can be merely a few seconds. Punk rock tends to have faster tempos than the rock bands who came before them. Drum beats are usually simplistic, with quarter note grooves and not very technical bass or snare drum patterns. However, in hardcore punk the drumming is considerably faster and quite technical.

By the mid-1970s, punk lyrics began to involve confrontational frankness and commentaries on social and political issues. Songs such as The Clash's "Career Opportunities" and "London's Burning" and Chelsea's "Right to Work", dealt with unemployment, boredom, and other grim realities of urban life. The Sex Pistols songs "God Save the Queen" and "Anarchy in the U.K." were openly disparaging of the British political system. Others were violent or anti-romantic in depictions of sex and love, such as The Voidoids' "Love Comes in Spurts".


[edit] History

[edit] Origins

UK Punks, circa 1986The phrase punk rock (from punk, meaning a hoodlum or ruffian, or a worthless person[7][8]) was originally applied to the untutored guitar-and-vocals-based rock of United States bands of the mid-1960s such as The Standells, The Sonics, and The Seeds—bands that are now often categorized as garage rock.

The term "punk" was first used outside of the original connotaion in a magazine of the same name created by Legs McNeil, John Holmstrom and Ged Dunn, inspired by the Dictators, Iggy and the Stooges, the New York Dolls, tv re-runs, and drinking beer, although "punk rock" was first used by rock critic Dave Marsh, who used it to describe the music of ? and the Mysterians in the May 1971 issue of Creem magazine,[9] and it was adopted by many rock music journalists in the early 1970s. In the liner notes of the 1972 anthology album Nuggets, Lenny Kaye uses the term punk-rock to refer to the 1960s garage rock bands, as well as some of the darker and more primitive practitioners of 1960s psychedelic rock. Shortly after he wrote those notes, Kaye formed a band with avant-garde poet Patti Smith. Smith's group, and her first album, Horses (released 1975), directly inspired many of the mid-1970s punk rockers.[10]

Punk rock may have been influenced by the snotty attitude, on- and off-stage violence, and aggressive instrumentation, overt sexuality and political confrontation of artists such as The Who, the Rolling Stones, Eddie Cochran, Gene Vincent, The Velvet Underground, Alice Cooper, The Stooges, the MC5, The Deviants, and the New York Dolls. Other likely influences include the English pub rock scene, and British glam rock and art rock acts of the early 1970s, including David Bowie, Gary Glitter and Roxy Music. Early punk rock also displays influences from other musical genres, including ska, funk, and rockabilly.


Cover of the Sex Pistols 1977 album Never Mind the Bollocks, Here's the Sex Pistols.Punk rock served as a reaction against 1970s popular music such as disco music, heavy metal, progressive rock[11] and arena rock. Punk also rejected the remnants of the 1960s hippie counterculture. The cultural critiques and strategies for revolutionary action of the European Situationist movement of the 1950s and 1960s influenced the vanguard of the British punk movement, particularly the Sex Pistols. Their manager, Malcolm McLaren, consciously embraced situationist ideas, which are also reflected in the clothing—designed for the band by Vivienne Westwood—and in the band's promotional artwork, much of it designed by the Situationist-affiliated Jamie Reid.

The British punk movement may have drawn upon the do-it-yourself attitude of the Skiffle music craze that emerged amid the post-World War II austerity in Britain. Punk rock in Britain coincided with the end of post-war consensus politics that preceded the rise of Thatcherism. This led many British punk bands to express an angry attitude based on social alienation.

Subgenres of punk

The Swedish punk band Ebba Grön, a poster from 1981While it is thought that the style of punk from the 1970s had a decline in the 1980s, many sub-genres branched off playing their own interpretation of punk rock.

Music samples:
"Rise Above" (file info) — play in browser (beta)
Sample of "Rise Above" by Black Flag from Damaged (1981)
Problems listening to the file? See media help.
"She's Lost Control" (file info) — play in browser (beta)
Sample of "She's Lost Control" by Joy Division from Unknown Pleasures (1979)
Problems listening to the file? See media help.
New Wave and its attendant subculture arose along with the earliest punk groups; indeed "punk" and "New Wave" were originally interchangeable terms. Soon after the term gained popularity, a division emerged between the two genres: music that tended more toward experimentation, lyrical complexity, or more polished production, notably bands such as Talking Heads, Television and Devo, were called "New Wave" rather than "punk".[19] Combining elements of early punk music and fashion with a far more pop oriented and less "dangerous" style in the early 1980s, typified by artists such as The Cars, Blondie, Elvis Costello, The Police and even Duran Duran, New Wave became one of the most popular music movements of its time.

The United States saw the emergence of hardcore punk, which is known for fast, aggressive beats and, in many cases, politically or socially aware lyrics. Early hardcore bands include Dead Kennedys, Black Flag, Bad Brains, Social Distortion, The Descendents, early Replacements, Bad Religion, and The Germs and the movement developed via Minor Threat, Minutemen and Hüsker Dü, among others. In New York, there was a large hardcore punk movement led by bands such as Agnostic Front, The Cro-Mags, Murphy's Law, Sick of it All, and Gorilla Biscuits. Other styles emerged from this new genre including skate punk, emo and straight edge.

DeAtHsTaR
11-28-2006, 09:18 PM
Grunge was the bands from Seattle in the early 90's and that is it.


You're a fucking idiot. Location has nothign to do with what a band is. If Nirvana were from Portland, would they not be grunge?

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 09:35 PM
You're a fucking idiot. Location has nothign to do with what a band is. If Nirvana were from Portland, would they not be grunge?

Nirvana sux any place they were... sux sux sux

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 10:05 PM
Dude you're a fucking idiot, Nirvana does not suck.
They are probably a better band than The Offspring, no matter how much i like them.
I'm talking talent here so don't say it's a matter of opinion, because i like The Offspring more.
If you said Nirvana was overrated, thats one thing, because they got a huge amount of attention and cult teen followers after Kurt's death, but Nirvana certainly does not suck. At least recognize them as a talented band, please.

They were such talented as a rock.

They WERE NOT TALENTED. Cobain was such A BAD GUITARIST, Grohl it's A SUPER DUDER overrated drummer (he was aggresive, but sux), and the bassist... well, fuck he don's exists anyway.

And fuck the lyrics, don't come with that shit with me. Rape me??? Smells like teen spirit? Anorexhoshit or whatever?

They weren't talented, they sux all the way... so... don't fuck anymore, face it

Llamas
11-28-2006, 10:29 PM
Dude you're a fucking idiot, Nirvana does not suck.
They are probably a better band than The Offspring, no matter how much i like them.
I'm talking talent here so don't say it's a matter of opinion, because i like The Offspring more.
If you said Nirvana was overrated, thats one thing, because they got a huge amount of attention and cult teen followers after Kurt's death, but Nirvana certainly does not suck. At least recognize them as a talented band, please.

Umm... talented? It's fine if you like them. Kurt Kobain was a horrible singer. His lyrics suck. He was a horrible guitar player. The rest of the band was average at best. There was nothing talented about Nirvana.

WebDudette
11-28-2006, 10:31 PM
I gave Nirvana a try and was really into them for a couple months, not sure why.
They really aren't that good and way, way, way over rated. That always happens when a famous person dies a tragic death though.

Venom Symbiote
11-28-2006, 10:40 PM
The only thing going for Nirvana is that they were the right band at the right time.

It's timing, not talent. Guns N' Roses broke up the '80s glam thing before Nirvana did, but Nirvana got all the recognition for it.

Llamas
11-28-2006, 10:41 PM
Exactly to both of you. I checked out Nirvana due to all the hype, and really liked Nevermind for a short time. Then I realized that I was almost forcing myself to like them, and that they sucked.

Nirvana wouldn't even be a dot on the radar if they had recorded any other time than they did. It just happened that grunge was getting popular, and it didn't matter if they were GOOD.

WebDudette
11-28-2006, 10:45 PM
Nirvana were mediocre sure htye had skill not alot but they had it. My favorite song by them was a cover.

I bet Nirvana wouldn't be as popular today if Kurt didn't shoot himself in the face.

Llamas
11-28-2006, 10:46 PM
Dude, there's more to becoming famous than talent. Marketing, production, timing, luck, etc. Look at fucking U2. Sack of shit. And do mean to tell me you think Britney Spears is talented? Her writers, directors, producers, etc, are talented; she is not. Yet who doesn't know who she is??

WebDudette
11-28-2006, 10:46 PM
Hooray for hating U2!

Llamas
11-28-2006, 10:47 PM
Can I get an amen for wishing bono would die in a plane crash?

WebDudette
11-28-2006, 10:48 PM
Yes, yes you can.

Amen!

Llamas
11-28-2006, 10:52 PM
Well that's cool. It's fine if you think that Nirvana is talented. I guess it wasn't you that started it, anyway. Ninty Man likes to randomly blurt out his opinion as fact, which is annoying as hell. Nirvana may be untalented, but it's still an opinion. Wow, another thread completely derailed...

WebDudette
11-28-2006, 10:54 PM
Do you like Orange juice?

DeAtHsTaR
11-28-2006, 10:54 PM
The only thing going for Nirvana is that they were the right band at the right time.

It's timing, not talent. Guns N' Roses broke up the '80s glam thing before Nirvana did, but Nirvana got all the recognition for it.

No, glam was still huge in 1990, Poison, White Lion, and co. were still cranking out hit power ballads.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 11:19 PM
I LOVE ORANGE JUICE!!
do you like the pulp in it or not?
i prefer no pulp but i don't really care because it's good for you anyways.
yeah talk about derailed into a 3 train pile-up

I love orange juice... I drink one liter in 5 minutes XD

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 11:21 PM
dude whatever
If you really think Nirvana has NO talent at all.. then oh well. If they had no talent, they wouldn't be nearly as famous. If they had no talent, then Kurt Cobain would just be another death in the music industry, but he wasn't. People wouldn't listen to something terrible just because the lead singer/guitarist died.

Flash news:

Britney Spears, Blink 182, Backstreet boys, Vanilla Ice, etc were famous... and they have so much talent as I'm blonde

Llamas
11-28-2006, 11:25 PM
Flash news:

Britney Spears, Blink 182, Backstreet boys, Vanilla Ice, etc were famous... and they have so much talent as I'm blonde

already been said.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 11:26 PM
Well that's cool. It's fine if you think that Nirvana is talented. I guess it wasn't you that started it, anyway. Ninty Man likes to randomly blurt out his opinion as fact, which is annoying as hell. Nirvana may be untalented, but it's still an opinion. Wow, another thread completely derailed...

Yeah, I know that I attacked Beatles time away (but it was just for fun... and annoying Thomas :O) but this time... I have the FACT (and it's not only me) that Nirvana was untallented, overrated, and fuck, sucking as hell.

All my pals (which, by the way, have many tastes in music that I dislike) HATE nirvana... and we all tried to listen them... but it's so painful that I prefer listen a reggaeton album that nirvana... seriously

Llamas
11-28-2006, 11:30 PM
Seriously, stop it. I agree that Nirvana was untalented and overrated. However, those are OPINIONS and they are not FACTS. STOP saying they are facts.

Ninty Man
11-28-2006, 11:33 PM
Seriously, stop it. I agree that Nirvana was untalented and overrated. However, those are OPINIONS and they are not FACTS. STOP saying they are facts.

Fact:

I'm tired

Fact:

Batman rules

Fact:
Orange juice rules

Fact:
I need new english curses... the tapes aren't working

Jizzy Jeff Punk Man
11-29-2006, 04:01 AM
You're a fucking idiot. Location has nothign to do with what a band is. If Nirvana were from Portland, would they not be grunge?


Actually, location has a lot to do with the style of a band. Black Sabbath is considered metal but they're from Birmingham as opposed the LA bands where they're surrounded with clubs and partying. Nirvana isn't from Portland, the line-up comes from Aberdeen which is in Washington. Besides, Nirvana isn't the only grunge band. Seattle and that local scene was trying to bring back the simpleness compared to a place like LA. Grunge wanted to kill the trendiness.

noodlesfan
11-30-2006, 03:13 PM
Punk, by definition, is stripped down, sped up rock.

Wrong-O, True punk was all about learning three of four chords and playing in shithole clubs so you could get wasted and have sex with underage girls. The bastards (victorians) changed it.

Venom Symbiote
11-30-2006, 03:40 PM
No, glam was still huge in 1990, Poison, White Lion, and co. were still cranking out hit power ballads.

Very true. It was the signal of the end of that era, though, GN'R were the monster rock band after about '88, ever other band were just lesser beings. But hey, who ever really liked Poison or Twisted Sister anyway, right? :p

As for the wishing Bono would be pwned in a plane disaster, that's too fitting a rock-star death for that guy. Brings up memories of Holly. Have him speared to death by starving African tribes or something. Or set alight by the bong of a fan-hippie.

3.rockin.decades
12-05-2006, 08:37 AM
Didn't mean to start any battles.:(

Guess it's like some of you said, best not to label The Offspring. Just enjoy. I really liked Self Esteem when I first heard it some few years ago and have listened to the band ever since.

Thanks for the responses.

MOTO13
12-05-2006, 02:12 PM
You're an idiot. There were a total of about three words in that passage that weren't horse-shit.

As for the original poster, they're not really a "punk rock" band anymore. They have their roots in that scene, but look at it this way: if you just think of the Offspring as a good rock band, nothing more nothing less, just a good solid high-quality modern rock band, you'll appreciate them all the more.

:) Nice to see their music is entertaining to the older crowd, too. Heh, my parents used to rock out to "Hit That" or "Original Prankster" once in a while, but I doubt they'd appreciate the more classic stuff.

Ok...it's official, you're a tool. They(Offspring) may not be a punk band per se', but they definitely play punk music. You can read tableture right? Power chords played moderately fast to fast. Basic punk music. Don't compare them to the old punk bands from the '70's, they are well beyond that. The Offspring a ROCK band...not hardly. How many guitar solo's do you hear in Offspring music?

DeAtHsTaR
12-05-2006, 02:33 PM
How many guitar solo's do you hear in Offspring music?
Quite a few actually. Self-titled was full of them, and all the other albums have at least had a few. And FUCK, most modern rock bands don't even do solos anymore.

Little_Miss_1565
12-05-2006, 05:58 PM
Can we just agree not to get in these shitty and stupid flame-wars over what the Offspring are precisely?

DeAtHsTaR
12-05-2006, 06:02 PM
Let's just say they're rock.

pyroahiru
12-06-2006, 05:37 PM
Their not 'old school punk' or 'Nu-school punk'. They are 'American punk.'

pyroahiru
12-06-2006, 05:39 PM
Quite a few actually. Self-titled was full of them, and all the other albums have at least had a few. And FUCK, most modern rock bands don't even do solos anymore.
Hell, Coheed and Cambria does.

noodlesfan
12-07-2006, 07:33 AM
[COLOR="SeaGreen"]'American punk.'

Oxymoron...

Venom Symbiote
12-07-2006, 01:39 PM
Ok...it's official, you're a tool. They(Offspring) may not be a punk band per se', but they definitely play punk music. You can read tableture right? Power chords played moderately fast to fast. Basic punk music. Don't compare them to the old punk bands from the '70's, they are well beyond that. The Offspring a ROCK band...not hardly. How many guitar solo's do you hear in Offspring music?

No, you're a towel!

Listen up, quit'cho jibba-jabba. The Offspring are a rock band. Who have about half of each of their albums (modern post-Ixnay) stemming from a punk-rock basis. Even if we're talking the more serious songs. "Mota" isn't a punk track. "Amazed" isn't. "Gone Away" isn't. "The Kids Aren't Alright" isn't. "Pay The Man" isn't. "Million Miles Away" isn't. "Living In Chaos" isn't. "Vultures" isn't. "Race Against Myself" isn't.

And don't even get me started on their experimental/inter-genre stuff.

The Offspring have their roots in the punk movement, and yes, they still write a good deal of straight-up 3-chord 3-minute-long material, but they write just as much music that isn't that at all. By any description.

So, yeah, pretty much stop being a whore. And stop calling me a "tool" when you clearly don't know a thing about this band and who they've been since the late '90s.

Seriously, man. This band is just as much Foo Fighters/L.A. Guns/Pearl Jam as they are Dead Kennedys/Buzzcocks (and yes, yes, I know they're nothing like the Foo Fighters/L.A. Guns/Pearl Jam, but they're not fucking anything like the last two either).

clocks_R_slow
12-07-2006, 04:04 PM
i myself, have always had a hard time putting The Offspring into a catagory.
It's just too hard. The Offspring are just The Offspring to me!! No one else compares. My opinion: there should be a catagory called "FUCKINGAMAZINGKICKASSTUNEZMUTHAFUCKA" and The Offspring would be the only band in it.:cool:

Marco_p
12-09-2006, 01:52 PM
Waffles anyone?