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XYlophonetreeZ
12-27-2004, 11:49 AM
So there's a big front-page article about the earthquake, which killed over 22,000 people in the Indian Ocean region (although they had only counted 13,390 when the article was published). Now that's an OK-sized number, but I'm American and don't personally know where any of these countries are- I've never seen them in the mainstream news or anything. So I figure it must be a slow news day. I try to read the article, but it doesn't really make a lot of sense. I've never heard of these places and cannot relate to these non-white people. But thankfully, I have a really, really good local newspaper. God bless the Raleigh News and Observer. They were thoughtful enough to include 2 very helpful images and captions to help me understand the seriousness of this natural disaster. The first one, large and centered in the frontpage, depicted 5 dark-skinned, poor-looking men carrying the dead body of a white person on a stretcher. The caption read "Thai rescuers carry the body of a tourist killed at Krabi beach on the island of Phi Phi, a resort crowded with European visitors where "The Beach," starring Leonardo DiCaprio, was filmed. Two hundred bungalows were swept out to sea." (I am DEAD SERIOUS, this was a real caption.) Now, I don't really know or care what these "bungalows" are, but shit... Leo DiCaprio? Him I know. I was so sorry for those European tourists that, I'm not gonna lie, I started to get a little weepy. Then the caption below showed two female Swiss tourists crying, embracing, and comforting each other in another Thai resort island. One of them looked like she might be kinda hot, but her head was turned. She had nice boobs though. I've never been to Switzerland, but I heard they have a lot of money. I wish I was rich enough to go to Thai resort islands when I felt like it, only without all the earthquakes and dying and stuff. But again, these were people I could relate to, and I wanted to just get in the middle of that hug and comfort these Swiss tourists, and feel the hot one's breasts. At that point I was crying so much that my brother came over and slapped me across the face, calling me a sissy-boy. But then I showed him the pictures and he joined right in. Pretty soon my whole family was in on the tearjerking fest. But then I pointed out, "These people should be thankful they didn't witness 9/11," and my family nodded in agreement. I still get misty thinking about those 2,000 Americans.

[/sarcasm]. Seriously, what the fuck is with these news people? Damn, this earthquake sucks. The idea of that many deaths is mindboggling. Let's see how much money my school can collect in donations for relief from this quake. Let's see if we're still remembering the three-year anniversary of this disaster. Let's how long it takes before some other news story about the ever-changing Bush cabinet or steroids in major League baseball overtakes this. Let's see how many Americans actually care.

P.S.- I am not in any way trying to downplay 9/11. But the fact is, many, many more people died here and there will inevitably be much less of a big deal made of it. That is my point.

The Talking Pie
12-27-2004, 12:17 PM
Good point. Awesome use of sarcasm also.

Mota Boy
12-27-2004, 12:58 PM
Three Americans died too. That's a news story in itself.



Seriously though, it's understandable. I used to assume that we were the only country that counted out our dead in overseas disaster until I started reading foreign papers that, too, focused on their citizens. Are we going to remember the three year anniversary of this? Fuck no. But do you think that Thai citizens marked 9/11/04? Fuck no.

As disasterous as this earthquake was, it's not going to change our life in the least (As far as I know. I have some friends from Thailand and the company for which my dad works has some assets in Malaysia, but those are just tangential relations).

Likewise, 9/11 did not just signify the death of 3,000+ people, it also begat a sea change in U.S. foreign and domestic policy - the U.S. was now going to focus it's attention on the problem of fundamentalist Islamic terrorism above all. We'd been adrift sense the end of the Cold War. We'd been promoting democracy abroad, but not with nearly the gusto with which we threw ourselves into the fight against communism.

Likewise, for the first time in history, Americans truly felt vulnerable in their own country. It was the opening salvo in the latest undeclared war - an event of historical geopolitical implications.

This is a disaster. People died and that's bad, but this isn't going to lead to a political realignment in Indonesia or a dramatic Thai foreign policy shift. And even if it did, it wouldn't nearly have the global importance of a change in U.S. policy, merely because we're the most powerful nation in the planet. Go to Madrid and see how people care about the train bombing this year compared to the Bali bombing a few years ago. Then see how those two events rank on Australia's scale of importance. It's human nature to care more about those with whom you share some sort of kinship.

Focusing on Leo and Swiss tourists is about as yokelly as you can get and quite embarassing, but I doubt that rural citizens in Uruguay care much more about this than the readers of the Raleigh News and Observer.

Vera
12-27-2004, 01:21 PM
One of them looked like she might be kinda hot, but her head was turned. She had nice boobs though. I've never been to Switzerland, but I heard they have a lot of money. I wish I was rich enough to go to Thai resort islands when I felt like it, only without all the earthquakes and dying and stuff. But again, these were people I could relate to, and I wanted to just get in the middle of that hug and comfort these Swiss tourists, and feel the hot one's breasts.
Wow, yeah, that's some excellent use of sarcasm PLUS exactly how I felt about the 9/11 attack.

Because, you know, boobs make all the death in this world so much better.

What the fuck are you smoking dude? Where did that come from and how the FUCK did that help to further elaborate your point?

People on this BBS confuse me with their idiocy.

RXP
12-27-2004, 01:38 PM
If everyone had a couple of breasts to hand the worlds problems would be solved.

Vera
12-27-2004, 02:20 PM
Half the world already has two boobies. And with a little money, the second half can get themselves a pair as well.

plastic_letterz
12-27-2004, 03:42 PM
I cant imagine whats its like for all the people who are there and what its like for their families right now.My condolences go out to them. I read an article about it on CNN.com and my reaction was "damn".

The Talking Pie
12-27-2004, 04:18 PM
The main articles in The Sun here were all about British tourists. Thousands killed, and we get told about the British. Who cares? You could argue they were at-risk people anyway, given that the odds of being murdered while on vacation or crashing in the plane are obviously better than this happening to them.

Tell me about the people whose entire life has been destroyed, make me feel bad for them, not the fucking British tourists who were victims of that terrible foreign catastrophe. Oh yes, it's always nice to point out that it was foreign. It's that whole "it could never happen in a place like this" mentality. Fucking media.

Even when they take it upon themselves to mourn for the entire nation they're still making that Us and Them distinction.

Mota Boy
12-27-2004, 06:10 PM
I read some article about it that claimed that children were the real victims of the incident. Dumbest fucking article I've ever read. It started with the blood-curdling statistic that one in three of all victims have been children... and that it's expected to climb as high as one half!!!

My bullshit detector went off at that. All the nations hit were third world, (OK, so technically India is second world, but third world has evolved beyond its historical Cold War meanings) meaning that they had a population skewed towards the younger generation. Sure enough, later on the article went on to mention that about half of all people in the affected countries were children.

So wait a minute, kids have been impacted LESS than adults in the body count so far? The article also had the dumbest fucking sentence I've ever seen - that there was a "double tragedy" going on, childless familes coupled with orphaned children. 1) So apparently, the tsunamis wiped out adults and children unrelated to one another, which seems to be a feature entirely unique to these tsunamis. 2) Hey, problem solved!

It was just a terrible attempt to write about the disaster as an attack on the kiddies, something to really pull at the heartstrings "Ohhh, I didn't think too much about this until I saw that kids had died too." It annoyed me.

HornyPope
12-27-2004, 07:08 PM
More news should be covering it. I visited a friend who had his TV turned on that evening (since i never watch tv myself - I stress that point a lot) and all they talked about in the news was how packed are the stores during xmas rush and how they are prepared for the boxing week rush. What a news flash! Shopping? During christmas? No way!


either way, if anyone wants to help - www.directrelief.org

plastic_letterz
12-27-2004, 09:59 PM
More news should be covering it. I visited a friend who had his TV turned on that evening (since i never watch tv myself - I stress that point a lot) and all they talked about in the news was how packed are the stores during xmas rush and how they are prepared for the boxing week rush. What a news flash! Shopping? During christmas? No way!


either way, if anyone wants to help - www.directrelief.org


OMG I know what your talking about. Its like X-mas shopping is more important than a natural diaster that killed so many people and ruined people's lives. I just read that there could be a spread of disease because there is no clean water over there.

dextersgurl12966
12-27-2004, 10:56 PM
i live in baltimore so the paper gets violent and so do car dealership signs ppl in baltimore no wat im talkin about

Noodles
12-27-2004, 11:03 PM
"I think this earthquake, and the resulting tsunami, was just another attempt by the liberals to destroy christmas." - Ann Coulter

dextersgurl12966
12-27-2004, 11:05 PM
lol thats funny dude shitmy friends dad was just shot no joke and they blamed it on race when a blk man killed a blk man

Lullaby
12-28-2004, 04:14 AM
"I think this earthquake, and the resulting tsunami, was just another attempt by the liberals to destroy christmas." - Ann Coulter

*lol* fuck...thats really stupid :p

The Talking Pie
12-28-2004, 05:16 AM
I agree with how stupid that whole 'children dying' thing is. Are their lives really that more important because of their age? Do you start being expendable once you hit 18? Who cares how old they were; people died. I wish people (not just talking media and about this tragedy now) would start to realise that.

Lullaby
12-28-2004, 06:41 AM
Its always so that people are more shocked about a kid that dies than about an older person...
cause lil babys and 5 year old kids are so innocent...
but for sure nobody should forget the other humans...nobody deserve that.

p.s: sorry my englsich is not that good so I hope you know what I mean..its kinda hard for me to explain what I want to say in another language :o

wheelchairman
12-28-2004, 06:42 AM
Lullaby is on the right track. I think it has to do with the fact that none of the kids chose to be there, while in some weird logic all the adults "chose" to be there.

XYlophonetreeZ
12-28-2004, 10:15 AM
Wow, yeah, that's some excellent use of sarcasm PLUS exactly how I felt about the 9/11 attack.

Because, you know, boobs make all the death in this world so much better.

What the fuck are you smoking dude? Where did that come from and how the FUCK did that help to further elaborate your point?

People on this BBS confuse me with their idiocy.

Maybe you could forward this point to the Raleigh News and Observer, thus enhancing my point. My point was that this newspaper depicted 2 Swiss tourists- 2 white people in the middle of a disaster that affected overwhelmingly more nonwhite people, and one of them was quite abundant in the breast region. Was this deliberate? I don't know. But if it was, then it's really pretty sleazy, as if it was in attempt to make readers identify with and pay attention to these white people. But that's kind of a longshot in itself. I probably could have left that detail alone. But it fit with the whole persona of my sarcasm in that post, which I admit I probably got carried away with, though, I'm not gonna lie, I enjoyed it.

The main point of this post was to point out that, as Mota acknowledged, my local newspaper's chosen areas of focus- Leo DiCaprio and female Swiss tourists- was really stupid and offensive. And also just to acknowledge that something really awful happened, which is about as indisputable a point as there can be. Yet still people find ways to pick apart my post by pointing out one possibly negative minor detail of it. Hmm.

sKratch
12-28-2004, 10:47 AM
"I think this earthquake, and the resulting tsunami, was just another attempt by the liberals to destroy christmas." - Ann Coulter
I'd be more surprised if that wasn't a real quote than if it was.

midnightfire582
12-29-2004, 08:45 AM
This is just so horrible, at this point the death toll is at 80,000. 80,000 people dead, it's just mind boggling.

Demosthenes
12-29-2004, 09:49 AM
actually so far its only 65k but the death toll is supposed to go over 100,000

~Ryan

plastic_letterz
12-29-2004, 09:54 AM
.....the death toll is supposed to go over 100,000

~Ryan

Yea i heard that too. Thats crazy.

Lullaby
12-29-2004, 10:36 AM
yeah thats really horrible..... :(

The Talking Pie
12-29-2004, 12:59 PM
actually so far its only 65k but the death toll is supposed to go over 100,000

That's fucking terrible. And yet no one's making as much fuss (civilian population-wise, at least) as there was over 9/11.

Mota Boy
12-29-2004, 01:24 PM
Because there is a difference between an act of nature and a terrorist incident. Even though the severity of the quake was incredible, people have come to accept that sometimes the earth shakes and people die because of it. Having passenger aircraft flown into skyscrapers, however, was almost completely unprecedented and so nobody knew exactly how to react. Quakes of this magnitute occur once every several decades, so you know you have a large waiting period before the next one. After the first large terrorist incident on American soil, however, nothing was certain.

You seem to be trying so hard to find racist and nationalist undertones to worldwide reaction to the tragedy that you're overlooking the obvious.

The Talking Pie
12-29-2004, 01:26 PM
The obvious is that people boast body counts in these kind of situations to elicit sympathy, and on those grounds people still seem to care less about this tragedy.

Vera
12-29-2004, 01:29 PM
Yet still people find ways to pick apart my post by pointing out one possibly negative minor detail of it. Hmm.
What can I say, I demand perfection.

Also, I found it random and stupid and it threw me off completely so I wasn't able to fully focus on what you were trying to say. You just went a bit too far in order for the sarcasm to be sharp. In short, you started to sound like an idiot.

Mota Boy
12-29-2004, 04:06 PM
The obvious is that people boast body counts in these kind of situations to elicit sympathy, and on those grounds people still seem to care less about this tragedy.So people are affected by this tragedy, but they're not as affected as you think they should be, so you're chastising everyone? I've already explained why this isn't as big an event. An estimated 2,000 to 3,000 Americans are missing, an equal number to those that died on 9/11, but we aren't making an equal fuss, for the reasons I stated. You don't come across as particularly empathetic to the victims of the tsunamis, you instead seem to focus all your attention on your fellow country, trying to catch it acting in a way that will allow you to accuse everyone of being prejudiced so that you can come across as superior.

The Talking Pie
12-29-2004, 04:21 PM
You know, you're actually right. I don't like people; for the most-part they're self-righteous selfish idiots who wait for others to make up opinions for them. And yes, I'm trying to demonise them as I believe they should be. But when you talk about one thing it doesn't necessarily entail actively omitting everything else; my posts have also focused on how fucking terrible the disaster has been for the people involved, local or foreign. That's what my whole argument is based on, how people give more of a shit to the people they can somehow relate to than the countless thousands of others who make up the majority of the victims. This is a shitty topic to try to go on an anti-Western attitude rant; there's simply not enough substance to validate any point I might try to make. It's all been rooted in empathy. I feel for everyone who died. I don't feel as badly as I should, and for that I [perhaps ironically] feel bad (but hey, that's desensitisation for you), but my criticism of people's passive bigotry would be non-existent were it not for the fact that I cared more about the victims as a whole than just my fellow countrymen.
And your points about 9/11 are spot on. That was terrorism, this was nature. But hey, people still died.

Unnatural Disaster
12-29-2004, 04:41 PM
I heard that earthquake sped up the earth's rotation by 3 millionths of a second and caused the earth to wobble on it's axis!

XYlophonetreeZ
12-29-2004, 07:44 PM
Because there is a difference between an act of nature and a terrorist incident. Even though the severity of the quake was incredible, people have come to accept that sometimes the earth shakes and people die because of it. Having passenger aircraft flown into skyscrapers, however, was almost completely unprecedented and so nobody knew exactly how to react. Quakes of this magnitute occur once every several decades, so you know you have a large waiting period before the next one. After the first large terrorist incident on American soil, however, nothing was certain.

You seem to be trying so hard to find racist and nationalist undertones to worldwide reaction to the tragedy that you're overlooking the obvious.

Read the title of the topic, buddy. Though I don't doubt that there will inevitably be (and that there already have been) some "racist and nationalist undertones ot worldwide reaction," and that they shouldn't go ignored, the focal point of what I was saying involved the isolated case of my local newspaper's captions and photos. Which, you agreed, were stupid. Furthermore, I never meant to downplay the historical significance and unprecedence of the 9/11 attacks, and even made a special note about that. I only meant to acknowledge that the immediate death toll of the two tragedies do not even compare. And besides, how can you, on the one end, accentuate the significance and shock of a terrorist attack over an earthquake, while on the other end you compare the Thai people's reaction to 9/11 to our reaction to the earthquake as if they were two analogous things?

If you thought my sarcasm was stupid like Vera did, then I don't really care. That's just the way I felt like writing at the time. I was having a little fun, which was obvious (I thought so, at least). But if it caused confusion about what I meant, then I hope I just helped to straighten that out a little.

Mota Boy
12-29-2004, 08:01 PM
And your points about 9/11 are spot on. That was terrorism, this was nature. But hey, people still died.Of course. And there is a mounting call for global aid. Through Amazon.com, for instance, people have already donated more than three million dollars (http://s1.amazon.com/paypage/PX3BEL97U9A4I/104-0393284-9694351).

I'm aware that, to a degree, we care more about those with whom we share a common bond. If three people die in my small town in a car accident, for instance, it's a much bigger story than if ten people die two states over. I think you'd see the same relative empathy imbalance in Indonesians if the tsunamis wiped out Western Africa and Argentina. I just think it's much more of an understandable, universal part of human nature than anything done out of malice.

And NLM/HtD/GIJ/WDV/XYZ, that post was directed at Pie's post directly above mine equating the two events. Also, Thai people probably would have a roughly equal reaction to the terrorist event as we would the tsunamis because, while 9/11 made Americans feel under attack, Thai people had little to fear directly, as the planes were not aimed at their buildings.

It's honestly mind-boggling how rattled this nation went after the attacks. Every hick town thought that there was an A-rab peeking out from behind McDonald's, planning on blowing up the local seed-distribution plant or Wal-Mart. Though it's a somewhat-amusing thought, I doubt that Sri Lankians are looking over their shoulder for a wave every time they go out to buy groceries.

XYlophonetreeZ
12-29-2004, 08:23 PM
Oops, my bad. For some reason I didn't see his post. But at least Pie has agreed with me, so my post wasn't totally irrelevant and embarrassing.

Splinter X
09-05-2005, 06:14 PM
Never mind. Sorry for the trouble.