View Full Version : Sentenced to death: Afghan who dared to read about women's rights

02-15-2008, 03:10 PM
Well, it's a good thing the U.S went in there and gave them "democracy". (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/sentenced-to-death-afghan-who-dared-to-read-about-womens-rights-775972.html)

Am I right? Don't leave me hangin', budz.

02-15-2008, 04:39 PM
u r so rite =/

man... no words for this shit.

Rag Doll
02-15-2008, 05:41 PM
oh man. that's nauseating. =\

02-16-2008, 05:42 AM
That's what the western patriarchy never thought of before! Just ban the right to read things in general?

Ah book burning.

Mota Boy
02-17-2008, 06:40 PM
Well, it's a good thing the U.S went in there and gave them "democracy".

Am I right? Don't leave me hangin', budz.Actually, you are right.

No government is perfect, and one can hardly expect a third-world totalitarian regime to turn into a bastion of liberal democracy merely because the US bombed it (albeit then "blessed" it with a democratic government). Hell, even back on the home front we sentence innocent people to death and inter prisoners without trial.

Yes, this is far more egregious than domestic American misdeeds, but it's a mistake to compare Afghanistan with Western-style liberal democracies. Compare it instead to Afghanistan. This is a horrible, embarassing event on the part of humanity in general, but we're reading about it. Aghanistan has a relatively free press. This is an outrageous event. People are protesting against it (so far peacefully). Afghanistan has a relatively open public process. Compare that to a decade ago, where the Taliban stoned people to death in public stadiums for the tiniest of infractions.

Democratic governments, as a rule, reflect the values of the people they represent, and right now Afghanistan is undergoing a process that all Islamic countries either have undergone or will undergo if they are to adopt democracy: how is Islamic law compatable with the modern world and modern systems of government? Remember a few years ago when an Afghan man was sentenced to death for converting to Christianity (turned in by his own wife and children, no less)? [Ultimately, he was smuggled out of the country and given asylum in the West, subverting the Afghan legal process and pissing Afghans off - this may yet happen in this instance.] Malaysia did the same thing about a decade before (prosecuting a Muslim apostate with the death penalty), with the ultimate result that their Supreme Court overturned the ruling as incompatable with the Malaysian Constitution. Will that happen here? Not likely, but people in Afghanistan are talking about it, and that's a start. That's the progress that we should see, not the fact that they have yet to reach similar standards of individual freedom it took the United States democracy over two centuries to reach (hey, at least they outlaw slavery - that took us, what, ninety years of democracy?).

To be honest, I don't try to get emotionally involved in every injustice on this Earth - there's just so much out there that you could get permanently outraged/depressed over the state of humanity. Instead, look at the greater benefits of this as a very long march towards modernization, which will certainly not occur overnight - think Dred Scott, not Gloria Steinham.

02-19-2008, 06:34 PM
Well, it's a good thing the U.S went in there and gave them "democracy". (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/sentenced-to-death-afghan-who-dared-to-read-about-womens-rights-775972.html)

Am I right? Don't leave me hangin', budz.

Sentenced to death: Black student who rode a bus he was granted to ride.

Wasn't too long ago we were doing just as stupid of things...

Mota Boy
02-21-2008, 02:20 AM
An interesting twist in the case - it seems like the motives of Afghani judges aren't so uniquely Islamic after all (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080123.wafghanjourno0123/BNStory/International/home?cid=al_gam_mostview).

That's somewhat reassuring.

I guess.

02-21-2008, 09:06 AM
Holy shit, that article is so disturbing on so many levels. I feel sorry for the guy. I don't personally agree with religious-run states but I won't even pretend to understand religion, and from what I gather most people have a way of bending religious scripture way out of shape to suit themselves. So not only does my mind boggle at the absurdity of a law I fail to understand, which I'm trying to run through the whole "its not even probably computable to me how things function over there", the lack of a fair trial is just a disgrace, especially if the law says he is entitled to one.

Some democracy indeed. Not that you can really get entire social change from a few years of war and bombing the crap out of a few Taliban and probably a lot of civilians while you're at it. Democracy through war is such a messy business that causes as many problems as it "solves" that I have to wonder what the value of it is and why the US government is so hell bent on bringing democracy through military campaigns and how deciding how other countries should go about this process is legitimately democracy when supposedly the whole term revolves around the people in the country running the country.