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_KOCOBO_
05-02-2008, 03:50 AM
I don't know how many people knows, but Kosovo is very inportant part of Serbian history,and now it's gone :(

1916
05-02-2008, 04:37 AM
Amene !.!.!

shanna_guarana
05-02-2008, 05:01 AM
Hey! I didn't know that there was someone from Serbia here, too.....NICE.....btw I'm typing in English so that anyone could understand me.....:)

1916
05-02-2008, 07:50 AM
Shanna, zdravo !!!
Povezivanje lepa !!!

the_GoDdEsS
05-02-2008, 08:39 AM
I don't know how many people knows, but Kosovo is very inportant part of Serbian history,and now it's gone :(

Dobrodošao.

Unfortunately, there has been a lot of misinformation about the whole issue.

The Slovak government called the independence illegal and our parliament passed a declaration that we're not recognising any Kosovo "state" without the consent of Serbia. We're too powerless to help you, but at least we maintain good relations.

IamSam
05-04-2008, 01:32 AM
Hey! I didn't know that there was someone from Serbia here, too.....NICE.....btw I'm typing in English so that anyone could understand me.....:)

More important...there is someone here from Kazakstan. Simply amazing.

zsk
05-12-2008, 01:37 AM
the german bundeswehr was there too save the people...
they worked together with the brittish army

darea
05-12-2008, 07:41 AM
Wow, I remember when there was the wars of kosovo, and then I just stopped hearing about it, didn't know it had gone. My grandma on my mum's side is from prussia (konisberg, now leningrad, russia) but moved to west germany when she was very young). But anyway, just to say that my grandma was from a country that was spread on loads of other countries, and her country disappeared ages ago... So I have prussian ancestors and know nothing about them...

wheelchairman
05-12-2008, 08:09 AM
I suppose I can see how you can go from Kaliningrad to Leningrad, just drop the first two letters and mispronounce the i.

Vikica
05-30-2008, 03:39 AM
I don't know how many people knows, but Kosovo is very inportant part of Serbian history,and now it's gone :(

Kosovo obviously had some good reasons to get out of Serbia. I wouldn't comment much but we all remember what happened when Croatia wanted to get out of Yugoslavia. we all know that serbian politicians still use the term ''Great Serbia''. well, maybe everyone here doesn't know what I'm talking about but you, _KOCOBO_, sure as hell know what I'm talking about and you know you shouldn't have started this thread while there are still some of people from our side and some people from your side in Den Haag in court. you shouldn't have started this thread while there are hundreds of people still buried in unmarked graves and their families are still looking for them. I don't want to argue because there's not need for arguing but think what threads and posts you make public.

Rilex
05-30-2008, 01:00 PM
I just hate the fact that everyone in Serbia acts like it's the end of the world because of it...
I'm about 100 kilometers far away from border, but I've never even been there. Have you?
It's all about politics... And you fall for it... I would rather live in Europe and be able to travel
around, then been stuck here, not able to do shit, while politicians are riping us of, so they can buy new houses.. We need help from outside.... We need to confess that we are not able to wash off our own shit...

Vikica
06-02-2008, 02:50 AM
we all want progress for our countries and going back in past won't bring any of it. I didn't want someone to think they should choose sides. I just made my statement about starting this thread.

sipptaroowsky
06-21-2008, 10:29 AM
Kosovo obviously had some good reasons to get out of Serbia. I wouldn't comment much but we all remember what happened when Croatia wanted to get out of Yugoslavia. we all know that serbian politicians still use the term ''Great Serbia''. well, maybe everyone here doesn't know what I'm talking about but you, _KOCOBO_, sure as hell know what I'm talking about and you know you shouldn't have started this thread while there are still some of people from our side and some people from your side in Den Haag in court. you shouldn't have started this thread while there are hundreds of people still buried in unmarked graves and their families are still looking for them. I don't want to argue because there's not need for arguing but think what threads and posts you make public.


why not talk about it, what are you ashamed of ..FREEDOM? that's a reason more to talk about it, if Croatia was addmited by the world sooner there would be much less dead homeprotectors (domobrani jel), becouse the world wouldn't be blind to the problems of a legal country. I don't know how many of you know this but life in kosovo...people live in the streets, alot of people. you can't say.. it's not my problem, you have to act, you have to chose a side, we can't all be switzerland, I for one don't want to be. I remember in '95 I think, when mom watched the news, and at the end there was a list of countrys who addmited Croatia as a legal country, my mother was crying and sayd:"if they did this 5 years ago, we would be visiting your aunt in SREBRENICA now". for those of you who don't know, srebrenica is a place where the serbs commited the "crime agains humanity", the biggest masacre in europe since the second world war. they were "cleaning" the place from all the people who are not serbs, and then we are triald for it, we are the nazis, if people want a coutry give it to them, a country should not be a prison, if you want to leave leave, don't put them in prison later for defending theyr home land, and let's not forget the good things about serbiA, the proud people, the great history of peace and prosper, theyr loving nature, cultural behaviour during football maches...btw I'm being sarcastic

sipptaroowsky
06-21-2008, 10:38 AM
Dobrodošao.

Unfortunately, there has been a lot of misinformation about the whole issue.

The Slovak government called the independence illegal and our parliament passed a declaration that we're not recognising any Kosovo "state" without the consent of Serbia. We're too powerless to help you, but at least we maintain good relations.


in other words, you don't give a fuck

shanna_guarana
06-21-2008, 05:25 PM
why not talk about it, what are you ashamed of ..FREEDOM? that's a reason more to talk about it, if Croatia was addmited by the world sooner there would be much less dead homeprotectors (domobrani jel), becouse the world wouldn't be blind to the problems of a legal country. I don't know how many of you know this but life in kosovo...people live in the streets, alot of people. you can't say.. it's not my problem, you have to act, you have to chose a side, we can't all be switzerland, I for one don't want to be. I remember in '95 I think, when mom watched the news, and at the end there was a list of countrys who addmited Croatia as a legal country, my mother was crying and sayd:"if they did this 5 years ago, we would be visiting your aunt in SREBRENICA now". for those of you who don't know, srebrenica is a place where the serbs commited the "crime agains humanity", the biggest masacre in europe since the second world war. they were "cleaning" the place from all the people who are not serbs, and then we are triald for it, we are the nazis, if people want a coutry give it to them, a country should not be a prison, if you want to leave leave, don't put them in prison later for defending theyr home land, and let's not forget the good things about serbiA, the proud people, the great history of peace and prosper, theyr loving nature, cultural behaviour during football maches...btw I'm being sarcastic

I think you should shut the fuck up....this is not the place for this kind of conversations.....go and fight on the football mach stupid I-love-my-country hooligan.....you don't know what you are talking about, neither what are you fighting for.....you should just forget it cause you're not the part of it....:cool:

StefanDBH
06-21-2008, 05:29 PM
why not talk about it, what are you ashamed of ..FREEDOM? that's a reason more to talk about it, if Croatia was addmited by the world sooner there would be much less dead homeprotectors (domobrani jel), becouse the world wouldn't be blind to the problems of a legal country. I don't know how many of you know this but life in kosovo...people live in the streets, alot of people. you can't say.. it's not my problem, you have to act, you have to chose a side, we can't all be switzerland, I for one don't want to be. I remember in '95 I think, when mom watched the news, and at the end there was a list of countrys who addmited Croatia as a legal country, my mother was crying and sayd:"if they did this 5 years ago, we would be visiting your aunt in SREBRENICA now". for those of you who don't know, srebrenica is a place where the serbs commited the "crime agains humanity", the biggest masacre in europe since the second world war. they were "cleaning" the place from all the people who are not serbs, and then we are triald for it, we are the nazis, if people want a coutry give it to them, a country should not be a prison, if you want to leave leave, don't put them in prison later for defending theyr home land, and let's not forget the good things about serbiA, the proud people, the great history of peace and prosper, theyr loving nature, cultural behaviour during football maches...btw I'm being sarcastic



this is reason why I hate politics

shanna_guarana
06-21-2008, 05:34 PM
and btw sipptaroowsky, your country should be ashamed about you...and it is, I'm deeply sure....you're presenting it in the worst light ever and it isn't like that at all.....

shanna_guarana
06-21-2008, 05:55 PM
this is reason why I hate politics

that's why I hate when stupid, loose-viewed people talk about politics....

sipptaroowsky
06-22-2008, 01:14 AM
and btw sipptaroowsky, your country should be ashamed about you...and it is, I'm deeply sure....you're presenting it in the worst light ever and it isn't like that at all.....

oh pleease, you've just proven me right, the only two who have replyed to my "shamefull act" are the ones that the act stands against, the only reason you mock me is becouse at this moment it's very popular to be distanced from your birth place, it's cool to neglect your country and not be proud of it,. you are correct about one thing, I did present it in a bad light and allso you are correct about that it is not like that, but I'm not gonna keep my mought shut while you treat us like shit. and the it's-not-the-place-for-this-kind-of-confersatiaon, ...mate you've been using that same line for 13 years, the only place that's true might be a mass unmarked grave, but then again, you wouldn't know what I'm talking about, IT's GETTING OLD, every place is good for a confersation and this is the POLITICS section, right? and by the way the thing about football matches....I've never been on one in my life, I rarely even watch football, I think it would have the time about now that you addmit you've got some dirt on your flag, use a soap

shanna_guarana
06-22-2008, 06:21 PM
what part of shut the fuck up sentence you didn't understand..?!

sipptaroowsky
06-22-2008, 08:11 PM
what part of shut the fuck up sentence you didn't understand..?!

The part where there's an actual reason why I should do it

IamSam
06-22-2008, 08:22 PM
I think you should shut the fuck up....this is not the place for this kind of conversations.....

Last I checked, the Politics section of the BBS would be the perfect place to have a conversation about...well...politics.

Little_Miss_1565
06-22-2008, 11:00 PM
Last I checked, the Politics section of the BBS would be the perfect place to have a conversation about...well...politics.

I concur. He's not breaking any laws by speaking his mind about the political situation.

HeadAroundU
06-23-2008, 03:53 AM
My heart hurts when 2 Slavic nations/people fight against each other. :(

shanna_guarana
06-23-2008, 04:47 AM
The part where there's an actual reason why I should do it

come on, there's no fucking reason why should one 19 year old argue about this....ahm...you act like you're 15....


Last I checked, the Politics section of the BBS would be the perfect place to have a conversation about...well...politics.


I concur. He's not breaking any laws by speaking his mind about the political situation.

spreading the national hate...? hmmmm.....


My heart hurts when 2 Slavic nations/people fight against each other. :(

mine , too......that's what I' talking about...

sipptaroowsky
06-23-2008, 05:00 AM
Last I checked, the Politics section of the BBS would be the perfect place to have a conversation about...well...politics.


Indeed, but you see the Serbs don't want you to talk about the "cleaning" they did, and this thing didn't happen that much long ago, 1991-1995, you would think that a place like Europe is a place of peace, art, love....bullshit. Now he/she/it is telling me to shut the fuck up....I agree it's a powerfull argument, but he/she/it knows that I am right, she wants it all to be forgoten, let's forgive, let's move on, don't dwelve on the past, while in the meanwhile they hang our national heroes, send them to worlds trial with the evidenc that has been proven fake OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN,...and then some 50 years go by and the fuckers are back again, doing the same genocide that's been going on for a tousand years..now I don't hate all of you eastern fucks, but the fact that your present president is a desciple of your former comunist butcher, the fact that I allready found a guy in this forum with a picture of ŽELJKO RAŽNATOVIĆ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDeljko_Ra%C5%BEnatovi%C4%87 (look up the "ROLE IN THE KOSOVO WAR" on the link,) saying how proud the commy is about his bloody buddy, and the fact that the war began on a football match between Dinamo and crvena zvezda (the red star...no no they are not comunists...right) tells me that theese are actually nice people, no miss I will never shut the fuck up, as long as I remember

oh and congradz on your 1000 hit Sam

sipptaroowsky
06-23-2008, 05:10 AM
come on, there's no fucking reason why should one 19 year old argue about this....ahm...you act like you're 15....





spreading the national hate...? hmmmm.....



mine , too......that's what I' talking about...

You have a heart???? Oh a wise argument, my age really is an issue here,.. I'll tell you what, I'll be quiet for the next 21 years (that ok? I can make it 31..) and then when I get "old enough to talk about genocide" we'll have a nice civil confersation,.well have a blasting laugh about my friend....(he imigrated here when the war started since his house was burryed to the ground and his aunt died after a 23 hour rape....her fault obviously) he wasn't the only one, 30 percent of my class was from bosnia, they lost theyr houses, familly....e.c.t. those little burryal ground, oh they are funny, 200 people with no name and no adress in a same grave, all shot through the head,,,FUNNYYYYYYY. National hate....? more like education, you see this people don't know why KOSOVO wants out of your heaven on earth, they don't know about balcan politics, and you'd like to keep it that way, well I don't. I for one am not ashamed of my acts, or those of my elders, the fact that we call it HOMELAND WAR and you call it WAR IN CROATIA is another + to my theory http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Croatian_War_of_Independence I don't know why you don't want to talk about your history, and by the way you never sayd I lied...looking forward to your next post, or have you "matured" enough to ignore me

shanna_guarana
06-23-2008, 05:13 AM
Indeed, but you see the Serbs don't want you to talk about the "cleaning" they did, and this thing didn't happen that much long ago, 1991-1995, you would think that a place like Europe is a place of peace, art, love....bullshit. Now he/she/it is telling me to shut the fuck up....I agree it's a powerfull argument, but he/she/it knows that I am right, she wants it all to be forgoten, let's forgive, let's move on, don't dwelve on the past, while in the meanwhile they hang our national heroes, send them to worlds trial with the evidenc that has been proven fake OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN,...and then some 50 years go by and the fuckers are back again, doing the same genocide that's been going on for a tousand years..now I don't hate all of you eastern fucks, but the fact that your present president is a desciple of your former comunist butcher, the fact that I allready found a guy in this forum with a picture of ŽELJKO RAŽNATOVIĆ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDeljko_Ra%C5%BEnatovi%C4%87 (look up the "ROLE IN THE KOSOVO WAR" on the link,) saying how proud the commy is about his bloody buddy, and the fact that the war began on a football match between Dinamo and crvena zvezda (the red star...no no they are not comunists...right) tells me that theese are actually nice people, no miss I will never shut the fuck up, as long as I remember

what exactly do you remember..?! you were 5 then! come on! I don't give a shit about are you going to forgive it or not....cause I wasn't even born then, or yes I was, but I was a baby..I'm not the part of it....but neither you are!....all I wanted to say is that I don't want our people to fight and all...and they don't usually do it...but there will always be loose-minded people like you...there are plenty of them in my country....but they are over 20 usually.......I hope that your country will forgive you......

shanna_guarana
06-23-2008, 05:20 AM
Oh a wise argument, my age really is an issue here,.. I'll tell you what, I'll be quiet for the next 21 years (that ok? I can make it 31..) and then when I get "old enough to talk about genocide" we'll have a nice civil confersation,.well have a blasting laugh about my friend....(he imigrated here when the war started since his house was burryed to the ground and his aunt died after a 23 hour rape....her fault obviously) those little burryal ground, oh they are funny, 200 people with no name and no adress in a same grave, all shot through the head,,,FUNNYYYYYYY. National hate....? more like education, you see this people don't know why KOSOVO wants out of your heaven on earth, they don't know about balcan politics, and you'd like to keep it that way, well I don't.

I didn't say that something here is funny......
well I don't know about their countries, cause I hate geography, and I don't give a fuck about their politics, cause I hate it anyway....so why should they on earth give a fuck abut mine...?

sipptaroowsky
06-23-2008, 05:35 AM
I didn't say that something here is funny......
well I don't know about their countries, cause I hate geography, and I don't give a fuck about their politics, cause I hate it anyway....so why should they on earth give a fuck abut mine...?

well when you're a member of EARTH, the crap that goes od it is your consern, you see if the U.S. sayd they don't give a fuck about what's going on in Croatia, Bosnia, Serbia e.c.t. there might have been much more victims, and I didn't say I remember crap from back in those days, but I know what happened, I didn't say nothing that might encourage someone to fight, I was nearly educating, You should try that some day, insted of putting war in Croatia as a national pride in your school books,

shanna_guarana
06-23-2008, 10:05 AM
omg.....you will never catch the point....
it's not my fault.....I didn't vote for miloshevic, I was a baby then! So were all the people in my country that are under 25....I mean 1/3 of the nation......do you understand? those who voted for that miloshevic system are now old and lost....why are you arguing with me? I"ve already been through some kind of hell when we were bombarded....and I've paid for something I didn't do.....If it makes you happy, all the kids from Serbia, paid for the crime and genocide they didn't have anything to do with....that's what I REMEMBER, and probably never will forget, but I don't talk about it cause there is no point...that's why I hate politics and nationalism...I like Croatia and it's a pity I can't go there to the seaside...cause it's not safe...probably from people like you....I've can only hear about it from my dad.....I should probably argue with miloshevic and other politicians but arguing with young people....no point really....
you have too much energy.....but spending it in a wrong way.....

sipptaroowsky
06-23-2008, 11:13 AM
omg.....you will never catch the point....
it's not my fault.....I didn't vote for miloshevic, I was a baby then! So were all the people in my country that are under 25....I mean 1/3 of the nation......do you understand? those who voted for that miloshevic system are now old and lost....why are you arguing with me? I"ve already been through some kind of hell when we were bombarded....and I've paid for something I didn't do.....If it makes you happy, all the kids from Serbia, paid for the crime and genocide they didn't have anything to do with....that's what I REMEMBER, and probably never will forget, but I don't talk about it cause there is no point...that's why I hate politics and nationalism...I like Croatia and it's a pity I can't go there to the seaside...cause it's not safe...probably from people like you....I've can only hear about it from my dad.....I should probably argue with miloshevic and other politicians but arguing with young people....no point really....
you have too much energy.....but spending it in a wrong way.....

violence doesn't make me happy, ever, you first started arguing with me, saying it's not the place to talk, where people listen it's the right place to talk,. I've never hurt a serb in my life so there is no reason to fear me, even thou it is better to be feared than respected. one other obstacle in the way of getting to the shore is the price, we've raised the price high becouse of all of those rich europeans out there. and if you want to take a swim in the Adriatic se here are some pointers: change the tabs on your car, or better yet come by train, don't announce your accent in front of skinnheads becouse those guys....well I'm a croat and they had a problem with hy love for Split, since Dinamo and Hajduk don't like each ther. there are serbs coming to the coast every year and they go home in ne peace. I'd advise Selce, the prices there are up to my standard, a 7 day vacation is aproximatley 1800kn or...230€,. even though the mates from your birth place which you don't like to associate with burned down most of the beauty, we are rebuilding and things are looking great, a golden age indeed. see, that's why we fought, you are welcome to come, I guarantee your safety, after all haven't you heard about the Croatian hospitality? don't you know that croat's use humor most than of all europeans, now that doesn't sound so bad no does it, then when you go to the shore, and the rocky or sandy beach is beneath your feet, that smeel of wood, in a nearby forest, half naked women walking by you (if you're in to that kind of thing), the waves pushing you to the shore, the sun shining on your face, just you and the sea,. people here listen to your music as well, the cajke (even though I think it's just....horrible taste) even that six pack crap, and I really think you'd like it here, after all, all the other people like it, what's there not to like, and don't think all the croats are bad just if you think I am, as I don't think all the serbs are good if you just appear/pretend to be, I really see no reason not to come, since you've anounced a desire to come, I'd advise you to see dubrovnik, split, rijeka, the romans went through there some tousands years ago and unlike SOMEBODY they built things, very nice things that stand to this
day, oh I love croatia

shanna_guarana
06-23-2008, 05:53 PM
violence doesn't make me happy, ever, you first started arguing with me, saying it's not the place to talk, where people listen it's the right place to talk,. I've never hurt a serb in my life so there is no reason to fear me, even thou it is better to be feared than respected. one other obstacle in the way of getting to the shore is the price, we've raised the price high becouse of all of those rich europeans out there. and if you want to take a swim in the Adriatic se here are some pointers: change the tabs on your car, or better yet come by train, don't announce your accent in front of skinnheads becouse those guys....well I'm a croat and they had a problem with hy love for Split, since Dinamo and Hajduk don't like each ther. there are serbs coming to the coast every year and they go home in ne peace. I'd advise Selce, the prices there are up to my standard, a 7 day vacation is aproximatley 1800kn or...230€,. even though the mates from your birth place which you don't like to associate with burned down most of the beauty, we are rebuilding and things are looking great, a golden age indeed. see, that's why we fought, you are welcome to come, I guarantee your safety, after all haven't you heard about the Croatian hospitality? don't you know that croat's use humor most than of all europeans, now that doesn't sound so bad no does it, then when you go to the shore, and the rocky or sandy beach is beneath your feet, that smeel of wood, in a nearby forest, half naked women walking by you (if you're in to that kind of thing), the waves pushing you to the shore, the sun shining on your face, just you and the sea,. people here listen to your music as well, the cajke (even though I think it's just....horrible taste) even that six pack crap, and I really think you'd like it here, after all, all the other people like it, what's there not to like, and don't think all the croats are bad just if you think I am, as I don't think all the serbs are good if you just appear/pretend to be, I really see no reason not to come, since you've anounced a desire to come, I'd advise you to see dubrovnik, split, rijeka, the romans went through there some tousands years ago and unlike SOMEBODY they built things, very nice things that stand to this
day, oh I love croatia

hmmmm....that was a good commercial.....but if I have to change the tabs, whisper, hide....that's not a vacation for me.....every year one Serbian car get burned, smashed, exploded.....that's not safe, you can't guaranty anything.....and I'm sorry about it......I guess I'm going to Greece again.....
And again, you talk about Serbs as a lot.....and you hate us as a lot...you hate all of Serbs......that's sick......

sipptaroowsky
06-23-2008, 11:13 PM
hmmmm....that was a good commercial.....but if I have to change the tabs, whisper, hide....that's not a vacation for me.....every year one Serbian car get burned, smashed, exploded.....that's not safe, you can't guaranty anything.....and I'm sorry about it......I guess I'm going to Greece again.....
And again, you talk about Serbs as a lot.....and you hate us as a lot...you hate all of Serbs......that's sick......

mostly the car ends up in the sea, and I'm not crazy enough to march through your roads with my atbs on, besouse, shit will happen to a Croatian in serbia aswell as the other way arount, even though I really think you've got nothing to wory about when you come to Croatia, after all we're in the tourism busynes, and it's in our interest to be polite. If you were a Macedon, you wouldn't be that safe in Greece...got the point?

shanna_guarana
06-24-2008, 06:32 AM
mostly the car ends up in the sea, and I'm not crazy enough to march through your roads with my atbs on, besouse, shit will happen to a Croatian in serbia aswell as the other way arount, even though I really think you've got nothing to wory about when you come to Croatia, after all we're in the tourism busynes, and it's in our interest to be polite. If you were a Macedon, you wouldn't be that safe in Greece...got the point?

nevermind......

Rilex
06-24-2008, 08:28 AM
I understand when you lose someone close to you.
You're usually looking for someone to blame. I've also lost my closest uncle during the war.
Some Croatian officers killed him while he was just a recruit in Yugoslavian army.
I don't know why and I don't know how. However, he shouldn't even be there…
Everything was fucked up back then, and we don't really need to have this conversation now.

I just wish that generals from both sides become arrested and punished for crimes they've been committed…

sipptaroowsky
06-24-2008, 10:06 AM
I understand when you lose someone close to you.
You're usually looking for someone to blame. I've also lost my closest uncle during the war.
Some Croatian officers killed him while he was just a recruit in Yugoslavian army.
I don't know why and I don't know how. However, he shouldn't even be there…
Everything was fucked up back then, and we don't really need to have this conversation now.

I just wish that generals from both sides become arrested and punished for crimes they've been committed…

You don't know why and you don't know how...how do you know it was by us? Our generals are beeing punished as we speak, ene though there are no evidence about theyr "crimes".while yours are in the woods.


nevermind......

that's why you haven't succided in your assault

Rilex
06-24-2008, 11:03 AM
Ti si stvarno neki težak kreten... Čovek je ubijen dok je tamo služio vojni rok...

shanna_guarana
06-24-2008, 11:12 AM
I'm just so sick of this conversation, talking with person whose point is to stand till the end no matter is he right or not....like a 10 year old.....

sipptaroowsky
06-24-2008, 01:16 PM
Ti si zaista neki teški kreten... Čovijek je ubijen kad je tamo "služio vojni rok"...

When you talk to me, adress me in English or Croatian, I don't speak Serbiam mate, I think it's pathetic that you use someone you care so much about in a confersation with (by your opinion) an idiot, and by that trying to prove your point,


I'm just so sick of this conversation, talking with person whose point is to stand till the end no matter is he right or not....like a 10 year old.....

You're funny, first it was 15, now it's ten. I't called persistance,. Now the one way to SHUT ME UP as you alegedly want is to stop talking your self. You see, if there is no batlle to be fought, I will not fight,. If you want me to stop talking leave the confersation, becouse then I'll have no one to talk to. But the fact is that you're anouncing your political opinion just as I am and you want this confersation to keep on going, so I beg of you please don't stop talking, becouse I'm enjoying this confersation too much to be left out of it.

michcio086
06-24-2008, 03:11 PM
Kosovo je Srbija !

shanna_guarana
06-24-2008, 06:09 PM
When you talk to me, adress me in English or Croatian, I don't speak Serbiam mate, I think it's pathetic that you use someone you care so much about in a confersation with (by your opinion) an idiot, and by that trying to prove your point,

omg.....did you really change his post? translated it into Croatian..? your sickness has no limits.....actually, you don't speak English as well....


You're funny, first it was 15, now it's ten. I't called persistance,. Now the one way to SHUT ME UP as you alegedly want is to stop talking your self. You see, if there is no batlle to be fought, I will not fight,. If you want me to stop talking leave the confersation, becouse then I'll have no one to talk to. But the fact is that you're anouncing your political opinion just as I am and you want this confersation to keep on going, so I beg of you please don't stop talking, becouse I'm enjoying this confersation too much to be left out of it.

yes, it is funny how you act and write...the thing is that when I see what new kind of retarded thing you've said, I just can't keep my mouth shut.....btw I haven't spoke to the 10 year old for a long time....this is so refreshing....

sipptaroowsky
06-25-2008, 03:54 AM
omg.....did you really change his post? translated it into Croatian..? your sickness has no limits.....actually, you don't speak English as well....



yes, it is funny how you act and write...the thing is that when I see what new kind of retarded thing you've said, I just can't keep my mouth shut.....btw I haven't spoke to the 10 year old for a long time....this is so refreshing....

hahaha, you're damn right I translated it. I'm glad I didn't insult you and that I don't scare you anymore since you're laughing at my posts,. I was woryed there for a moment, but the fact that someone's reading my "sick" posts, is a reward itself.

shanna_guarana
06-25-2008, 06:05 AM
hahaha, you're damn right I translated it. I'm glad I didn't insult you and that I don't scare you anymore since you're laughing at my posts,. I was woryed there for a moment, but the fact that someone's reading my "sick" posts, is a reward itself.

your sickness is scary and funny at the same time......I can't believe that the person like you actually exists....like I've said once....too much energy...spent in a wrong way......

sipptaroowsky
06-25-2008, 06:27 AM
your sickness is scary and funny at the same time......I can't believe that the person like you actually exists....like I've said once....too much energy...spent in a wrong way......

Scary and funny at the same time. Sounds like a horror parody. Serbian crimes being the horror and my overall worldly view being a parody.

[COLOR="darkgreen"]I usually sleep some 10 hours a day so the too much energy is out of the picture. And please tell me the name of my sickness so I could get proper treatment for it (I'm watching dr.House as we speak).

shanna_guarana
06-25-2008, 06:34 AM
Scary and funny at the same time. Sounds like a horror parody. Serbian crimes being the horror and my overall worldly view being a parody.

[COLOR="darkgreen"]I usually sleep some 10 hours a day so the too much energy is out of the picture. And please tell me the name of my sickness so I could get proper treatment for it (I'm watching dr.House as we speak).

your personality is a horror parody......and I'm not nurse nor a doctor....for further details go and visit nearest hospital.....mental problems department...

sipptaroowsky
06-25-2008, 06:59 AM
your personality is a horror parody......and I'm not nurse nor a doctor....for further details go and visit nearest hospital.....mental problems department...

hahahahah, yes...imagine

me:"oh hello doctor, I've come to you with a problem, there is an insonent brat on the offspring forum that thinks my political views on the kosovo independance and the croatian liberty war are fals, she allso calls me a funny horroric person that sound like a 15 year old and then again like a 10 year old person, now you see she's not a nurse or a doctor but she knows your job better than you"

the doctor:"is this a joke? do you think I spent 8 years in a medical colledge to listen to some brat bug me about his confersational problems? please get out of my office, and send that freek on the forum here. there might stil be hope for her."

shanna_guarana
06-27-2008, 05:26 PM
hahahahah, yes...imagine

me:"oh hello doctor, I've come to you with a problem, there is an insonent brat on the offspring forum that thinks my political views on the kosovo independance and the croatian liberty war are fals, she allso calls me a funny horroric person that sound like a 15 year old and then again like a 10 year old person, now you see she's not a nurse or a doctor but she knows your job better than you"

the doctor:"is this a joke? do you think I spent 8 years in a medical colledge to listen to some brat bug me about his confersational problems? please get out of my office, and send that freek on the forum here. there might stil be hope for her."

the new retarded thing wrote by sipptaroowsky.....

sipptaroowsky
06-29-2008, 02:57 PM
the new retarded thing wrote by sipptaroowsky.....

written .

shanna_guarana
06-29-2008, 05:17 PM
written.....

shanna_guarana
06-29-2008, 07:21 PM
btw, have you asked your mum to be here....? you don't want her to go mad..

Johnny Birdbrook
06-30-2008, 03:41 AM
since this conversation is going to lose any seriousness, i'm gonna give a little of my thoughts for a new start...

I tried to read and to understand all you guys wrote. I unfortunately do not know very much about the conflict in kosovo nor the political ways of serbia, croatia or anything...

So i don't wanna talk about that, i just wanted to share some general thoughts about that whole conversation.

First of all, as far as i heard, it actually was a good and progressive move, that the kosovo is finally "free". And everybody who complains about it, i can't understand. All over the world we got parts of countries, in which the people are opressed or threatend by the rest of the country.. and when it's finally free, many people of the bigger part of the country start to complain.
But what did change for them?? Nothin... the only ones that feel the change are the politician which lose a bit of their richness.
So the only difference is, that people who lived in war, people whose life sucked now have the chance to start a better one.. a peacful one.. so tell me, who that not to be?? you can give a fuck if the part belongs to your country or not, you got your life.. they ain't.. so let 'em have theirs..

corect me if i am wrong, as i said i've got too less information 'bout that.

another thing that disturbs me, since i also gotta deal with it (i am german), is that we ain't got anything to do we the politics of our country!
I didn't kill anybody! my country did! And I won't be ashamed for it. I always will say my opinion, i'm always gonna say that it sucks what germany did. But I'm gonna deal with it like a foreigner, 'cause that wasn't neither my country.

So I think that the very most important thing here is, that you should judge people for who they are, not for where they come from, neither for (at least not always) their political stands.

'cause if their is a conflict, most of the people support their land, of course it's a stupid way to deal with it, but you don't know what information they got, every country of course trys to sell stuff, that it's best for them.
And it couldn't be that one country has one opinion while the other has a different if the information were the same..

'cause inside we're all the same.. or could you say which country all the user are from, just after reading their posts? well i can't.

This was neither to anybody, nor to nobody.

peace

(if it was just that easy to bring peace into the world :( )

shanna_guarana
06-30-2008, 04:25 AM
since this conversation is going to lose any seriousness, i'm gonna give a little of my thoughts for a new start...

I tried to read and to understand all you guys wrote. I unfortunately do not know very much about the conflict in kosovo nor the political ways of serbia, croatia or anything...

So i don't wanna talk about that, i just wanted to share some general thoughts about that whole conversation.

bravo!....cause there's no need for you to know anything about our politics....cause we don't know anything about yours..I don't blame you....but I guess sipptaroowsky has something to say.....


First of all, as far as i heard, it actually was a good and progressive move, that the kosovo is finally "free". And everybody who complains about it, i can't understand. All over the world we got parts of countries, in which the people are opressed or threatend by the rest of the country.. and when it's finally free, many people of the bigger part of the country start to complain.
But what did change for them?? Nothin... the only ones that feel the change are the politician which lose a bit of their richness.
So the only difference is, that people who lived in war, people whose life sucked now have the chance to start a better one.. a peacful one.. so tell me, who that not to be?? you can give a fuck if the part belongs to your country or not, you got your life.. they ain't.. so let 'em have theirs..

corect me if i am wrong, as i said i've got too less information 'bout that.

this is what this thread is supposed to be about...but sipptaroowsky turned it into a national war thread....something that has nothing to do with him besides it was a war between Croatia and Serbia and something like that (I don't know and I'm not interested cause like I've said I wasn't even born then)...and he's 19 years old Croat.....like I am 15 year old Serb...he probably has nothing better to do and fights against himself inside himself all the time...again..because....either he has nothing better to do or is very sick...


another thing that disturbs me, since i also gotta deal with it (i am german), is that we ain't got anything to do we the politics of our country!
I didn't kill anybody! my country did! And I won't be ashamed for it. I always will say my opinion, i'm always gonna say that it sucks what germany did. But I'm gonna deal with it like a foreigner, 'cause that wasn't neither my country.

So I think that the very most important thing here is, that you should judge people for who they are, not for where they come from, neither for (at least not always) their political stands.

'cause if their is a conflict, most of the people support their land, of course it's a stupid way to deal with it, but you don't know what information they got, every country of course trys to sell stuff, that it's best for them.
And it couldn't be that one country has one opinion while the other has a different if the information were the same..

exactly....he always speaks to me like I represent my country...Serbian politics...politicians....I just represent myself...my likes..my thoughts.....and that's what I'm trying to point out all this time.....when I speak to him...I speak to HIM not to Croatia....I talk about his sick personality all the time.....he just hates Serbs....and can't hide that...

Johnny Birdbrook
06-30-2008, 04:41 AM
well i actually SHOULD know about the kosovo conflict and everything that happens their... most average germans do.. but i am unfotunately not someone who can take much information'bout politics n stuff :(

just beacuse i feel to far away from this, i need somethin' i am involved with.
That's why i always talk about things everybody has to deal with.. things beside politics.. things inside all of us.

I unfortunately couldn't understand the post of him that made you so upset (just couldn't get it), thats why i neither can tell he's wrong nor he's right.

The way you put it he's obviously wrong, in my opinion.
But i can't judge anybody for anything others frame him.

"he always speaks to me like I represent my country...Serbian politics...politicians....I just represent myself...my likes..my thoughts.....and that's what I'm trying to point out all this time"

ah, i totally understand your frustration right here, i hate if people see people as countries :(

i am germsan, my girlfriends from iraq, my best friend's a kurd and the other one a french... but that's only where we come from.. when we sit at the river, drinkin, laughin havin fun.. we're all the same.. and if we talk 'bout politics, we may have different opinions sometimes.. but hey.. you should have your own opinion, know need to fight, just share, learn, change.. love.

shanna_guarana
06-30-2008, 04:56 AM
politics=shit......
don't worry, sipptaroowsky will show up himself quite soon.....and you will hear his part of the story and about all the politics stuff...but I don't know how valid it is....cause he probably talks 'influenced by his nationalistic emotions'.....ooohhhh please....will he ever shut up...?!.....

sipptaroowsky
06-30-2008, 01:01 PM
No I will not. You see we settle our conflicts with conversation, you how ever miss Serbia... I do look at people as countrys, that is true, but I didn't judge you because of your origin, you did that part quite good your self. Everywhere you go people will ask you your name and your origin, and will learn from you about your country. I don't know why it is popular these days to be distanced from your birth place, to neglect all your family’s history and make one of your own, while not caring about theirs. I however embrace all my history, good and bad, I am proud by the most of it and I don't see any reasons why I shouldn’t. Politics are not shit, politics are an order that keeps us disciplined and organized, without that we're just a society of anarchist doing what they like, without any consequences. People are shit, and PEOPLE gave politics a bad name, also the GUNS KILL MYTH...guns don't pull the tigers and so on. And the age question. Woman, what are you talking about? How old am I supposed to be to talk to you about Balkan relations? If you don't have a good argument, MAYBE you should sustain your self from speech.

shanna_guarana
06-30-2008, 05:31 PM
No I will not. You see we settle our conflicts with conversation, you how ever miss Serbia... I do look at people as countrys, that is true, but I didn't judge you because of your origin, you did that part quite good your self. Everywhere you go people will ask you your name and your origin, and will learn from you about your country. I don't know why it is popular these days to be distanced from your birth place, to neglect all your family’s history and make one of your own, while not caring about theirs. I however embrace all my history, good and bad, I am proud by the most of it and I don't see any reasons why I shouldn’t. Politics are not shit, politics are an order that keeps us disciplined and organized, without that we're just a society of anarchist doing what they like, without any consequences. People are shit, and PEOPLE gave politics a bad name, also the GUNS KILL MYTH...guns don't pull the tigers and so on. And the age question. Woman, what are you talking about? How old am I supposed to be to talk to you about Balkan relations? If you don't have a good argument, MAYBE you should sustain your self from speech.

Since people turned politics and our counties, as the whole world into shit....it's better not to talk about it...that's why we should talk about OURSELVES...our likes...dreams....cause maybe these are the only things that aren't destroyed by shit system yet......I said MAYBE aren't destroyed YET.....
And your age IS one of my arguments....you were a baby when the whole thing happened and you want to talk about it...our history books haven't spoken about it properly yet....nobody did...there are always two sides of the story......I guess time will do the thing....
AND......I'm not a woman.......I'm a girl......little miss if you like it better.....Ana....

Vikica
07-04-2008, 04:22 AM
huh! haven't been here in a while. hy guys!

since the last time I wrote about this subject, shanna_guarana and sipptaroowsky had a very big fight. well, I can't say I didn't make up my mind about the side I will choose. and thinking about it, it made me put myself in a position of some foreigner who has no idea what you guys are talking about. I've put my self in a position of some chinese =0) and read everything written to this topic.

the fact is that when Croatia wanted to get out of Yougoslavia there was such a horrible war, started and leaded by the Serbs. and another fact is than now, more than 10 years later, Serbs are the ones who protest on Kosovo getting away from Serbia.

children get their political views and ideas from their parents and older ones around them, well, that's another fact. and if a child gets constant information how bad people in Croatia or Serbia are, that child will one day more easily make his/her decision of taking that gun to kill or leaving it. (hope everyone understood what I wanted to say)

another fact is that Serbs just can't find the generals that Den Haag asked for. Serbia is not such a big country, so why is that so difficult? we found everyone of our generals and they were all sent to Den Haag. does that tell you anything about the Serbian politics?

about the Slavic nations fighting... people don't fight if they have no reason to fight it's just that some people deal with problems diplomaticaly and some people, in their lack of words, take their guns and kill everyone who doesn't share their oppinion. well, the fact is that Croats were trying to find the way to get out of Serbia in a diplomatical way, discussing but it wasn't possible.

texts about the second world war are in every school book, movies and documentary films are beeing shot. but some people here think that knowledge of political situations in past and in present of some other country than their own is not needed. well, such knowledge is called universal culture and lack of that knowledge could cost a person a lot if he/she says something in a company of foreigners in some foreign country.
everything in this world is important. you might as well say that September 11th is not important. but it is something that marked our past and it cannot be erased. and why did it happen? because of political unrest in eastern countries on asian continent. why shouldn't some european kid learn about the war in Croatia then?

every conflict starts with diverse ideas and some ideas are better and some are the worst possible. but an idea is an idea and when you believe in it can make you do things that will envolve a lot o people. and if it is a political idea, it can be deadly dangerous, as in Germany or in Croatia.

I apologized for my previous posts but now, when I thought about them, I see I haven't said anything wrong. and I didn't provoke any heatred or so. I didn't say anyone should choose sides, but it seems shanna_guarana is constantly trying to make her oppinion the right one.

Kosovo is a part of discussion where Croats move on, accepting the will of Kosovo for it's independancy and Serbs bring back the memories of their old ideas not even knowing why they fight over withdrawing such small peace od teritory. of course, withdrawing Croatia wasn't so easy as Kosovo should be. but, Croatia wasn't a part of Serbian teritory, although Serbs see it that way. Croatia was just a county in entity made from sveral countries called Yugoslavia. Yugoslavia doesn't exist anymore, so why insisting on keeping parts of it together?

and why not talking or writing about the beauty of Croatia when we have so much of it. so what is it looks like advertisement, we have more that something to show and offer.

and the last, but not the least important fact is that no matter Croatia lost the game against Turkey on European Football Championship, Serbia wasn't even competing.

thank you and cya some other time.

shanna_guarana
07-04-2008, 05:28 AM
yeap...you really spoke like a Chinese...Chinese born in Croatia....Chinese whose parents were born in Croatia...Chinese born in Croatia, whose parents were born in Croatia, and who lived in Croatia.....wait...you're a Croat then.....
Johnny, you see someone showed up with (valid?) historical part of the story...
Vikica...read your signature, get ashamed and change it immediately...according to it you shouldn't even be in the politics section..who knows...everybody can make a mistake....

Johnny Birdbrook
07-04-2008, 06:48 AM
"and the last, but not the least important fact is that no matter Croatia lost the game against Turkey on European Football Championship, Serbia wasn't even competing."


well that's pretty dump, provoking and annoying...

but the political parts i unfortunately couldn't understand, since my english isn't that good and my polotical knowledge isn either :(

i wish it wa, but im just not born for that i guess -.-

so i don't wanna say somethin that i maybe even don't think is right myself, cause i just don't now...

i just like every country to be free from war.. free from that proudness, that mostly provokes the war.. and just free from their presidents or whatever of who risk the live of their inhabitants just for money or proudness.. of course money you will never see..

and i think that you shouldn't just support your countries politics before thinkin and informin about it...

but of course you can love and be proud of your country for the good sides, like beautiful places, nice people or whatever^^
but its always important to confess that the politics suck.. if they do.. cause wars will never end if people even think its ok..

shanna_guarana
07-04-2008, 05:51 PM
well that's pretty dump, provoking and annoying...

my thought...:cool:


but im just not born for that i guess -.-

I totally understand you....


i just like every country to be free from war.. free from that proudness, that mostly provokes the war.. and just free from their presidents or whatever of who risk the live of their inhabitants just for money or proudness.. of course money you will never see..

and i think that you shouldn't just support your countries politics before thinkin and informin about it...

but of course you can love and be proud of your country for the good sides, like beautiful places, nice people or whatever^^
but its always important to confess that the politics suck.. if they do.. cause wars will never end if people even think its ok..

I really think that the politics in Serbia during '90 were wrong....that the system was wrong...but I haven't built it, and I'm not gonna let anyone talk to me as to the whole country, be ironic, say and show how much he hates me cause I'm born here where I am....I totally do NOT support Serbia's politicians and politics....but I support everything else about it......

Johnny Birdbrook
07-04-2008, 06:09 PM
"I haven't built it, and I'm not gonna let anyone talk to me as to the whole country, be ironic, say and show how much he hates me cause I'm born here where I am...."

if thats the case, you talk to very dump people.. it isn't even worth to talk to.
Everybody who judges people for where they were born, in my opinion are a pleauge to the whole world.. they mostly are the origin of unnecessary violance, hate or even war.. i get so angry if womething like that crosses my way.

I had to feel that shit myself.. i was judgedvy people because i am german.. they didn't wanted me to love my girlfriend..to see her. They didn't even knew, didn't even speak to mee,or see me.
But they knew i am german..

I won't ever except dump behaviour like that.. and i still seek the day when we all won't be judged for where we are from.


"I totally do NOT support Serbia's politicians and politics....but I support everything else about it......"

I don't know the politics and i dont know everything else.. but i see that you're able to differ patriotism (which i hate cause it means to me blinded love for everything your country does) and the ability to being proud of your own country without thinking "there's nothing better than your country, and everybody who's got another opinion sucks as well."

thats a problem we got in germany... people do not sing the german national anthem and do not show their flags at sport events.. cause they are afraid of being judged as a nazi. but we're getting cooler and cooler every WM or EM with that^^

but its still strange for many of us (including me) to sing the national anthem.. we always feel so patriotic in a bad way..

shanna_guarana
07-04-2008, 06:30 PM
if thats the case, you talk to very dump people.. it isn't even worth to talk to.

I know, but I just can't keep my mouth shut..and stay out of this discussion...I keep saying to myself...'Ana, you won't answer to him/her ever again,stop, NOW' but when I see the next even more stupid post...I just can't stop and I answer again..and again.....


I had to feel that shit myself.. i was judgedvy people because i am german.. they didn't wanted me to love my girlfriend..to see her. They didn't even knew, didn't even speak to mee,or see me.
But they knew i am german..

omg...is that your present girlfriend..?..you said she's from Iraq or sth like that....


thats a problem we got in germany... people do not sing the german national anthem and do not show their flags at sport events.. cause they are afraid of being judged as a nazi. but we're getting cooler and cooler every WM or EM with that^^

but its still strange for many of us (including me) to sing the national anthem.. we always feel so patriotic in a bad way..

I really didn't know that Germany has problems like this.....I thought that Germany has no problems at all...but you know....I hate history and politics....:D

Vikica
07-05-2008, 09:30 AM
I have nothing against Serbia ir the Serbs. it's just I can't tolerate the politics that wont let people live free from it in their own way. young people should be working on finding the way to liberate people and not fight over it. I can't say Croats are perfect but we seek to have fun in everything we do. positivity is our main card.

shanna_guarana, maybe we could have a coffe some time in the future and discuss these problem we started to fight over.

Keyser
07-05-2008, 12:28 PM
Independent Kosovo is a bad idea. As soon as the NATO soldiers leave the albanians will try to complete their ethnic cleansing of Serbs which they have been done for decades now. EU and NATO even cooperate now with that by not letting Serbian immigrants return to their birth ground, while they promote albanians (which not only came from Kosovo but also from albania) to go there. Besides this its also a bad signal to albanians who live in Macedonia, things could get messy there aswell (I wonder what position the west will take in that situation, since they cant label Macedonians as OMG EV1L S3RBS!!11). And when Greece (a NATO ally) gets involved (with their albanian minority) I wonder if the albanians will get their independence so quickly as in Kosovo.

But hey, what to expect if the leader of Albanian terrorists Hacim Taci is friends with former US minister of forgein affairs Allbright.

Llamas
07-05-2008, 02:29 PM
Wow, this thread makes me very sad. :( I hate when Croatians and Serbs fight over politics. Last year, I lived in a flat with a Croatian, a Bosnian, and a Serb. We all got along just fine, and nobody judged each other because of where they were from.

Shanna whatever, it is fully ignorant and stupid to say that you shouldn't care about anything you were young/not alive for. I wasn't alive for either World War, but I care about what happened during them. Things that happened in the past have lasting effects; they don't just go away. Sipptarwoosky or whatever didn't initially get everybody off topic... she/he said a couple things that were off topic, but the majority was on topic. Then you came and pulled out those off topic things and went nuts.

Croatians, Serbs and Bosnians all speak the same language, and have VERY similar cultures. Really the only major differences are in the governments. Serbians that I have met in the past, while I have nothing against anyone based on nationality, have been the most closed-minded in regard to people not from Serbia. As an American, Croatians and Bosnians were far nicer to me than Serbs... and to each other. It made me very sad to feel so much tension from people who are of such similar histories.

Anyway, I'm glad Kosovo has been recognized as independent. There is no real reason it SHOULDN'T be independent... it's just the Serbs who feel too much nationalism and think that, since it was part of Serbia's history, it should never be independent. I doubt anyone could ever give me a convincing reason why it shouldn't be independent.

shanna_guarana
07-05-2008, 06:08 PM
Shanna whatever, it is fully ignorant and stupid to say that you shouldn't care about anything you were young/not alive for. I wasn't alive for either World War, but I care about what happened during them. Things that happened in the past have lasting effects; they don't just go away.

Nobody spoke properly about that war yet...even books didn't...two sides-two stories.....and maybe it is stupid, but I hate history...


Sipptarwoosky or whatever didn't initially get everybody off topic... she/he said a couple things that were off topic, but the majority was on topic. Then you came and pulled out those off topic things and went nuts.

spreading the national hate isn't off topic..? ok.....


Croatians, Serbs and Bosnians all speak the same language, and have VERY similar cultures. Really the only major differences are in the governments. Serbians that I have met in the past, while I have nothing against anyone based on nationality, have been the most closed-minded in regard to people not from Serbia. As an American, Croatians and Bosnians were far nicer to me than Serbs... and to each other. It made me very sad to feel so much tension from people who are of such similar histories.

like you said...IN THE PAST...try coming to Serbia nowadays....my country has become a real kiss-ass...they'll probably give you a hotel room for free cause you're from US....just to make you come back.....arhh...


Anyway, I'm glad Kosovo has been recognized as independent. There is no real reason it SHOULDN'T be independent... it's just the Serbs who feel too much nationalism and think that, since it was part of Serbia's history, it should never be independent. I doubt anyone could ever give me a convincing reason why it shouldn't be independent.

answer:


Independent Kosovo is a bad idea. As soon as the NATO soldiers leave the albanians will try to complete their ethnic cleansing of Serbs which they have been done for decades now. EU and NATO even cooperate now with that by not letting Serbian immigrants return to their birth ground, while they promote albanians (which not only came from Kosovo but also from albania) to go there. Besides this its also a bad signal to albanians who live in Macedonia, things could get messy there aswell (I wonder what position the west will take in that situation, since they cant label Macedonians as OMG EV1L S3RBS!!11). And when Greece (a NATO ally) gets involved (with their albanian minority) I wonder if the albanians will get their independence so quickly as in Kosovo.

But hey, what to expect if the leader of Albanian terrorists Hacim Taci is friends with former US minister of forgein affairs Allbright.

sipptaroowsky
07-06-2008, 04:37 AM
spreading the national hate isn't off topic..? ok.....

Only a Serb will interpret a Croats love for his country as an act of nationalism, and hate.


Croatians, Serbs and Bosnians all speak the same language, and have VERY similar cultures. Really the only major differences are in the governments. Serbians that I have met in the past, while I have nothing against anyone based on nationality, have been the most closed-minded in regard to people not from Serbia. As an American, Croatians and Bosnians were far nicer to me than Serbs... and to each other. It made me very sad to feel so much tension from people who are of such similar histories.
.

Here we have an expression, roughly translated it would mean :“Three peoples, three religions, three destinies“. We are much different, the Serbs were much influenced by the Turkish and to a great degree by the Russkys, the Croatians were much influenced by Italy, Germany and the catholic church and Bosna was pretty much influenced by everyone, this quote I made is much relight exactly to Bosna. The Cros and the Bos's get along because we always got along, we were always at peace, when you have a mutual enemy people put aside their differences and form an alliance for survival (I am talking about the war that is, not the present day, I wouldn't want SOMEBODY to get offended by the ENEMY word, it's such an ugly word, inhuman...(sarcasm)). And the language....hahahahaha, that's always been Europe's arrogant view of the Balkans saying:“ Why do you fight about your territory and your language since you're all the same people“...Why don't the Swiss, Germans, Austrians... unite in one great country since they obviously speak the same language and have the same history...because it's not the truth. I live in Podravina and I tend to show that to people, I'm not one of those new breeds that adjust to the conversation...When I start talking with my accent, when I get those „old school“words from my mouth, people look at me curiously. They can't understand what I'm talking about. I live some 500km from Dalmatia which is in the same country as mine and when I hear them talk, it takes me a few minutes to interpret a single sentence, when I speak to Međimurec which is not more than a 100km from my place...well we laugh at each others words and accents. I've noticed this when I got to college, how we are all different and managed to get along, except the Serbs of course. But not even now that isn't the problem, since very much of us are open minded and are willing to forgive. It's the idiots that tend to rewrite history that we disagree with, the GREAT SERBS, with their fists on their heads, and the red star on the hat. A year ago there was this MTV awards, you all remember Amy Winehouse with her „nose job“on the stage. Well we have MTV Adria, and it was transmitted to our TV, we had our own Balkan awards, a representative from the Slo, Bos, Cro and Ser. The Ser got the prize and I remember the stupid fuck sayind: “I want to thank to the whole world for this prize, and the world is Serbia“. What a proud guy. Also one proud guy...I remember...on a football match Serbia vs. Croatia. I don't know his name but the goy scored a goal, and the crud goes wild. Instead of going running to his supporters, he turns to Croats, makes an imaginary machine gun out of his two hands, shaking his hanks toward the Croat supporters pretending to shoot at them from the machine gun. Sad sad sad.


Independent Kosovo is a bad idea. As soon as the NATO soldiers leave the albanians will try to complete their ethnic cleansing of Serbs which they have been done for decades now. EU and NATO even cooperate now with that by not letting Serbian immigrants return to their birth ground, while they promote albanians (which not only came from Kosovo but also from albania) to go there. Besides this its also a bad signal to albanians who live in Macedonia, things could get messy there aswell (I wonder what position the west will take in that situation, since they cant label Macedonians as OMG EV1L S3RBS!!11). And when Greece (a NATO ally) gets involved (with their albanian minority) I wonder if the albanians will get their independence so quickly as in Kosovo.

But hey, what to expect if the leader of Albanian terrorists Hacim Taci is friends with former US minister of forgein affairs Allbright.

Visit the toilet and flush your words.

Keyser
07-06-2008, 07:52 AM
Thats a great comeback of you, you dont have anything better then that? If you believe Kosovo albanians are so innocent you're obviously blind. They have been commiting crimes against Serbian civilians in Kosovo LONG before the war in 98. Should Serbia reward that with a free country?

sipptaroowsky
07-06-2008, 08:09 AM
Thats a great comeback of you, you dont have anything better then that? If you believe Kosovo albanians are so innocent you're obviously blind. They have been commiting crimes against Serbian civilians in Kosovo LONG before the war in 98. Should Serbia reward that with a free country?

No one's innocent, but it is much healthyer to keep them apart than lock them in a cage together

shanna_guarana
07-06-2008, 08:55 AM
Only a Serb will interpret a Croats love for his country as an act of nationalism, and hate.

hmmmm......



and let's not forget the good things about serbiA, the proud people, the great history of peace and prosper, theyr loving nature, cultural behaviour during football maches...btw I'm being sarcastic

remember these words..? this is where it all began...this is how you show you love your country..? an interesting way to do it....


When you talk to me, adress me in English or Croatian, I don't speak Serbiam mate

and what about this one...? another interesting way to do it...



please don't stop talking, becouse I'm enjoying this confersation too much to be left out of it.

and this is when you said you even enjoy doing this.....



The Cros and the Bos's get along because we always got along, we were always at peace, when you have a mutual enemy people put aside their differences and form an alliance for survival (I am talking about the war that is, not the present day, I wouldn't want SOMEBODY to get offended by the ENEMY word, it's such an ugly word, inhuman...(sarcasm)).

don't talk shit all time....'btw I'm being sarcastic'...'this was sarcastic'...'sarcastic of course'.....just say you hate Serbs and lets finish this conversation....


A year ago there was this MTV awards, you all remember Amy Winehouse with her „nose job“on the stage. Well we have MTV Adria, and it was transmitted to our TV, we had our own Balkan awards, a representative from the Slo, Bos, Cro and Ser. The Ser got the prize and I remember the stupid fuck sayind: “I want to thank to the whole world for this prize, and the world is Serbia“. What a proud guy.[/COLOR]

What's wrong with that..? She (it was Aleksandra Kovac btw) said/meant that finally something good happened to Serbia....for the first time after 20 years...I don't get it...Now you are the one who hates when a person likes it's country...try to control sometimes....


Visit the toilet and flush your words.

you cant even stand the other side's opinion.....

sipptaroowsky
07-06-2008, 10:03 AM
hmmmm......




remember these words..? this is where it all began...this is how you show you love your country..? an interesting way to do it....



and what about this one...? another interesting way to do it...




and this is when you said you even enjoy doing this.....




don't talk shit all time....'btw I'm being sarcastic'...'this was sarcastic'...'sarcastic of course'.....just say you hate Serbs and lets finish this conversation....



What's wrong with that..? She (it was Aleksandra Kovac btw) said/meant that finally something good happened to Serbia....for the first time after 20 years...I don't get it...Now you are the one who hates when a person likes it's country...try to control sometimes....



you cant even stand the other side's opinion.....

It was a male, not a female, on the mtv.
Miss Ana I would like to apologies to you
For the possible pain that I might have caused you
To feel. I see now that some things are not open
For debate. I see that there are things you don't
Understand about me, and of course there are things
I possibly don't understand about you, so I apologize
For some of my assumptions and words that might have
Caused you emotional pain. I sincerely apologize.

I didn't say that I was spreading hate or even enjoying that, I
Was merely pointing out that I like to talk about the forbidden
Themes. You also say how things supposedly began, well you also
Participated in the conversation, so I see you are doing the same thing
That you think separate you from me, while in the process proving me
Right. I wrote many times the „I was being sarcastic“ because I realized
That you pretty much don't know what are we talking about here
Since your judgment (in my perceptive skills) is clouded by outer
Influence, the popular opinion. I don't know what's this talk
About control, I think you left off course a little bit there, I
Just want to express my opinion, while you write, I write.

Vikica
07-06-2008, 12:31 PM
every time a Croat says something against Serbs or Serbia it's spreading the national hate. but when a Serb starts to say Croats are just a bunch of crap, it's not what shanna_guarana called ''the national hate'', it's just the serbian way to say how much they love Croats and Croatia.

sipptaroowsky
07-06-2008, 04:32 PM
every time a Croat says something against Serbs or Serbia it's spreading the national hate. but when a Serb starts to say Croats are just a bunch of crap, it's not what shanna_guarana called ''the national hate'', it's just the serbian way to say how much they love Croats and Croatia.

You know what Viki, you're right,. I don't know what I was thinking apologizing to her,. I aint gonna hide the fact that I’m a happy Cro, and I really don’t care much if Anka Partizanka thinks low of me, I know the truth, and I’m not gonna be ashamed of speaking it out loud. Thank you Vikica.

Keyser
07-06-2008, 04:37 PM
No one's innocent, but it is much healthyer to keep them apart than lock them in a cage together

Agree with that. Tough I think they way things are solved now are a good source for clashes in the future. And thats not a pleasant thing, neither for the Serbs or the albanians.

shanna_guarana
07-06-2008, 05:37 PM
It was a male, not a female, on the mtv.
Miss Ana I would like to apologies to you
For the possible pain that I might have caused you
To feel. I see now that some things are not open
For debate. I see that there are things you don't
Understand about me, and of course there are things
I possibly don't understand about you, so I apologize
For some of my assumptions and words that might have
Caused you emotional pain. I sincerely apologize.

You haven't caused any kind of pain to me....


every time a Croat says something against Serbs or Serbia it's spreading the national hate. but when a Serb starts to say Croats are just a bunch of crap, it's not what shanna_guarana called ''the national hate'', it's just the serbian way to say how much they love Croats and Croatia.

who actually said that Croats are just a bunch of crap..? quote that..


[COLOR="SeaGreen"]You know what Viki, you're right,. I don't know what I was thinking apologizing to her,. I aint gonna hide the fact that I’m a happy Cro, and I really don’t care much if Anka Partizanka thinks low of me, I know the truth, and I’m not gonna be ashamed of speaking it out loud. Thank you Vikica.

It was too impossible that you did it anyway....and no, you're not happy...if you feel a need to say that you hate somebody loudly...you're not a happy person then...so go on...speak it loud! say how much you hate Serbs, you're not ashamed of it, are you? it won't hit me anyway..

Llamas
07-06-2008, 09:25 PM
Sipptar whatever: I definitely wasn't saying you're all the same people, or that you should all agree on everything. I know English isn't your first language, so you probably misunderstood me. What I was saying is that it's silly to hate a nation that is similar to your own. It's like Americans who hate Canada. No, we're not exactly the same. We're different people, but we have a LOT in common. In general, I think it's stupid to hate any nation, though. People are not nations.



Nobody spoke properly about that war yet...even books didn't...two sides-two stories.....and maybe it is stupid, but I hate history...
Hating history is fine; telling people they shouldn't care about anything they weren't born for is just stupid.




spreading the national hate isn't off topic..? ok.....
Her initial post did no such thing. However, you've been doing the same thing.




like you said...IN THE PAST...try coming to Serbia nowadays....my country has become a real kiss-ass...they'll probably give you a hotel room for free cause you're from US....just to make you come back.....arhh...
In the past = last year. I doubt the general view toward Americans has gone from hostile to loving in one year.

Vikica
07-07-2008, 03:09 AM
who actually said that Croats are just a bunch of crap..? quote that..



I didn't say that someone on this forum said it, but Serbs are trying to make public such opinion about Croats everywhere they can and on any possible way. and why should I quote anything I say? there's life besides this forum, you know?

shanna_guarana
07-07-2008, 05:44 AM
In general, I think it's stupid to hate any nation, though. People are not nations.

Amen to that.


Hating history is fine; telling people they shouldn't care about anything they weren't born for is just stupid.

ok, then, he probably should care about that war, but as we can see he haven't got the real point....all that he have learned from it is that he should hate Serbs for the rest of his life...that's why letting him to learn and informing him about it was a big mistake....



Her initial post did no such thing.

I quoted his words...


However, you've been doing the same thing.

EXCUSE ME....???



In the past = last year. I doubt the general view toward Americans has gone from hostile to loving in one year.

dunno....Belgrade is like a huge kiss-ass nowadays....


I didn't say that someone on this forum said it, but Serbs are trying to make public such opinion about Croats everywhere they can and on any possible way. and why should I quote anything I say? there's life besides this forum, you know?

well it's clear now that you haven't read any of my posts but the ones on this page....cause in that case you would know that said


all I wanted to say is that I don't want our people to fight and all...and they don't usually do it...but there will always be loose-minded people like you...there are plenty of them in my country....

so, I KNOW that there are lots of people in my country that act like sipptaroowsky, or even you...AND I don't think they're normal, AND I say(d) they're sick bastards that won't let this country move on...AND I think that's national hate spreading.....
If you're talking with ME, about MY thoughts on THIS forum then you have to stand behind everything you say....and quoting is the only way to prove that you're not talking bullshit...like you did...

sipptaroowsky
07-07-2008, 11:34 AM
How do you intent to move on while Kosovo is a crime nest with thousands of people living in poverty, while in the mean time you won’t allow them to live in a country that would at least admit them as people.

Llamas
07-07-2008, 01:24 PM
This was sipptaroowsky's original post:


why not talk about it, what are you ashamed of ..FREEDOM? that's a reason more to talk about it, if Croatia was addmited by the world sooner there would be much less dead homeprotectors (domobrani jel), becouse the world wouldn't be blind to the problems of a legal country. I don't know how many of you know this but life in kosovo...people live in the streets, alot of people. you can't say.. it's not my problem, you have to act, you have to chose a side, we can't all be switzerland, I for one don't want to be. I remember in '95 I think, when mom watched the news, and at the end there was a list of countrys who addmited Croatia as a legal country, my mother was crying and sayd:"if they did this 5 years ago, we would be visiting your aunt in SREBRENICA now". for those of you who don't know, srebrenica is a place where the serbs commited the "crime agains humanity", the biggest masacre in europe since the second world war. they were "cleaning" the place from all the people who are not serbs, and then we are triald for it, we are the nazis, if people want a coutry give it to them, a country should not be a prison, if you want to leave leave, don't put them in prison later for defending theyr home land, and let's not forget the good things about serbiA, the proud people, the great history of peace and prosper, theyr loving nature, cultural behaviour during football maches...btw I'm being sarcastic

There is nothing hateful in that post whatsoever. What I'm seeing is mostly saying that it's a good thing for Kosovo to become an independent state, and that it was a great thing when Croatia became its own. The very last sentence was sarcastic and tongue in cheek, but by no means hateful. I would say similar things about Austrians, how they're incredibly unfriendly, rude, closed off, and unable to have fun. But I don't hate Austrians. There are just some things in their culture and attitude I dislike, as I'm sure there are things in American culture that Austrians dislike a lot.

In short, sipp's first post was not hateful toward Serbians at all. I think you just overreacted.

sipptaroowsky
07-07-2008, 01:44 PM
This was sipptaroowsky's original post:



There is nothing hateful in that post whatsoever. What I'm seeing is mostly saying that it's a good thing for Kosovo to become an independent state, and that it was a great thing when Croatia became its own. The very last sentence was sarcastic and tongue in cheek, but by no means hateful. I would say similar things about Austrians, how they're incredibly unfriendly, rude, closed off, and unable to have fun. But I don't hate Austrians. There are just some things in their culture and attitude I dislike, as I'm sure there are things in American culture that Austrians dislike a lot.

In short, sipp's first post was not hateful toward Serbians at all. I think you just overreacted.

Indeed, I just pointed out what happened the last time someone stood up to our eastern buddies. And it's not hate, when someone talks about hitleR and the Second World War, no one blames them of hating Germany, they're just saying what happened, a genocide. When I talk about Serbia, I don't put hate upon it, I'm just stating the obvious, genocide. And the fact that certain Serb politicians have statements like :“We're not letting Kosovo leave, Kosovo is Serbia“ instead of asking them why they want to leave (they know why) shows that they haven't grown much, they haven't admitted their mistakes. First Bosnia and Herzegovina and Croatia leave, then Slovenia and Macedonia, then Monte Negro, and now Kosovo. Now looking at this objectively is it possible, just a slight possibility that all of us are wrong and Serbs and only Serbs are right?

If I did make some hateful thoughts, which I most certainly didn't, they were not pointed out to a nation, they were pointed out to individuals with frightening comments like; let's not talk about it, you're too young to understand, and similar. Why not talk about it, give me one good reason not to talk about it.

shanna_guarana
07-07-2008, 06:06 PM
This was sipptaroowsky's original post:



There is nothing hateful in that post whatsoever. What I'm seeing is mostly saying that it's a good thing for Kosovo to become an independent state, and that it was a great thing when Croatia became its own. The very last sentence was sarcastic and tongue in cheek, but by no means hateful. I would say similar things about Austrians, how they're incredibly unfriendly, rude, closed off, and unable to have fun. But I don't hate Austrians. There are just some things in their culture and attitude I dislike, as I'm sure there are things in American culture that Austrians dislike a lot.

In short, sipp's first post was not hateful toward Serbians at all. I think you just overreacted.

hahaha....you're funny....it wasn't hateful toward Serbians AT ALL..? oh please...no, he wanted to say that he even likes Serbia.:rolleyes:...come on...
In the end, why don't you ask him if he hates Serbia, or to be more clear, Serbs...cause every time I had indirectly asked him, he ignored that....if the answer's no...he would say that...


Indeed, I just pointed out what happened the last time someone stood up to our eastern buddies. And it's not hate, when someone talks about hitleR and the Second World War, no one blames them of hating Germany, they're just saying what happened, a genocide. When I talk about Serbia, I don't put hate upon it, I'm just stating the obvious, genocide. And the fact that certain Serb politicians have statements like :“We're not letting Kosovo leave, Kosovo is Serbia“ instead of asking them why they want to leave (they know why) shows that they haven't grown much, they haven't admitted their mistakes. First Bosnia and Herzegovina and Croatia leave, then Slovenia and Macedonia, then Monte Negro, and now Kosovo. Now looking at this objectively is it possible, just a slight possibility that all of us are wrong and Serbs and only Serbs are right?

ok, this is how I see the things...
Kosovo before 10 years= 20% Albanians+ 80% Serbs......Kosovo now=90% Albanians+ 10% Serbs...........some Serbs died, some sold their houses and moved, cause they saw a better chance nearer Belgrade....and why they saw a better chance somewhere else..? cause they had no jobs and were poor...and why they had no jobs and were poor ..? That's where the politics part comes.....politicians....they started to sell companies to Albanians, cause they gave a lot of money...more than Serbs....so it was all about money....I blame stupid Serbian politicians for that.....and then...Albanians want Albanians to work for them, cause if they have to pay someone, it's better to pay Albanian....and then when Serbs lost their jobs....they started to move from the towns....and then they sold their houses to Albanians, again, cause they were the only ones who wanted to buy them.....and that's how Albanians grew stronger on Kosovo....and that's sad.....cause now, all the Serbs that are left live in villages kilometers from towns...most of them with no jobs and no chance to get it....and Albanians want independence....of whose country..? nobody there asks Serbs what they need...and some of them need elementary things for life like electricity..And what the fuck can they expect from the Albanian people...? they are even afraid to come to other towns...to the capital...I remember it was 5 years ago I think, maybe more... when hundreds of them , in one night, burned hundreds of Serbian houses...almost all that left...I see nobody speaks now about that night...but i can clearly remember the pictures on tv....sad..scary....is that what the one country should be like..? And it's all our fault...our own.....I mean...Serbian politicians....and to be clear...I have nothing against Albanians.....but their politicians..


If I did make some hateful thoughts, which I most certainly didn't, they were not pointed out to a nation, they were pointed out to individuals with frightening comments like; let's not talk about it, you're too young to understand, and similar. Why not talk about it, give me one good reason not to talk about it. [/COLOR]

you always talked to me like to the whole country.....

sipptaroowsky
07-07-2008, 11:17 PM
I do not hate Serbia or Serbians. From the words you wrote about Albania I come to a conclusion that you hate Albanians.

shanna_guarana
07-08-2008, 06:28 AM
I do not hate Serbia or Serbians. From the words you wrote about Albania I come to a conclusion that you hate Albanians.

I clearly said that I have nothing against Albanians....if Germany was the country next to the Kosovo, the same thing would happen...as like if it was any other country..Hungary, Austria, Swiss, any country.....talking about Serbian politicians....about how they have sold their own country....

Vikica
07-08-2008, 12:42 PM
shanna, most of the times you to speak of things you don't know anything about. please, don't persist on Croats hating Serbs and Serbia. I think you left an impression on other people here you hate Croats and I think you just envy us 'cause we are so positive about everything and on the fact that we've moved on after the 1995.

about the Albanians and Serbs...
in 1988 there was an Albanian girl here in Zagreb in a hospital for femine health (or however Americans call that kind of hospital). in the same room with her there were a Serbian and a Croatian woman. the Croatian woman was my mum and she asked the Albanian girl to tell her how to name some things in Albanian (stuff like apple, spoon...). the Albanian girl said she didn't understand what my mum asked and the Serbian woman came and said something like ''you understand very well but you don't want to understand'' and cursed her very ugly what I don't want to say on this forum.
the Albanian girl was frightened and didn't want to speak in her own language in front of the Serbian woman. I think this little story says a lot.

Llamas
07-08-2008, 03:19 PM
hahaha....you're funny....it wasn't hateful toward Serbians AT ALL..? oh please...no, he wanted to say that he even likes Serbia.:rolleyes:...come on...
In the end, why don't you ask him if he hates Serbia, or to be more clear, Serbs...cause every time I had indirectly asked him, he ignored that....if the answer's no...he would say that...
He just directly said he doesn't hate Serbs. And I honestly think that, because English is not your first language, you have misunderstood something in the post. There is nothing hateful in that post AT ALL.




ok, this is how I see the things...
Kosovo before 10 years= 20% Albanians+ 80% Serbs......Kosovo now=90% Albanians+ 10% Serbs...........some Serbs died, some sold their houses and moved, cause they saw a better chance nearer Belgrade....and why they saw a better chance somewhere else..? cause they had no jobs and were poor...and why they had no jobs and were poor ..? That's where the politics part comes.....politicians....they started to sell companies to Albanians, cause they gave a lot of money...more than Serbs....so it was all about money....I blame stupid Serbian politicians for that.....and then...Albanians want Albanians to work for them, cause if they have to pay someone, it's better to pay Albanian....and then when Serbs lost their jobs....they started to move from the towns....and then they sold their houses to Albanians, again, cause they were the only ones who wanted to buy them.....and that's how Albanians grew stronger on Kosovo....and that's sad.....cause now, all the Serbs that are left live in villages kilometers from towns...most of them with no jobs and no chance to get it....and Albanians want independence....of whose country..? nobody there asks Serbs what they need...and some of them need elementary things for life like electricity..And what the fuck can they expect from the Albanian people...? they are even afraid to come to other towns...to the capital...I remember it was 5 years ago I think, maybe more... when hundreds of them , in one night, burned hundreds of Serbian houses...almost all that left...I see nobody speaks now about that night...but i can clearly remember the pictures on tv....sad..scary....is that what the one country should be like..? And it's all our fault...our own.....I mean...Serbian politicians....and to be clear...I have nothing against Albanians.....but their politicians..
If this is all true, a country almost MUST move in the direction of the vast majority. It is very sad that a small portion of people must suffer, but this how most nations work. I am not particularly proud of my country, but one thing I can say for the US is that we are one of the only countries that works really hard to help minorities and immigrants. Our foreign policy does totally suck in a lot of ways, but once someone is in this country, they're likely to be treated much better than in another country. Most European countries are quite national, and don't treat foreigners too well. Foreigners are not treated well in Kosovo or Albania, sure, but they're not treated well in Serbia, either. You might think they are, but you are likely somewhat biased due to living in that country all your life.

It is also very sad that Serbs were killed by a bunch of wacko assholes, but that's one tragic event... things like that happen everywhere- minorities getting killed by those in "power". I'm not saying that makes it okay by any means, but it's not something specific you can hold against Albania.



you always talked to me like to the whole country.....[/QUOTE]

MiskoSerbia
07-08-2008, 04:23 PM
shanna, most of the times you to speak of things you don't know anything about. please, don't persist on Croats hating Serbs and Serbia. I think you left an impression on other people here you hate Croats and I think you just envy us 'cause we are so positive about everything and on the fact that we've moved on after the 1995.

about the Albanians and Serbs...
in 1988 there was an Albanian girl here in Zagreb in a hospital for femine health (or however Americans call that kind of hospital). in the same room with her there were a Serbian and a Croatian woman. the Croatian woman was my mum and she asked the Albanian girl to tell her how to name some things in Albanian (stuff like apple, spoon...). the Albanian girl said she didn't understand what my mum asked and the Serbian woman came and said something like ''you understand very well but you don't want to understand'' and cursed her very ugly what I don't want to say on this forum.
the Albanian girl was frightened and didn't want to speak in her own language in front of the Serbian woman. I think this little story says a lot.

You said that shanna speaks about things she don't know.....everything she wrote is true....and everything she said about kosovo is true and i agree with her.....btw, this story don't means anything!

shanna_guarana
07-08-2008, 05:34 PM
shanna, most of the times you to speak of things you don't know anything about.

oh, I am pretty sure that YOU know more about it......I just said everything I know, and yes, there is probably more, but these are some of the facts...


please, don't persist on Croats hating Serbs and Serbia. I think you left an impression on other people here you hate Croats and I think you just envy us 'cause we are so positive about everything and on the fact that we've moved on after the 1995.

don't be so stupid...I have no reasons to hate Croatia or it's people....indeed, I've said that I would like to go there...I think Croatia is a very beautiful country...it's your problem if you want to think I am jellous or sth....


about the Albanians and Serbs...
in 1988 there was an Albanian girl here in Zagreb in a hospital for femine health (or however Americans call that kind of hospital). in the same room with her there were a Serbian and a Croatian woman. the Croatian woman was my mum and she asked the Albanian girl to tell her how to name some things in Albanian (stuff like apple, spoon...). the Albanian girl said she didn't understand what my mum asked and the Serbian woman came and said something like ''you understand very well but you don't want to understand'' and cursed her very ugly what I don't want to say on this forum.
the Albanian girl was frightened and didn't want to speak in her own language in front of the Serbian woman. I think this little story says a lot.

oh please, that's one example of some crazy woman....does this really make sense to you...do you really believe we're all like that? If I could find that woman I could hit her in her head.....and look at yourself...you're acting like her....what an irony....


He just directly said he doesn't hate Serbs. And I honestly think that, because English is not your first language, you have misunderstood something in the post. There is nothing hateful in that post AT ALL..

nevermind...this could last for months....maybe cause he's talking about MY country...maybe that's why I think it's hateful....





If this is all true, a country almost MUST move in the direction of the vast majority. It is very sad that a small portion of people must suffer, but this how most nations work. I am not particularly proud of my country, but one thing I can say for the US is that we are one of the only countries that works really hard to help minorities and immigrants. Our foreign policy does totally suck in a lot of ways, but once someone is in this country, they're likely to be treated much better than in another country. Most European countries are quite national, and don't treat foreigners too well. Foreigners are not treated well in Kosovo or Albania, sure, but they're not treated well in Serbia, either. You might think they are, but you are likely somewhat biased due to living in that country all your life.

It is also very sad that Serbs were killed by a bunch of wacko assholes, but that's one tragic event... things like that happen everywhere- minorities getting killed by those in "power". I'm not saying that makes it okay by any means, but it's not something specific you can hold against Albania.

yeah, it is sad that the most countries do work like that...look at BiH...it's like two countries but saying it's one only on the paper...and here, they're making a new one....

Johnny Birdbrook
07-08-2008, 05:51 PM
i think it's very conspicuous that no croatien supports any serb on this froum and no serb any croation.

It makes me very sad to hear all those storys how serbs, croates and albanians hate each other :(

maybe you got different information or the countries are just not ready yet to ecept each others people.

but what really makes me sad is that you all on this froum, who are young, enlightened teens.. the future of this world.. that you all do not break the cahin of this hate.
you are the ones to change things.. and i can't belive that you are just ging on doing the same shit your elders (maybe) did.

If you shanna were born in croatia or if you vikica where born in serbia you would maybe have different opinions.. and that's something that makes me so angry.. that you can't see that those people are just born into something different!! they would be different if they were born somewhere else.. but deep inside wer're all the same.

if we had many different planets with different beings, we would all call us humans and hate the "aliens". But since we ain't got "aliens" we hate people from other countries or religions. It's all so senseless, so stupid.

wouldn't it be a great gesture, a great step forward.. if you all would start over again in a friendly way? if you would say sorry to each other, cause you obviously both did mistakes.. if just everybody would finally rethink its opinion about the people from elsewhere..

maybe im just talkin some shit, its just so hard to understand for me how people can hate so much for so less...

i really don't know how big the hate really i, but it seems that croats and serbs not really do like each other.. and if thats the case, it is a shame.. a really big shame that just exists as an unnecessary thing kept alive by YOU!!

Llamas
07-08-2008, 06:00 PM
Like I think I said before, I lived last year with a Serb, a Bosnian, and a Croatian. We never had any issues. And they were in their 20's/30's. I'd expect the younger generations to be more accepting even... but like I said before, I've definitely noticed much more hostility toward Croatians from Serbs than toward Serbs from Croatians. All my Croatian friends were cheering when Serbia won Eurovision, hahaha.

Johnny Birdbrook
07-08-2008, 06:08 PM
"I'd expect the younger generations to be more accepting even... "

yaeh, that's what i actually expected too.. and thats why i say this to them, cause we can change something, because we don't wanna be like the ones that made this world such a cruel place.. so do something to be different, do something for this world! our world..

"but like I said before, I've definitely noticed much more hostility toward Croatians from Serbs than toward Serbs from Croatians"

Yeah it seems like this is true, since some people say that... i don't know the truth, but if it is the truth, serbs should recognize it, and do something against it.. nobody has to be ashamed for this, you may always change :(

"All my Croatian friends were cheering when Serbia won Eurovision, hahaha. "

yeah, but you may also see, how some posts above a croate makes stupid comments about the EM since, serbian didn't compete...

shanna_guarana
07-09-2008, 09:13 AM
"I'd expect the younger generations to be more accepting even... "

yaeh, that's what i actually expected too.. and thats why i say this to them, cause we can change something, because we don't wanna be like the ones that made this world such a cruel place.. so do something to be different, do something for this world! our world..

this is what I AM trying to point out from the beginning...I think we should all move on, do not think of people like they're countries...to look inside, deeper....but some of us here just don't want to move on...pointing on sipptaroowsky....and I've said to him everything you Johnny have just said to all of us....but I guess you can't change people...


"but like I said before, I've definitely noticed much more hostility toward Croatians from Serbs than toward Serbs from Croatians"

Yeah it seems like this is true, since some people say that... i don't know the truth, but if it is the truth, serbs should recognize it, and do something against it.. nobody has to be ashamed for this, you may always change :(

I am ashamed...I just hope that you guys do mot think we're all like that....

sipptaroowsky
07-09-2008, 10:24 AM
i think it's very conspicuous that no croatien supports any serb on this froum and no serb any croation.!!

I don't know if you've noticed but we've been in war until 95. There's been wars in the Balkans for a thousand years, because of religion, territory, language. Serbia has attacked the entire Balkan for many many times. How many Americans support Middle Eastern cultures? How many Germans have lunch with Jews? I mean mate...wake the fuck up.


It makes me very sad to hear all those storys how serbs, croates and albanians hate each other :(

We (CRO) don't hate the albanians, we even don't hate the Serbs, we don't like them eather (the Serbs that is). Why should we?


but what really makes me sad is that you all on this froum, who are young, enlightened teens.. the future of this world.. that you all do not break the cahin of this hate.
you are the ones to change things.. and i can't belive that you are just ging on doing the same shit your elders (maybe) did.

Please, read a book. I am doing exactly the opposite from what my parents have done. You see my parents, along with Bosnians and Herzegovina’s, Monte Negro, Serbia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Kosovo, all lived together in peace in a beautiful place called Yugoslavia. What your history teacher didn’t tell you is that the Serbs got the place going on. Everything you did needed to be approved by the Serbs, like the former CCCP, with the Russians. They were oppressed every day for what they represented, and it was all going ok until they wanted to be equal with the Serbs. Somewhere around this point Ana (beautiful name by the way.) thinks I’m spreading Nationalistic hate. All the state jobs, the police, the military and all that was hold by the Serbs. If you didn’t believe in almighty Serbia (read Yugoslavia) then you would be driven away in a car and spent some time in prison, because you were the enemy of the state. When people said, give us our rights, we’re human beings dammit, that’s when things got a little messy. So in stead of denying my self the right to speak up, like my mommy and daddy, I yell it out loud. I live in Croatia now, it’s ok, no complains. And please don’t give me the “Martin Luther King speech”, this isn’t that kind of a deal. Please get your facts straight before you give us the 1000 years wars peace treaty solution. You think nobody thought about it before you? I mean did you think someone is going to read your post and change the world? Oh yes, I’m going to read this and tell it to my friend and he can tell it to his friend, and the thought it self will spread world wide and we will put down all our guns, all our history and beliefs and we will live in peace…There’s a reason they call it Hollywood, and not the world. What we need to do is act, not think of acting.


If you shanna were born in croatia or if you vikica where born in serbia you would maybe have different opinions.. and that's something that makes me so angry.. that you can't see that those people are just born into something different!! they would be different if they were born somewhere else.. but deep inside wer're all the same.

If Ana was born in Croatia then she would blame Serbs responsible for a few hundred million people they killed and if Vikica was born in Serbia then she would feel guilty for the crimes her elders committed.


wouldn't it be a great gesture, a great step forward.. if you all would start over again in a friendly way? if you would say sorry to each other, cause you obviously both did mistakes.. if just everybody would finally rethink its opinion about the people from elsewhere..


Now this part I love the most. Yes you are right it would be great, in fact let’s do it now. I want to hear Serb ringleaders apologies for thousands and thousands and thousands of people they killed (second biggest genocide in Europe singe Adolf) and then I’m going to apologies for blaming them for doing it. We’ll hold hands, in a few years we wont even remember why we fought, then we’ll have our selves another fight and apologies afterwards…again, you think nobody thought of that? I mean, I know you hear those hippies saying love and give and all that’s nice but…how do you intent to get there, it’s kind of hard if you live as a guest in someone else’s country for a few hundred years. I admire all you revolutionists, all have the goal, all want peace, stop world hunger, loving and caring, but where’s the plan, where are the schematics…your plan is let’s forgive and we’ll see where it takes us, common mate.



maybe im just talkin some shit, its just so hard to understand for me how people can hate so much for so less...

Maybe you should have started your post with that.


i really don't know how big the hate really i, but it seems that croats and serbs not really do like each other.. and if thats the case, it is a shame.. a really big shame that just exists as an unnecessary thing kept alive by YOU!!

And the Oscar goes to…I don’t feel hate for anyone, but I feel pity for some people, because they hate me. And you’re absolutely right. Why can’t Kosovo and Serbia live in one nice country? (I apologies to Ana in advance…sarcasm coming up). I mean it’s not like Albanian life isn’t worth shit in Serbia. Why shouldn’t Albanians forget all about their history, religion and beliefs, why shouldn’t they submit to a few hundred years more of Serbian politics, raze their children in poverty, tech them some Serbian language, for the sake of peace they should do it, those haters, how could they (by the way I was being sarcastic). You see how many Albanians from Kosovo replied to this thread. You would think that they would show some interest in a thread like this. Yep they’ve all got internet down there, just living it up on T1 to T3,.

Vikica
07-09-2008, 03:50 PM
hatred is not what the most of Croats feel. Croats simply don't trust Serbs. and while Sava and Danube flow, Croats will not trust Serbs. we can do business but nothing else.
Croats are a different mentality than Serbs. Croats see Serbs as a very high pitched nationality but it doesn't mean the world have to see them that way. it's just a result of years and years of Serbian acting toward the Croats which wasn't very nice. it can be described as the Serbs wanted to master Croatian teritory, being masters in someone elses yard. compliments to the exceptions.
and shanna, I haven't said in any of my posts (at least I don't remeber I have) you were stupid or that you wrote anything stupid so, please, don't say any more I wrote anything stupid because is just so childish. find another way to comment my posts.

shipptaroowsky, cmoka tebi =0X

ilovellamas, I've started liking the Americans after a long time 'cause of you. I like your diplomacy. kisses

shanna_guarana
07-09-2008, 06:00 PM
Somewhere around this point Ana (beautiful name by the way.) thinks I’m spreading Nationalistic hate. So in stead of denying my self the right to speak up, like my mommy and daddy, I yell it out loud.

thanks for the compliment...
and here is the real problem...those motherfucking politicians made a war...done some big shit, and gone....and left youth to fight , discus and argue...every new generation...for the next 100 years.....till we don't get it...that there is no more point....and that's a pity....


[COLOR="SeaGreen"]What we need to do is act, not think of acting.

We..? no, we can't do anything at all....



If Ana was born in Croatia then she would blame Serbs responsible for a few hundred million people they killed and if Vikica was born in Serbia then she would feel guilty for the crimes her elders committed.

hah...I wouldn't be so sure about her...



(I apologies to Ana in advance…sarcasm coming up).

even this was sarcastic, too, right..? :)


hatred is not what the most of Croats feel. Croats simply don't trust Serbs. and while Sava and Danube flow, Croats will not trust Serbs. we can do business but nothing else.
Croats are a different mentality than Serbs. Croats see Serbs as a very high pitched nationality but it doesn't mean the world have to see them that way. it's just a result of years and years of Serbian acting toward the Croats which wasn't very nice. it can be described as the Serbs wanted to master Croatian teritory, being masters in someone elses yard. compliments to the exceptions.
and shanna, I haven't said in any of my posts (at least I don't remeber I have) you were stupid or that you wrote anything stupid so, please, don't say any more I wrote anything stupid because is just so childish. find another way to comment my posts.

shipptaroowsky, cmoka tebi =0X

ilovellamas, I've started liking the Americans after a long time 'cause of you. I like your diplomacy. kisses

ahahahahahah....you're such a big kiss-ass....do you like this description more..?
cause I do...
I do act childish sometimes...like it or not...btw your kiss receiver acts like that...but you don't mind it......oh sorry, I forgot...nevermind

sipptaroowsky
07-09-2008, 11:27 PM
thanks for the compliment...
and here is the real problem...those motherfucking politicians made a war...done some big shit, and gone....and left youth to fight , discus and argue...every new generation...for the next 100 years.....till we don't get it...that there is no more point....and that's a pity....

I think the problem is a little more complex. Somewhere in the future the problem will be solved but not by it self. In those hundreds of years of us living together on the same land there hasn't been 50 years of peace. I really don't know why the fuck every single European nation has to attack Croatia but I guess that's our curse, but with Serbia it's a little different. It's much more personal, we have been fighting since we exist and I don't think that simply politicians are to blame. I mean sure, nowadays we blame them for everything, because most of it is in their theft hands, but when it comes down to the bottom of it I am to blame and so are you. Not for doing the bad thing, but for not doing the right one, failure to act, I think things between Croatia and Serbia are going in a good direction, you probably know of the Balkan mafia, the Balkan crimes. Well what you might not now is that in Balkan mafia all balakns work together to steal from us, so if they can unite to do such a horrible thing, so can we for the good thing. And we can do something, at least teach our offspring to have an open mind about it all. But you can't do any progress if you don't admit you've done some serious damage, and stop spreading the ideals of the great Serbia.



even this was sarcastic, too, right..? :)


Nope, sincerity all the way.


ahahahahahah....you're such a big kiss-ass....do you like this description more..?
cause I do...
I do act childish sometimes...like it or not...btw your kiss receiver acts like that...but you don't mind it......oh sorry, I forgot...nevermind

No need to feel jealous,

Vikica
07-10-2008, 01:06 AM
shanna, you really don't like me, do you? well, there's nothing I can do about it so after this post I'll simply forget you've said things about me that aren't true. withal, why don't I forget you even said anything at all to this topic.
and kisses to you to =0)

shanna_guarana
07-10-2008, 06:05 AM
I think the problem is a little more complex. Somewhere in the future the problem will be solved but not by it self. In those hundreds of years of us living together on the same land there hasn't been 50 years of peace. I really don't know why the fuck every single European nation has to attack Croatia but I guess that's our curse, but with Serbia it's a little different. It's much more personal, we have been fighting since we exist and I don't think that simply politicians are to blame. I mean sure, nowadays we blame them for everything, because most of it is in their theft hands, but when it comes down to the bottom of it I am to blame and so are you. Not for doing the bad thing, but for not doing the right one, failure to act, I think things between Croatia and Serbia are going in a good direction, you probably know of the Balkan mafia, the Balkan crimes. Well what you might not now is that in Balkan mafia all balakns work together to steal from us, so if they can unite to do such a horrible thing, so can we for the good thing. And we can do something, at least teach our offspring to have an open mind about it all.

aren't we doing it..? at least now..?


But you can't do any progress if you don't admit you've done some serious damage, and stop spreading the ideals of the great Serbia.

are you talking about me, or about Serbia..?



No need to feel jealous,

ahahahahah...


shanna, you really don't like me, do you? well, there's nothing I can do about it so after this post I'll simply forget you've said things about me that aren't true. withal, why don't I forget you even said anything at all to this topic.
and kisses to you to =0)

hold them back..

Johnny Birdbrook
07-10-2008, 05:50 PM
ok i unfortunately was away a few days so his all gets a bit confusing. im just gonna reply to the post right below my last one.

"I don't know if you've noticed but we've been in war until 95. There's been wars in the Balkans for a thousand years, because of religion, territory, language. Serbia has attacked the entire Balkan for many many times. How many Americans support Middle Eastern cultures? How many Germans have lunch with Jews? I mean mate...wake the fuck up. "

So here we got the prove, that you just don't understand, that war has nothing to do with US it is a goddamn fight of some leaders, you maybe even (shouldn't) do not support. So you got war? No! they've got their goddamn war!
So that ain't a fucking reason to not support somenone from your so called enemies! since they're not your enemies, they just live in an other country.

And you ask me how many jews have lunch with germans? Maybe you should wake the fuck up, cause we did.. every jew in germany has got german friends they have their lunch with. yeah they even marry germans.. you know what? i had a jew in my class and i didn't know.. we did well together. after a few years i asked him.. which religion do you got? he said: jewish.. me said: oh, alright. AND THATS FUCKING IT!
It's just a religion, its normal! And we know, that history is history! They don't blame us for what has been, cause we are different, we're not Hitler. I was born 40 years after he died, so i am not to blame for anything!
And now you should see, that a serb is not responsable for what the serbs government (maybe) messes up.


"We (CRO) don't hate the albanians, we even don't hate the Serbs, we don't like them eather (the Serbs that is). Why should we? "

I said the stories (told on this forum) made me said.. so thats no answer to anything. besides i didn't understand that one: we don't like them eather (the Serbs that is).
sorry, maybe its just my english...

"Please, read a book. I am doing exactly the opposite from what my parents have done. You see my parents, along with Bosnians and Herzegovina’s, Monte Negro, Serbia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Kosovo, all lived together in peace in a beautiful place called Yugoslavia. What your history teacher didn’t tell you is that the Serbs got the place going on. Everything you did needed to be approved by the Serbs, like the former CCCP, with the Russians. They were oppressed every day for what they represented, and it was all going ok until they wanted to be equal with the Serbs. Somewhere around this point Ana (beautiful name by the way.) thinks I’m spreading Nationalistic hate. All the state jobs, the police, the military and all that was hold by the Serbs. If you didn’t believe in almighty Serbia (read Yugoslavia) then you would be driven away in a car and spent some time in prison, because you were the enemy of the state. When people said, give us our rights, we’re human beings dammit, that’s when things got a little messy. So in stead of denying my self the right to speak up, like my mommy and daddy, I yell it out loud. I live in Croatia now, it’s ok, no complains. And please don’t give me the “Martin Luther King speech”, this isn’t that kind of a deal. Please get your facts straight before you give us the 1000 years wars peace treaty solution. You think nobody thought about it before you? I mean did you think someone is going to read your post and change the world? Oh yes, I’m going to read this and tell it to my friend and he can tell it to his friend, and the thought it self will spread world wide and we will put down all our guns, all our history and beliefs and we will live in peace…There’s a reason they call it Hollywood, and not the world. What we need to do is act, not think of acting."

first of all, i said a few times that i (shame on me) don't know very much of history at all.. and i feel sorry for that.
It is great that you don't shut up and do what your told, without thinking, but i think that you also blame many innocent people and thats the thing which is not alright.
Ok and then, of course i know that i say things, that have been said a million times before.. but since they're the truth and since they are a solution if just not everybody would be this ignorant, and since it like you said also has been said by martin luther king... it can't be that bad to say it again..
i am trying to live like this.. to keep peace.. to give everybody a chance, no matter where he comes from, or what he is. And IF evereybody did, the world would be way more peaceful.. so why just don't ycearm it outr loud? cause everybody already knows?.. ha.. wish it were like that.. but the world would be a pretty different.


"Now this part I love the most. Yes you are right it would be great, in fact let’s do it now. I want to hear Serb ringleaders apologies for thousands and thousands and thousands of people they killed (second biggest genocide in Europe singe Adolf) and then I’m going to apologies for blaming them for doing it. We’ll hold hands, in a few years we wont even remember why we fought, then we’ll have our selves another fight and apologies afterwards…again, you think nobody thought of that? I mean, I know you hear those hippies saying love and give and all that’s nice but…how do you intent to get there, it’s kind of hard if you live as a guest in someone else’s country for a few hundred years. I admire all you revolutionists, all have the goal, all want peace, stop world hunger, loving and caring, but where’s the plan, where are the schematics…your plan is let’s forgive and we’ll see where it takes us, common mate."

haha, i know it sounds too simple, doesn't it?
but it is simple, the whole fucking world is simple.. humans are just not born to like it simple.

"I don’t feel hate for anyone, but I feel pity for some people, because they hate me."

if you do, you do fine.

to the rest you wrote, you didn't seem to notice that my post wan't pro serbia and con albania croatia whatever. it also seems that you stiil didn't noticed that all my words didn't go to people hate the government for what they fucked up. so maybe im just gonna give you a few more tries.

greetz daBird.

oh.. and sarcarsm is just a way to reply without giving facts.. so its a defensive, to be saved from attacs, since there's less to do wrong. But i like it nevertheless, i am actually a very sarcastic person myself. But when it comes to serious things, it is sometimes better to be.. serious.

sipptaroowsky
07-11-2008, 12:54 AM
It's just a religion, its normal! And we know, that history is history! They don't blame us for what has been, cause we are different, we're not Hitler. I was born 40 years after he died, so i am not to blame for anything!
And now you should see, that a serb is not responsable for what the serbs government (maybe) messes up.

40 years ago and 13 years ago is not the same. The 40 years ago generation is pretty much vanished by now, and the 13 years ago still hold their ideals and thoughts and spread it to the younger generation.

MAYBE messed up. So genocide is maybe a bad decision? They live in democracy so they are part of the decision their „messed up government“ does. Just like the Americans say they hate bush...but who elected him. They protest against the war and they support it at the same time. You quickly judge that all people age good natured, we are all the same, we are all lovely and good, but why do some of us kill another, why is that if we're all good natured, it's not our fault or something, idiotic. From your point of view it’s nobodies fault for all the killing and torturing, and denying people their rights to live, but speaking up about it like me, “spreading the hate” oh, well THAT is just inhumane.


oh.. and sarcarsm is just a way to reply without giving facts.. so its a defensive, to be saved from attacs, since there's less to do wrong. But i like it nevertheless, i am actually a very sarcastic person myself. But when it comes to serious things, it is sometimes better to be.. serious.

Oh yes your way of expressing your self is so much better than everybody else’s, and you call your self serious. I guess there’s some hidden meaning I DIDN’T UNDERSTAND and you’re gonna talk about it. Lovely.

shanna_guarana
07-11-2008, 06:56 AM
40 years ago and 13 years ago is not the same. The 40 years ago generation is pretty much vanished by now, and the 13 years ago still hold their ideals and thoughts and spread it to the younger generation.

and you're the product of that....


MAYBE messed up. So genocide is maybe a bad decision? They live in democracy so they are part of the decision their „messed up government“ does. Just like the Americans say they hate bush...but who elected him. They protest against the war and they support it at the same time. You quickly judge that all people age good natured, we are all the same, we are all lovely and good, but why do some of us kill another, why is that if we're all good natured, it's not our fault or something, idiotic. From your point of view it’s nobodies fault for all the killing and torturing, and denying people their rights to live, but speaking up about it like me, “spreading the hate” oh, well THAT is just inhumane.

we didn't live in democracy when the genocide happened....and the democracy in Serbia is not like the democracy in Germany or sth...cause it just started...8 years ago...that's not enough to grow it strong as it is in Germany....to catch all the politic thieves...we're still in some kind of '90 problem...and we're trying to leave them behind and have real democracy here...

Johnny Birdbrook
07-11-2008, 08:32 AM
"40 years ago and 13 years ago is not the same. The 40 years ago generation is pretty much vanished by now, and the 13 years ago still hold their ideals and thoughts and spread it to the younger generation."

you kinda seem to like ripp phrases off the context don't you?
never said i would compare this to your situation.
just told you, since you thought jews are afraid or would hate us, or anything.

but nevertheless,

when my mother was young, it also was just 13 years ago, but her best friend was from turkey and jews have been the same persons as germany for her.
We never had a problem with that, no german ever did, hitler had a problem, not we.. most of the germans didn't even knew what was going on.. but ill catch that up later.

"MAYBE messed up. So genocide is maybe a bad decision? They live in democracy so they are part of the decision their „messed up government“ does. Just like the Americans say they hate bush...but who elected him. They protest against the war and they support it at the same time."

Genocide is messed up, the maybe was just for things i eventually do not know..

And what the americans are doing is still a mystery to me.

BUT just because they vote a prsident, doesnt mean everybody wants him.
it means that over half of the ines that were actually electing wanted him.. so thats no reason to hate everybody.
Can you imagine how it feels, if you always were against bush, if you always tried to stop war? if you were so involved in every movement against all that shit? and then.. you meet an iraqi, somenone you always tried to help.. and he just says: fuck you, american?

i mean thats just an example why it is NOT right to judge people from anything but theirselves..

but what i also wanted to mention is, that the germans, who voted hitler.. didn knew what he did.
He didn't say, i gonna kill all jews, vote me.
Even years after hitler had been voted, noone knew that hitler built concentration camps. noone knew this genocide was going on!
The doctor for example told the families that their disabled members had to visit the hospital.. a few weeks later they recieved a letter which said, that he died from his disease. But the truth was, they brought him in a camp to kill him.

Hitler would never had been voted if everybody would've known who he was.
He was just a very clever actor and mind manipulator, thats why he managed to get everybody to vote him.

And i don't know how it was, when the serbs elected their president, but even if they wanted their president to be a murder.. i am sure not everybody was fine with that.. everybody who was and knew what this desicion will cause.. is of course to blame!

"You quickly judge that all people age good natured, we are all the same, we are all lovely and good, but why do some of us kill another, why is that if we're all good natured, it's not our fault or something, idiotic. From your point of view it’s nobodies fault for all the killing and torturing, and denying people their rights to live, but speaking up about it like me, “spreading the hate” oh, well THAT is just inhumane."

first i never said you were sprading hate.. didn't i even say that IT SEEMS.. that the hate comes eventaully more from serbs? yes i did. But that doesn't mean i believe it, cause i don't know..

and no, i didn't said is is nobies fault, i just said that its not everybodies fault.
The ones to blame, are certain people you don't know. So you can't blame anybody unless you know who is to blame for that shit.. or to make it easier, you may never blame countries, just government and everybody supporting their stupid idiologies.

"Oh yes your way of expressing your self is so much better than everybody else’s, and you call your self serious. I guess there’s some hidden meaning I DIDN’T UNDERSTAND and you’re gonna talk about it. Lovely"

never it was better than everybody elses, just better than yours :D
and no, no hiddien meaning, all straight to the point, shouldn't be that hard.

seriously, daBird. ^^

sipptaroowsky
07-11-2008, 11:14 AM
70 percent were against Hitler on the elections, he didn't get elected then. He achieved his position through military achievements, and most by his promise that he's gonna kill all the communists that stand in his way. And you're telling me no one noticed a few million Jews disappear, you don't honestly believe that do you? His nationalist party prospered and through that he succeeded. It’s funny how much you teach me of my history while you don't even understand your own.

Johnny Birdbrook
07-11-2008, 06:27 PM
haha, seems that you know everything better huh?
so why argue if you won't listen. you gotta be careful with the times we're talking about.

of course everybody knew, but it was already too late when that happened.

you got your point that he didn't get voted, my fault. Doesn't mean i didn't know. we have to learn that shit so often that i actually hate to talk about it.
but as it seems it maybe wasn't that bad.

Ok, but we're gettin off topic.

i never said that i know much about history I actually didn't wanted to get in the past. It just pissed me off, how you AGAIN judged the whole country for a governments choice. And since you even know that the germans didn't voted for hitler, why do you say they supported him? at least you said they've also been involved in the killings..

but i think you missed a much more important thing right know.

"we didn't live in democracy when the genocide happened....and the democracy in Serbia is not like the democracy in Germany or sth...cause it just started...8 years ago...that's not enough to grow it strong as it is in Germany....to catch all the politic thieves...we're still in some kind of '90 problem...and we're trying to leave them behind and have real democracy here..."

i think thats worth a discussion and less off topic.

I don't wanna get involved in political stuff, since as i said so many times, don't know much.. i tried, but i can't.

But at least i know got convinced that shanna was right, you are judging people for things they never did.

JoY
07-11-2008, 07:48 PM
I am not particularly proud of my country, but one thing I can say for the US is that we are one of the only countries that works really hard to help minorities and immigrants. Our foreign policy does totally suck in a lot of ways, but once someone is in this country, they're likely to be treated much better than in another country.

girl, you kidding? sorry to say, but I have quite the pile of examples that would say the exact opposite from experience. I like America for several reasons, but what you just mentioned is far from being one of them. for one, because "once someone is in this country" is exactly what takes a lifetime of effort & until you're in that country, you're still treated like shit.

plus, I don't think it's a good idea to drag your Croatian friends into this. I imagine your knowledge of any hostility they feel towards another is quite limited, as is mine.

for instance, I was cheering when Germany had made it to the finals, speaking of football, but I can assure you, that although my friends all granted them one hell of a victory, as much as any other country (after the Netherlands dropped out), the Dutch generally don't react that friendly, or even neutral towards Germany & what's German. you should see the amount of reactions I get to even such a tiny silly thing as my last name. people have even made a mustache with their index finger & raised their right hand for me, when hearing it. it's not rational, it's freakin' over 60 years ago that we were at war. you can't help what you feel. when an entire nation (generally) feels some kind of irrational grudge towards another, you can say they cheered for each other in a race for the euro cup in football, but that might be only because it's someone from their hood & from their kind.

if you'd try going to Croatia with a Serb's last name & introduce yourself to the community, you'd probably find that most people will stop & think for a moment, before they'd approach you in a decent manner. these feelings are deeply rooted. you're an American girl, no one from these nations would bug you with deeply rooted irrational grudge & emotional pain. they wouldn't dream to, they wouldn't even dare to. it'd give a bad impression if they did.

it just depends on what you associate with a nation & it's people. my boyfriend has some terrifyingly narrow-minded ideas on a couple of minorities/kinds of people, but having friends from one of those doesn't help a bit. whoever the friend is, is awesome, the rest just sticks to being evil/lazy/criminal/no good/whatever in his opinion. it's nothing explicit, or that's out in the open, you can just sense it's there during discussions, or whatever. but to justify whatever opinion, he'd always add he has nothing against any minority/kind of people at all. in discussions I can make it go away for short moments, if I do my best. in a next discussion about the same subject, he'll be less radical. in a next discussion after that he'll be even less radical. it wears out, slowly. just like I used to hear a lot more people about my last name when I was younger, than I do now. the association fades. but usually it takes a fine bottle of wine & a good, friendly discussion, times 10. or rather a million.

sipptaroowsky
07-12-2008, 02:50 AM
haha, seems that you know everything better huh?
so why argue if you won't listen. you gotta be careful with the times we're talking about.

of course everybody knew, but it was already too late when that happened.

you got your point that he didn't get voted, my fault. Doesn't mean i didn't know. we have to learn that shit so often that i actually hate to talk about it.
but as it seems it maybe wasn't that bad.

Ok, but we're gettin off topic.

i never said that i know much about history I actually didn't wanted to get in the past. It just pissed me off, how you AGAIN judged the whole country for a governments choice. And since you even know that the germans didn't voted for hitler, why do you say they supported him? at least you said they've also been involved in the killings..

but i think you missed a much more important thing right know.

"we didn't live in democracy when the genocide happened....and the democracy in Serbia is not like the democracy in Germany or sth...cause it just started...8 years ago...that's not enough to grow it strong as it is in Germany....to catch all the politic thieves...we're still in some kind of '90 problem...and we're trying to leave them behind and have real democracy here..."

i think thats worth a discussion and less off topic.

I don't wanna get involved in political stuff, since as i said so many times, don't know much.. i tried, but i can't.

But at least i know got convinced that shanna was right, you are judging people for things they never did.

There is so much incorrect information in this post that I don't even know if it's worth commenting it, since you're obviously going to missinterpite it.

shanna_guarana
07-12-2008, 02:52 AM
There is so much incorrect information in this post that I don't even know if it's worth commenting it, since you're obviously going to missinterpite it.

ahhahaha we should all say that for your posts....

JoY
07-12-2008, 07:04 AM
it doesn't sound like you're hearing each other. it looks like you guys are just tossing your own arguments into this discussion, without letting the arguments of others sink in. there's more in life than being right & wrong. even if you feel you're right & your conversationpartner says the exact opposite, that doesn't mean he's wrong. try to see the nuances here & each side of the story.

sipptaroowsky
07-12-2008, 07:23 AM
Funny, that's actually all that you say Ana, in fact you haven't got any post of your own, only ones you have are the ones that try to contradict my thoughts, but I'm right.

JoY
07-12-2008, 07:37 AM
it doesn't sound like you're hearing each other. it looks like you guys are just tossing your own arguments into this discussion, without letting the arguments of others sink in. there's more in life than being right & wrong. even if you feel you're right & your conversationpartner says the exact opposite, that doesn't mean he's wrong. try to see the nuances here & each side of the story.

uh, helloho.

Keyser
07-12-2008, 07:38 AM
but I'm right.

Lemme guess, you're not really good at debating arent you?

sipptaroowsky
07-12-2008, 01:53 PM
Lemme guess, you're not really good at debating arent you?

WOW, straight through the heart that one, you really know how to make a powerful argument don't you?

Keyser
07-12-2008, 02:15 PM
WOW, straight through the heart that one, you really know how to make a powerful argument don't you?

Aww, that coming from you really hurts me:D

JoY
07-12-2008, 02:30 PM
I don't mean to interrupt, but I wanted to remind both of you.. HOW CHILDISH YOU'RE BEHAVING.

Keyser
07-12-2008, 02:47 PM
I don't mean to interrupt, but I wanted to remind both of you.. HOW CHILDISH YOU'RE BEHAVING.

Well, I gotta talk to this guy somehow. The last time I wrote something about the subject the response I got was ''flush your words through the toilet''. That + the ''But I'm right'' comment made me wonder about the guys debating skills. And by the responses I'm getting, I realize its no use to post page-long posts with articles and stuff about this topic. It may look childish, but it actually saves me alot work now.:D

Johnny Birdbrook
07-12-2008, 04:30 PM
it doesn't sound like you're hearing each other. it looks like you guys are just tossing your own arguments into this discussion, without letting the arguments of others sink in. there's more in life than being right & wrong. even if you feel you're right & your conversationpartner says the exact opposite, that doesn't mean he's wrong. try to see the nuances here & each side of the story.

ah, that's one true post.

i guess i actually tried.. actually i am a person who really trys to understand and tries to see it all from the eyes of the others.

So if i actually did not " try to see the nuances here & each side of the story" , i failed. to bad, since that wasn't my intention.

But at least i answerd to every single bit he wrote and didn't just pick the false ones.. yeah i even confessed that i was wrong.

But i actually want this conversation to end now, cause i think if you wanna " try to see the nuances here & each side of the story" , you need the right discussion partner, guess it just didn't fit.

Whatever i never wanted to choose a side actually, it's a pity he succeeded, to force me, to choose one.

JoY
07-12-2008, 05:11 PM
I wasn't talking to you in particular (as far as I've read this topic, you seem to have been very supportive & friendly to everyone involved), but yeah, I think it's wise not to choose sides here. this topic has definitely gone too far with the generalised examples, judgements, whining & hostility. & it's not correct German history has been picked apart here. not just because it's off-topic, but mostly because it became pretty clear it's not something many people understand. actually, it presented the perfect example of how badly people listen to each other, once they've formed an image in their head, & why you & I can't imagine the damage done to the relationship between the Croatians, Serbs, Albanians... as you just saw, memories stick & judgements are difficult to get rid of. what's worse is that they're always projected on the person at hand, even if you say it isn't so.

it's too far from our bedsides, as we'd say in the Netherlands. I don't know if you've got a German equivalent for it.

shanna_guarana
07-12-2008, 05:44 PM
it doesn't sound like you're hearing each other. it looks like you guys are just tossing your own arguments into this discussion, without letting the arguments of others sink in. there's more in life than being right & wrong. even if you feel you're right & your conversationpartner says the exact opposite, that doesn't mean he's wrong. try to see the nuances here & each side of the story.

believe me, I've tried...but just look at this one...this is the answer to all my doubts...


but I'm right.

Keyser
07-12-2008, 06:02 PM
I wasn't talking to you in particular (as far as I've read this topic, you seem to have been very supportive & friendly to everyone involved), but yeah, I think it's wise not to choose sides here. this topic has definitely gone too far with the generalised examples, judgements, whining & hostility. & it's not correct German history has been picked apart here. not just because it's off-topic, but mostly because it became pretty clear it's not something many people understand. actually, it presented the perfect example of how badly people listen to each other, once they've formed an image in their head, & why you & I can't imagine the damage done to the relationship between the Croatians, Serbs, Albanians... as you just saw, memories stick & judgements are difficult to get rid of. what's worse is that they're always projected on the person at hand, even if you say it isn't so.

it's too far from our bedsides, as we'd say in the Netherlands. I don't know if you've got a German equivalent for it.

Yes.. not picking sides. If only our leaders did that too. The way they handled the situation in both former Yugoslavia and Kosovo is not something to be proud of. And their way of behaving could cause more trouble in the near future (this also goes for Russia btw). For us as people, it might be far from our bedsides, but for us, as Europe as a whole, it isnt.

JoY
07-12-2008, 06:09 PM
don't use sarcasm now. sarcasm is demeaning & patronising in a way, or at least it could come across as being a pun, which I don't imagine is your intention.

you've tried to get your points across, but I wasn't talking about argumenting, I was talking about listening. an argument by one doesn't have to be followed by a counterargument by the other. when someone tells you Serbian governing has taken many lives, you can counterargument that there also have been times Serbs died & how rough it's been for them, but you could also acknowledge how awful that is & not say anything else. it's awful so many lives were taken under Serbian governing. you betray no one by stopping to be so defensive for a moment & admitting it, because you are not your country. & then what, your past government isn't your country either.

this is not on you, I hope you know that. this conversation isn't working, because the matter is too complicated & all parties carry too much grudge & emotional pain to be entirely rational about the matter. the amount of examples that's been dragged into the conversation testifies of it & shows how those examples, that have left such an enormous impression, have been generalised & stretched to fit the complete situation.

what I just said to you, I might've said to sipptaroowsky the exact same way with the situation flip-flopped. if you would both acknowledge how immensely terrible the situation must've been for the other, & basically still is, you'd find a lot more understanding. really. this is not on you. don't get defensive towards me, when I only ask of you guys to listen to each other for a moment, without trying to overrule the other after it. sometimes you need to lay down your defenses & just accept a word or two from the other. that goes for the defensive post you just made in reply to me, but that also goes for the rest of this topic.

shanna_guarana
07-12-2008, 06:19 PM
but how can I listen to him if he doesn't listen to me.....and you see he doesn't....the thing between him and me isn't even a conversation...so..I guess you're right...but I think I've done my best...and yes, I've admitted all the genocide...and everything that Serbian politicians did wrong....I didn't do the genocide, so it wasn't that hard to me at all...and yes...the whole argument&listen thing is little more complicated...

JoY
07-12-2008, 06:32 PM
Yes.. not picking sides. If only our leaders did that too. The way they handled the situation in both former Yugoslavia and Kosovo is not something to be proud of. And their way of behaving could cause more trouble in the near future (this also goes for Russia btw). For us as people, it might be far from our bedsides, but for us, as Europe as a whole, it isnt.

I know. it worries me way too often that people never seem to learn from situations that could've been the perfect lesson. how often in history have the Netherlands been tempted to pick a side & has it pretended to be neutral on the matter, while still supporting one side & making things more difficult for the other? two world wars, two. how terribly have the Netherlands been confronted with how easily an entire nation can be tricked into the wrong ideals, cooperating with the wrong government, how devastating judgements & generalisations can be in the case of racism & the likes? seriously, how often does Europe need to be confronted with it, before they get you can't just butt in & spread your opinions? almost every single European country has failed at this acount somewhere in history, so why does anyone even pretend to know it better?

JoY
07-12-2008, 06:52 PM
but how can I listen to him if he doesn't listen to me.....and you see he doesn't....the thing between him and me isn't even a conversation...so..I guess you're right...but I think I've done my best...and yes, I've admitted all the genocide...and everything that Serbian politicians did wrong....I didn't do the genocide, so it wasn't that hard to me at all...and yes...the whole argument&listen thing is little more complicated...

I know it must be very hard for you not to reply with things like; "Serbians aren't all bad, Serbians have suffered too", etc. just try really hard not to - that's the secret of listening; the other won't feel like you've actually listened to him & heard what he said, if you reply all the time with counterarguments, because it'll look like your trying to dismiss what he said. so what I'm trying to say, is that you probably both have the feeling you two haven't been listening to each other.

suppose, you have an argument with your husband, just try to picture it. for years & years the relationship has been incredibly bad & now you two are arguing over the fact he cheated on you with another woman. suppose you say; "after all these years that I've been so loyal to you, how could you have been so cruel & cheat on me with another woman?" & he says; "I know I was wrong to do so & I'm sorry to have hurt you, but you have neglected me for years! you didn't even see me, I wasn't even here for you!".

would you feel acknowledged? do you feel like he's listened to you, like really really listened? or would you feel like he's trying to dismiss his wrongdoings by compensating in a reply with your wrongdoings?

after all, he could've also said; "I know I was wrong to do so & I'm sorry to have hurt you", end. after such an understanding reply, you'll probably be more willing to see things from his side aswell & say something like; "I know it must've been mighty difficult for you that I haven't given you much attention the last few years".

what do you think would be more constructive & lead to a better understanding of each other? not that you need to admit to something you haven't done, not at all. but just acknowledge the other's viewpoint without trying to overrule it with your own.

shanna_guarana
07-12-2008, 06:59 PM
well, I understand what you're trying to point out....but I can't let him talk bullshit....he's stupid arguments could win...I can't stay calm and just listen to him when he doesn't listen to me and acts like a 10 year old CHILD.....

JoY
07-12-2008, 07:10 PM
well, I understand what you're trying to point out....but I can't let him talk bullshit....he's stupid arguments could win...I can't stay calm and just listen to him when he doesn't listen to me and acts like a 10 year old CHILD.....

you're angry. the discussion just got a little out of hand & you two both got too much tangled up in it. that's all. you really need to relax, because this is seriously very unnecessary. you both have done nothing to each other. try to calm down, please. again, you have done nothing to each other.

if you can't listen to him, it's because you don't want to. because you have internet & you can read, so you're in every way able to listen to him. if you don't want to, I really can't help you guys, but you must understand that getting mad at him for not listening to you is pretty pointless, when you're not listening to him either. maybe he's not listening to you for the exact same reason, because he feels like you're not listening to him? just take it into consideration.

& try to consider a situation in which both of you guys win by achieving a better understanding with & of each other. it's not a matter of trying to, it's a matter if you two are willing to. if you guys are willing to make an effort, then chances are you two aren't the only ones.

Llamas
07-12-2008, 07:16 PM
girl, you kidding? sorry to say, but I have quite the pile of examples that would say the exact opposite from experience. I like America for several reasons, but what you just mentioned is far from being one of them. for one, because "once someone is in this country" is exactly what takes a lifetime of effort & until you're in that country, you're still treated like shit.
That's why I specified, once someone is in this country. It sucks ridiculous amount of ass to get into the country, I know. But you're less likely to get killed for your race here than in most countries (not includinging western Europe, Australia, Canada...)


plus, I don't think it's a good idea to drag your Croatian friends into this. I imagine your knowledge of any hostility they feel towards another is quite limited, as is mine.
I get what you're saying, but I was surrounded by Serbs and Croatians and Bosnians when I was in Austria, as it's so nearby. I noticed constantly that my Croatian friends were trying to be friendly to Serbians. Most of the time, the Serbs didn't want to associate with Croatians, though, and they got shot down. There were a few times certainly when we met Serbians that wanted to hang out, and we had a lot of fun. The Serbs I knew never made an attempt to befriend Croatians, and definitely made it sound like a ludicrous idea that nobody should ever consider.


if you'd try going to Croatia with a Serb's last name & introduce yourself to the community, you'd probably find that most people will stop & think for a moment, before they'd approach you in a decent manner. these feelings are deeply rooted. you're an American girl, no one from these nations would bug you with deeply rooted irrational grudge & emotional pain. they wouldn't dream to, they wouldn't even dare to. it'd give a bad impression if they did.
You are probably right, and I'm not saying that it wouldn't happen to someone with a Serbian last name. All I meant to say was that, from my experience, Croatians have been less hostile toward Serbs than the other way around. I certainly didn't say that the entire countries reflect my experience.

JoY
07-12-2008, 07:36 PM
That's why I specified, once someone is in this country. It sucks ridiculous amount of ass to get into the country, I know. But you're less likely to get killed for your race here than in most countries (not includinging western Europe, Australia, Canada...)


I get what you're saying, but I was surrounded by Serbs and Croatians and Bosnians when I was in Austria, as it's so nearby. I noticed constantly that my Croatian friends were trying to be friendly to Serbians. Most of the time, the Serbs didn't want to associate with Croatians, though, and they got shot down. There were a few times certainly when we met Serbians that wanted to hang out, and we had a lot of fun. The Serbs I knew never made an attempt to befriend Croatians, and definitely made it sound like a ludicrous idea that nobody should ever consider.


You are probably right, and I'm not saying that it wouldn't happen to someone with a Serbian last name. All I meant to say was that, from my experience, Croatians have been less hostile toward Serbs than the other way around. I certainly didn't say that the entire countries reflect my experience.

I don't imagine you know how immigrants are welcomed after they've "gotten in" in that many countries outside the U.S.. sorry to nitpick, but you just make incredibly weird statements.

then, if it's well possible the entire countries don't reflect your personal experience, it's maybe not the wisest of ideas to share your experience that very obviously is in the favor of one side. these are different cultures than yours we're talking about ("but they were so Western &.."-no, different cultures) & who knows what the people who you happened to encounter have been through. also, I wouldn't say the Serbs & Croatians in Austria can in any way put some objective light on this matter. that's a selectionbias. the fact you don't have a clue of the variables that play a role in their approach towards each other is an informationbias. should I go on..

the Serbian last name was just an example, because you seem to be in favor of the Croatians. (it's not so much that you seem to be, you just are) god knows why you even picked a side in something that has absolutely nothing to do with you & that you have no thorough knowledge of & experience with.

shanna_guarana
07-12-2008, 07:38 PM
I don't imagine you know how immigrants are welcomed after they've "gotten in" in that many countries outside the U.S.. sorry to nitpick, but you just make incredibly weird statements.

then, if it's well possible the entire countries don't reflect your personal experience, it's maybe not the wisest of ideas to share your experience that very obviously is in the favor of one side. these are different cultures than yours we're talking about ("but they were so Western &.."-no, different cultures) & who knows what the people who you happened to encounter have been through. also, I wouldn't say the Serbs & Croatians in Austria can in any way put some objective light on this matter. that's a selectionbias. the fact you don't have a clue of the variables that play a role in their approach towards each other is an informationbias. should I go on..

the Serbian last name was just an example, because you seem to be in favor of the Croatians. (it's not so much that you seem to be, you just are) god knows why you even picked a side in something that has absolutely nothing to do with you & that you have no thorough knowledge of & experience with.

every singe word on its right place!

Llamas
07-12-2008, 07:42 PM
I don't imagine you know how immigrants are welcomed after they've "gotten in" in that many countries outside the U.S.. sorry to nitpick, but you just make incredibly weird statements.

then, if it's well possible the entire countries don't reflect your personal experience, it's maybe not the wisest of ideas to share your experience that very obviously is in the favor of one side. these are different cultures than yours we're talking about ("but they were so Western &.."-no, different cultures) & who knows what the people who you happened to encounter have been through. also, I wouldn't say the Serbs & Croatians in Austria can in any way put some objective light on this matter. that's a selectionbias. the fact you don't have a clue of the variables that play a role in their approach towards each other is an informationbias. should I go on..

the Serbian last name was just an example, because you seem to be in favor of the Croatians. (it's not so much that you seem to be, you just are) god knows why you even picked a side in something that has absolutely nothing to do with you & that you have no thorough knowledge of & experience with.

Gosh, I'm sorry my posts have come across as sounding like I know anything about these countries. My entire point was (and I think I said it like this) in my personal experience, it's seemed that Serbs were more hostile than Croatians toward each other. I only said it because I previously thought shann was sounding a lot more hostile than sipptar... that has since changed in this thread.

There is certainly selection bias and all that with people in Austria.

I also don't mean to sound like I'm on one side or another. I'm neutral toward Serbia, because I don't know much about the country or the people. I like Croatia cause I know a lot more about it, I know as many people from there as Serbia, but they've been friendlier to me, etc. I'm not on a "side" here, though. I was mostly just being surprised that it seemed shanna was being unnecessarily hostile toward sipptar. Then as the argument continued, I noticed that it was coming equally from both sides.

JoY
07-12-2008, 07:50 PM
shanna; hey, you didn't have to let us know you agree. I mean c'mon, duh.
but maybe if I'm right about this, then maybe maybe maybe it's possible I'm also right about the rest? ;]

you don't need to say anything, just do with the posts I just wrote to you what you consider to be best. I hope sipptaroowsky will read them too & that you two will start a friendly, or at least friendlier, conversation with each other. that you'll listen better to each other, acknowledge the other more & will come to an understanding. my support goes out to both of you, as individuals. not as countries. ;p I just hope the two of you will get along.


Brianna; your experience with this matter is of certain value here. namely that it underlines this issue is far from being solved, but I guess we've figured out so much after this topic. ;p

shanna_guarana
07-12-2008, 07:56 PM
shanna; hey, you didn't have to let us know you agree. I mean c'mon, duh.
but maybe if I'm right about this, then maybe maybe maybe it's possible I'm also right about the rest? ;]

you don't need to say anything, just do with the posts I just wrote to you what you consider to be best. I hope sipptaroowsky will read them too & that you two will start a friendly, or at least friendlier, conversation with each other. that you'll listen better to each other, acknowledge the other more & will come to an understanding. my support goes out to both of you, as individuals. not as countries. ;p I just hope the two of you will get along.


Brianna; your experience with this matter is of certain value here. namely that it underlines this issue is far from being solved, but I guess we've figured out so much after this topic. ;p

sorry, but I really had to say that...:D it's up to sipptaroowsky

Llamas
07-12-2008, 08:01 PM
I honestly just wanted to point out before how silly it is to be hostile toward someone solely based on what country they are from. I met enough people in Europe who automatically assumed that, because I'm American, I must agree with Bush/the war in Iraq/etc. I didn't come across a whole ton of hostility in general, but it was sometimes hard to get across to some people that I actually don't like GW Bush or agree with his policies. It seemed to me that this was what both parties were doing in this thread. "My country's government hates yours, so I hate you" is the general idea I've felt here, and I'd felt it from Serbians in Austria, as well. It's a shame, and nobody should feel that way, I believe.

JoY
07-12-2008, 08:06 PM
alright, alright. I'm sorry I was giving you such a hard time, but seriously, in sensitive, painful matters like these, please stop repeating what your personal experience was, especially when it's in favor of one of the two sides. just like you just did all over again? please just quit doing it for the love of god. it isn't helping the discussion.

whatever your opinion is, clearly your experiences put one of the two in a better light. I can't imagine that will get a friendly conversation between these two cats running, you?

your experience is that there are a few persistent communication problems, to toss in an understatement. that's it. who's more hostile & who's more friendly (& to you of all people, like that should matter) really isn't of importance here.

don't reply now repeating it again, please, okay?


Then as the argument continued, I noticed that it was coming equally from both sides.

yeah, noticed it too. boo. ;(


shanna; heeeey, you seem more positive & relaxed now! are you? I hope so. :]

Llamas
07-12-2008, 08:47 PM
You seem mad at me :( I feel like shit lately, so I'm sorry, I shouldn't have posted at all.

sipptaroowsky
07-13-2008, 01:37 AM
Well hello, here I go again. When I first posted on this thread I was stating out how people don't talk about Balkan situation since it causes funny emotion in people. Well that was my point, and I see I succeeded, we're all talking about it now and expressing our opinions which are mostly very different. In some situations I overreacted towards some people, completely inappropriate. I'd like to seize this opportunity to express my honest apologies towards those that I might have hurt with idiotic comments, without considering their emotions or their comments with which I didn't and still don't agree with. Basically you've done the same but I guess I'm not that affected by other people's opinions, especially when I see they're wrong.

There's one thing you need to understand about Balkan situations, and that is that they are very complicated. We all have our theories about how it works but we can't all be right. So it's quite obvious we're going to debate it to decide who's right. It's quite funny to see you trying to settle our differences, (between Ana and me that is) by just saying: settle your differences, listen to each other. Well we all have our solutions to all the world problems, my personal funniest are: listen to each other, stop fighting and all that no-plan solutions. I don't think you consider the idea that Ana and I like the fact that we are different, and we don't want to get changed by some „voices“ on the forum.

Now the real thread,. What about Kosovo. Well I think Kosovo should be a country, I think the foreign governments don't acknowledge Kosovo as a country because of their selfish reasons. Nobody actually thinks about Kosovo. They all see Serbia as the bigger one in all of this, and of course they kiss ass to Serbia. The foreign governments have the exact opinion about the whole Balkans. Look at the Greece and Macedonia relations. You've ever seen the Eurovision. Why does Macedonia has a name „Former Yugoslav Republic Macedonia“. Because Greece doesn't admit Macedonia as their own country. That's just idiotic, I mean the US don't have a name Former English Colony, the Russia doesn't have the name Used to be The CCCP Ringleaders. It's because of the rule of the stronger. Nobody actually cares about Kosovo, everyone cares about themselves. I've looked at all your replies and came to the conclusion that you don't actually understand and even less care about what Kosovo becomes. Your posts against each other , against me, trying to express your personal problem instead of concentrating on Kosovo. You actually don't know what is going on in the Balkans, and even less try to understand it. What you know about us is what we know about you, what you've read or seen in the media. Put aside your personal issues and try considering Kosovo for Kosovo not your self.

The personal thing; No I don't hate Serbia, and no I don't hate Serbians, but I don't like them either. Same thing goes to miss Ana. But if you look at the facts, I don't know what Croatia or Kosovo have against Serbia, it's the other way around, it's Serbian ideals that stand in the ways of Kosovo and Croatia. The fact states also the mistakes Serbia made towards everyone else (I'm trying not to use words like genocide, murder, killing, since it hurts people’s feelings) and the mistakes everyone else didn't make toward Serbia. Those things are considerable when we talk about Kosovo independence.

One more thing, please don’t sustain your self from commenting on this thread, I find it fascinating how people from different places have opinions typical for the place or environment which they are from. This stands for the comments against mine, the American thinks like an American, the Dutch thinks like a Dutch, funny, but let’s not look at people as countries.

Keyser
07-13-2008, 06:28 AM
Now the real thread,. What about Kosovo. Well I think Kosovo should be a country, I think the foreign governments don't acknowledge Kosovo as a country because of their selfish reasons.

In the Kosovo conflict, replace Serbia by any Western country, and Kosovo wouldnt have been independent so quickly and easily. I can see the headlines from Western governments ''we will not surrender to terrorism''. Unfortunately, it's Serbia, and not a western country. I'm not saying Serbia played a angel role in the previous wars, but in the eyes of the mass media, they were in a media disadvantage in the Kosovo war. We all could hear the suffer of the albanians. We heared about the killings by the Serbians. But did we hear anything about albanian harrassement and violence towards Serbia (not only Serbians, also roman gypsies)? No, that only came AFTER Serbia was bombed, then we heared stories from the albanian side. But then it was already too late, the West picked the side of the albanians, and turning back on them would be hypocrite.

If you look at the situation then, like you, sipptaroowsky, said before, no one is innocent, a one sided declaration which is supported by the west is unacceptable for the other minorities who live there. Specially when the majority isnt too fond of the minorities, and the political system is filled with people who commited crimes towards the minorities in the war. But the West doesnt really care about that, soon their soldiers will leave, and when things turn ugly again everyone will be shouting ''oh look at those Balkan people going again''.

Then another thing: warcriminals. I think everyone who commited crimes in all the balkan wars (or any other) should stand trial for a court. But if you hear how withnesses that have to stand against albanian suspects are intimidated by former KLA gangs, resulting in the release of these suspects, you cant hardly call that justice. Even Del Ponte, agrees with this. And, to say it harshly, if you live in a country where the majority hates you, and their supported by the biggest powers in the world, you get nationalism amongst minorities in no time. Something which makes living in a country even more hard.

In the end, yes, you can say that if a majority wants independence, is should be possible that they get their own country. But in this case, I think this is going way to quick, while there still are too many issues (politically, demographically, economically, religion etc.) going on. Don't forget that Kosovo as it is now is by far not as strong as for example Croatia and Slovenia were at the time they declared independance. But unlike you said, the countries that didnt recognize Kosovo arent the only ones who not think about the Kosovo people, most of the Western countries (and especially the USA) don't care about the Kosovo people either, only about their own interests (try to search about camp Bondsteel, theres some very interesting theories on that one).

And btw, sipptaroowsky, what do you think of situations like Basque land, Northern Ireland, Tibet? Or to make it closer,do you think republik Srpska can declare itself independant? or even more closer, do you think areas in the Krajina part can declare itself independant if Serbian majorities are very high there?

sipptaroowsky
07-13-2008, 08:08 AM
Even though I agree with most of what you have said, I'd like to state out some thing I disagree with. You spoke of Romans, Romans are ancient Imperial Citizens, or present Inhabitants of the city of Roma. I think you meant to say Romany people, or just Romany.

I also noticed that you consider Carla Del Ponte a reliable resource of information. Please don't do that. Carla Del Ponte is an unprofessional self promoting bitter old scarecrow which joined law only to satisfy her monstrous ambition to control people’s faith. She recently wrote a book about hunting war criminals, the funny thing is that the trials aren't even over, so these people are not yet war criminals since by law they're not guilty yet.

The Northern Ireland, Tibet...I think it is pretty much similar thing. Since Britain’s got ...oh excuse me, since England’s got most of the wires in their hand, no one will bother them about their Northern Ireland oppression, The Tibet, well China is one of the worlds strongest military powers, so you know no one is going to bother them about anything.

OK now you're pushing it, The Krajina and Republika Srpska. The thing you need to understand, when Yugoslavia was created, it was the ambition of the Serbs in a promise of a greater good for all the Yugoslav people. When it broke of, all the countries got their former boarders, but Serbia still had Crna Gora and the rest. Now it's falling apart as well,. The republika srpska is something like Yugoslavia, it's a Serbian sick ambition thinking that all of the Balkans is Serbia, if they declare their self legal country (even though I don't know where did you come up with this ever happening, probably googled it up and thought you'd appear informed by speaking about it) many of the Balkan countries will no longer exist, that's not going to happen. The krajina is a silly idea as well, similar. Krajina also spreads throughout ...2 or 3 countries. But the point you're missing about Kosovo, 70 percent or something like that, 70 percent of the inhabitants want Kosovo independent. They want to be a legal country, krajina and republika srpska (nothing republic about it) will never happen that way. So it's a not so good of an argument.

But I agree with most of what you've said.

Keyser
07-13-2008, 08:51 AM
You spoke of Romans, Romans are ancient Imperial Citizens, or present Inhabitants of the city of Roma. I think you meant to say Romany people, or just Romany. I was talking about Gypsies, who often are reffered here as Roman (but that might be the Dutch name for them).


I also noticed that you consider Carla Del Ponte a reliable resource of information. Please don't do that.Meh, I dont. I said ''ven Del Ponte, agrees with this.'' in the way like, even the most dumb would agree on it :p

And about the Yugoslav court in general. I find it very disturbing that when Western leaders are called to be a withness in trials they dont have to show up. I would love to know the role they played in making the conflict escalate so violently, they surely have some role in it (and especially Germany, USA, Britain, France and Russia's role).


The Northern Ireland, Tibet...I think it is pretty much similar thing. Since Britain’s got ...oh excuse me, since England’s got most of the wires in their hand, no one will bother them about their Northern Ireland oppression, The Tibet, well China is one of the worlds strongest military powers, so you know no one is going to bother them about anything.
Agreed, tough its sickening that they keep this measuring with 2 standards.


OK now you're pushing it, The Krajina and Republika Srpska. The thing you need to understand, when Yugoslavia was created, it was the ambition of the Serbs in a promise of a greater good for all the Yugoslav people. When it broke of, all the countries got their former boarders, but Serbia still had Crna Gora and the rest. Now it's falling apart as well,. The republika srpska is something like Yugoslavia, it's a Serbian sick ambition thinking that all of the Balkans is Serbia, if they declare their self legal country (even though I don't know where did you come up with this ever happening, probably googled it up and thought you'd appear informed by speaking about it) many of the Balkan countries will no longer exist, that's not going to happen. The krajina is a silly idea as well, similar. Krajina also spreads throughout ...2 or 3 countries. But the point you're missing about Kosovo, 70 percent or something like that, 70 percent of the inhabitants want Kosovo independent. They want to be a legal country, krajina and republika srpska (nothing republic about it) will never happen that way. So it's a not so good of an argument.

I understand that what youre saying, but I mean it more on a untheoratical way. For example, if, like in a certain part in Kosovo's recent history, Serbians would use similar tactics to outnumber Croatians, Bosniaks in such a way that,for example in like 100 years from now, Krajina and Srpska (or any region for that matter) will have 90% of Serbs, is that enough reason to claim the land? Or does something like historical awareness play a role in that too? Respect to the people who live there? Because its clear to me to the Kosovo albanians it isnt. Following newsarticles on Kosovo the past years give me the idea the only thing albanians want is a religiously and ethnically pure Kosovo. Which is a crime on itself (but a crime largely supported by the West). Again, if a majority in a region wants to go its own way, there should be looked for a logical, fair and a solution that works not only for the short term, and this is far from what's happening at the moment.

Vikica
07-13-2008, 08:55 AM
I just LOVE the facts... ;)

and it's a fact that there are many Americans who think our countries (Croatia and Serbia) are still in the same alliance called Yugoslavia. and how many Americans knew about Kosovo before it wanted to be independent?

yeah, it's not such a nice thing people fighting over politics, I agree. but it's all about accepting other people and their opinion. and I can't say I've been democratic in many of my posts to this topic but there are some things that piss me off and I just can't stand saying nothing. it would be great if we all could agree about something without arguing but then we would live in a perfect world and there's no such thing.

JoY
07-13-2008, 09:04 AM
You seem mad at me :( I feel like shit lately, so I'm sorry, I shouldn't have posted at all.
oh silly, or course I'm not mad at you! & it's fine that you shared your experience, but it'd have been better if you'd told about it in a more oppropriate, neutral way. hey, don't feel bad. I'm sorry if I sounded like I was mad at you, I kind of lost my patience there, but I would never be mad at you. girl, if there's anything, please, send me a PM, okay? I don't want you to feel crappy. not because of me, not over this, just not at all.


sipptaroowsky: I didn't say you have to settle this extremely complicated argument in this topic, here & now, I just said it'd be wise for you two to listen to each other. I understand it's easier said than done, I said myself more than once that it's difficult. but listening to each other, you have to admit, would make this discussion more constructive. I didn't say it'll automatically solve all of your problems, but it'd help this discussion move forwards, instead of in circles like it's going now.

I hope you realise by now this is not a matter in which you "win" by proving yourself right. if you're right, that doesn't mean the other person's automatically wrong. what would you "win" anyway, by winning this argument? you want a trophy for it? some kind of prize? would you feel better if Ana felt horrible about her people & her country, would that be your ultimate win?

the distance between Serbs & Croatians can only get bigger, by trying to put all the blame on one party. I don't understand what you're trying to achieve here. it seems like you started this topic to create awareness, but you only want a one-sided discussion, in which you represent the Croatian side of the story & hope to see everyone will agree with you without accepting any possible other side to this argument.

ilovellamas looks at this matter from the frame built by her own experience, the experiences she had in Austria. I look at it from the frame that is built by my experience, that of my family & history. you just stretched my persona to the size of the Netherlands & that of ilovellamas to the size of America by saying the American has a typically American viewpoint & the Dutch has a typically Dutch viewpoint. you just stereotyped ilovellamas' view & mine, based on our countries of origin. really, you're the last one to say we shouldn't look at people as countries.

the fact you said you don't hate Serbians, but you don't like them either, suggests you still associate Serbians, the people, with the horrible things that have happened. you project those atrocities on individuals that come from Serbia. you preach that no one should look at an individual as it's country, but you can't seperate Serbian individuals from the image you have of Serbia as a country, so please, brother.

I said before that I would not look at you guys, as if you represent your entire country & I don't. you do, however. I have no point of view on this matter, except that we foreigners, who have little experience with this matter, because it doesn't involve us, shouldn't pick sides. I openly, explicitly refrained from taking a standpoint, so I don't know what you're talking about.

you preach a lot in this topic, but you don't apply it to yourself, you project it on others who are trying to contribute here. seriously...

sipptaroowsky
07-13-2008, 09:28 AM
sipptaroowsky: I didn't say you have to settle this extremely complicated argument in this topic, here & now, I just said it'd be wise for you two to listen to each other. I understand it's easier said than done, I said myself more than once that it's difficult. but listening to each other, you have to admit, would make this discussion more constructive. I didn't say it'll automatically solve all of your problems, but it'd help this discussion move forwards, instead of in circles like it's going now.

I hope you realise by now this is not a matter in which you "win" by proving yourself right. if you're right, that doesn't mean the other person's automatically wrong. what would you "win" anyway, by winning this argument? you want a trophy for it? some kind of prize? would you feel better if Ana felt horrible about her people & her country, would that be your ultimate win?

the distance between Serbs & Croatians can only get bigger, by trying to put all the blame on one party. I don't understand what you're trying to achieve here. it seems like you started this topic to create awareness, but you only want a one-sided discussion, in which you represent the Croatian side of the story & hope to see everyone will agree with you without accepting any possible other side to this argument.

ilovellamas looks at this matter from the frame built by her own experience, the experiences she had in Austria. I look at it from the frame that is built by my experience, that of my family & history. you just stretched my persona to the size of the Netherlands & that of ilovellamas to the size of America by saying the American has a typically American viewpoint & the Dutch has a typically Dutch viewpoint. you just stereotyped ilovellamas' view & mine, based on our countries of origin. really, you're the last one to say we shouldn't look at people as countries.

the fact you said you don't hate Serbians, but you don't like them either, suggests you still associate Serbians, the people, with the horrible things that have happened. you project those atrocities on individuals that come from Serbia. you preach that no one should look at an individual as it's country, but you can't seperate Serbian individuals from the image you have of Serbia as a country, so please, brother.

I said before that I would not look at you guys, as if you represent your entire country & I don't. you do, however.

I have no point of view on this matter, except that we foreigners, who have little experience with this matter, because it doesn't involve us, shouldn't pick sides. I openly, explicitly refrained from taking a standpoint, so I don't know what you're talking about.

you preach a lot in this topic, but you don't apply it to yourself, you project it on others who are trying to contribute here. seriously, it's irrational & childish.

You see Ana, however it might irritate you, the "I was being sarcastic" is sitl nesecary, since some take me WAAAAY too serious

shanna_guarana
07-14-2008, 06:12 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkgHkxIfgBc&feature=related

my friend showed this to me...I don't know when this happened and I couldn't even watch it till the end....cause it made me feel very bad...sad and everything....I know that the genocide is much worse and thing...but what I wanted to point out was how can on earth they live in the same country...???

sipptaroowsky
07-16-2008, 12:41 PM
Unfortunately I can not see that since Youtube is not accessible to me, from the computer that I am using that is. I will take a look from my friends house.

Have you seen any of the videos in which the action is reversed? In which the Serbs are doing the crime and civilians from other nations such as Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Albania, Kosovo or others are the victims, I assure you the video is as shocking as this one probably is, but much more people died in the ones I saw. I hope you will not look at this comment as an act of aggression or illmaner towards you, just as a fact stated out.

shanna_guarana
07-16-2008, 05:33 PM
Unfortunately I can not see that since Youtube is not accessible to me, from the computer that I am using that is. I will take a look from my friends house.

Have you seen any of the videos in which the action is reversed? In which the Serbs are doing the crime and civilians from other nations such as Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Albania, Kosovo or others are the victims, I assure you the video is as shocking as this one probably is, but much more people died in the ones I saw. I hope you will not look at this comment as an act of aggression or illmaner towards you, just as a fact stated out.

actually, I did. I saw some videos in which Serbs are doing the crime....and that fits also very well in my question...how can they live in the same country with good relations..? well, they can't...and since there are less Serbs there...I guess Albanians will have the whole country just for themselves...and the same thing would happen if there were more Serbs than Albanians....Serbs would do everything for their needs, no matter what Albanians want..just like Albanians are going to do....so....it's soooo not logical to make the country like that...with two nations that can't stand each other.....it's just sooo LOGICAL what's going to happen...

StefanDBH
07-16-2008, 07:24 PM
kosovo hmm... watch this video about situation on kosovo...:P


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQQzWvGU6WA


said but true

Vikica
07-18-2008, 02:50 PM
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/lifecynical

Vikica
07-18-2008, 02:51 PM
nothing much to say, I've said it all

Rebel_Wolf
07-20-2008, 03:45 AM
you are kill in people in kosovo...indepent kosovo!!!

JoY
07-23-2008, 06:39 PM
You see Ana, however it might irritate you, the "I was being sarcastic" is sitl nesecary, since some take me WAAAAY too serious

then maybe you aren't very good at getting across your point & English overal, my dear. if I took you way too seriously, when I read your words the way you wrote them down, you do not know how to use sarcasm, or any of the sort. it's offending for you to pretend I was the one who misunderstood, when your posts suggest exactly what I make of them.

StefanDBH
07-24-2008, 08:16 AM
you are kill in people in kosovo...indepent kosovo!!!

????????????????????????????????????????????????

the Alternate
07-25-2008, 03:34 PM
KOCOBO JE CPБИЯ

Kosovo is Serbia. We've got a bad thing here, extremely bad example of inequality in standards applied to different locations by the Western governments.
One said they use "Great Serbia" but do not forget about people using "Great Albania".
But the main trouble is that the international law is violated in the interest of United States gov & CO..
It's awful to see how does the media and the government secretary are making fools of everyone and are making "independent state" and "indepentent politicians" of former terrorists, drug dealers, human traders and massive killers. And everything for zink and magnesium mines...

shanna_guarana
08-04-2008, 02:52 PM
heeey...I'm back....what's new..? Albanians and Serbs living in peace..? :rolleyes:

Fix
08-26-2008, 06:12 AM
Unfortunately I can not see that since Youtube is not accessible to me, from the computer that I am using that is. I will take a look from my friends house.

Have you seen any of the videos in which the action is reversed? In which the Serbs are doing the crime and civilians from other nations such as Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Albania, Kosovo or others are the victims, I assure you the video is as shocking as this one probably is, but much more people died in the ones I saw. I hope you will not look at this comment as an act of aggression or illmaner towards you, just as a fact stated out.

u are so stupid u know !! u dont know whats going on over here so shut up !! they are traing to take kosovo from us a long time ago...and kosovo is not other country !!!!!!!!!!!!!and in bosnia croatia.... that was war ,and in war terrible things happend,.. on our side and on there side !!! Stupid idiot !

Fix
08-26-2008, 06:16 AM
you are kill in people in kosovo...indepent kosovo!!!

this is not serious...

Fix
08-26-2008, 06:20 AM
Well hello, here I go again. When I first posted on this thread I was stating out how people don't talk about Balkan situation since it causes funny emotion in people. Well that was my point, and I see I succeeded, we're all talking about it now and expressing our opinions which are mostly very different. In some situations I overreacted towards some people, completely inappropriate. I'd like to seize this opportunity to express my honest apologies towards those that I might have hurt with idiotic comments, without considering their emotions or their comments with which I didn't and still don't agree with. Basically you've done the same but I guess I'm not that affected by other people's opinions, especially when I see they're wrong.

There's one thing you need to understand about Balkan situations, and that is that they are very complicated. We all have our theories about how it works but we can't all be right. So it's quite obvious we're going to debate it to decide who's right. It's quite funny to see you trying to settle our differences, (between Ana and me that is) by just saying: settle your differences, listen to each other. Well we all have our solutions to all the world problems, my personal funniest are: listen to each other, stop fighting and all that no-plan solutions. I don't think you consider the idea that Ana and I like the fact that we are different, and we don't want to get changed by some „voices“ on the forum.

Now the real thread,. What about Kosovo. Well I think Kosovo should be a country, I think the foreign governments don't acknowledge Kosovo as a country because of their selfish reasons. Nobody actually thinks about Kosovo. They all see Serbia as the bigger one in all of this, and of course they kiss ass to Serbia. The foreign governments have the exact opinion about the whole Balkans. Look at the Greece and Macedonia relations. You've ever seen the Eurovision. Why does Macedonia has a name „Former Yugoslav Republic Macedonia“. Because Greece doesn't admit Macedonia as their own country. That's just idiotic, I mean the US don't have a name Former English Colony, the Russia doesn't have the name Used to be The CCCP Ringleaders. It's because of the rule of the stronger. Nobody actually cares about Kosovo, everyone cares about themselves. I've looked at all your replies and came to the conclusion that you don't actually understand and even less care about what Kosovo becomes. Your posts against each other , against me, trying to express your personal problem instead of concentrating on Kosovo. You actually don't know what is going on in the Balkans, and even less try to understand it. What you know about us is what we know about you, what you've read or seen in the media. Put aside your personal issues and try considering Kosovo for Kosovo not your self.

The personal thing; No I don't hate Serbia, and no I don't hate Serbians, but I don't like them either. Same thing goes to miss Ana. But if you look at the facts, I don't know what Croatia or Kosovo have against Serbia, it's the other way around, it's Serbian ideals that stand in the ways of Kosovo and Croatia. The fact states also the mistakes Serbia made towards everyone else (I'm trying not to use words like genocide, murder, killing, since it hurts people’s feelings) and the mistakes everyone else didn't make toward Serbia. Those things are considerable when we talk about Kosovo independence.

One more thing, please don’t sustain your self from commenting on this thread, I find it fascinating how people from different places have opinions typical for the place or environment which they are from. This stands for the comments against mine, the American thinks like an American, the Dutch thinks like a Dutch, funny, but let’s not look at people as countries.

sta ima da im objashnjavas kad neznaju ni de se nalazi balkan ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6r1IcY1pv0

metalmania
09-03-2008, 03:59 PM
kosovo,bosna vs. they re still bleeding ,they re still crying.many people died there.many kids died when they cry under the bombs ,many people's funerals re still screamin' there .who did do it? who did watch this genocide? you know this answer:only europe ;)
where were europe when they fight? where were united nations?

sipptaroowsky
09-16-2008, 10:41 AM
sta ima da im objashnjavas kad neznaju ni de se nalazi balkan ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6r1IcY1pv0

I was on Ovčara a manth and a half ago, do you know where that is?

shanna_guarana
09-17-2008, 06:08 AM
that was quite stupid...

offsrx
09-17-2008, 07:57 AM
ljudi zasto pricate o politici?
To nije do nas i mozemo samo da se svadjamo.
kosovo su proglasili Amerikanci i neke drzave EU.
Jedini krivci su pogresna politika u poslednjih 50 godina ali jedino resenje je Medjunarodni sud pravde.

sipptaroowsky
09-21-2008, 02:07 PM
that was quite stupid...

You really don't have to coment all my posts

metalmania
09-22-2008, 08:09 AM
kosovo is just the shame of europe! cant you see it?

shanna_guarana
09-22-2008, 03:38 PM
You really don't have to coment all my posts

i want to. it's kind of great pleasure.

sipptaroowsky
09-23-2008, 02:37 PM
i want to. it's kind of great pleasure.

now you know how I feel about it,,,bahahaha

shanna_guarana
09-23-2008, 03:00 PM
now you know how I feel about it,,,bahahaha

hahaha, right...

sipptaroowsky
09-23-2008, 03:14 PM
anyway I'm sorry If I've spread nationalistic hate thoward you,. I jost got in to the second year of college so I feel kind of ... approachable, anyway sry

shanna_guarana
09-23-2008, 03:19 PM
anyway I'm sorry If I've spread nationalistic hate thoward you,. I jost got in to the second year of college so I feel kind of ... approachable, anyway sry

oh, it's ok....it's really hard for both nations...to just forget everything in a second...so, it's ok...