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View Full Version : Looking back on the Bush presidency...



bighead384
11-24-2008, 06:27 PM
Now that George W. Bush's presidency is all but over, I thought it might be interesting to grade his 8 years in office.

Pros?
Cons?

Final Grade?

Cock Joke
11-24-2008, 06:57 PM
I'm wondering if he'll go down in history as the USA's worst president of all-time?
It's definitely something to think about.

MY ANALYSIS: It started off strong. Seemed like it would be a good one. We captured Saddam, but for whatever reason, we just couldn't end the war in Iraq there, now could we? During Bush's second term, that's when things started to slowly go downhill and he started becoming more & more incompetent.

Overall, Bush gets a C-.

randman21
11-24-2008, 08:03 PM
Really, a C-? I pride myself on not being a Bush basher, but I give him an F. Look at the current situation we're in. Original poster, I know my lack of specific reasons makes me lame, but I don't have the time right now.

iPunk247
11-24-2008, 11:09 PM
:(:mad:BUSHY is so like whatevers. its all about OBAMA baby. such a babe. :D:o EDiT why fucken bother grading shit? yikes!

wheelchairman
11-25-2008, 05:06 AM
Supposedly it takes a good 40 years for history to truly judge a president.

This seems true because the opposition will always try and portray the current president as the worst president of all time.

Was the economic crisis his fault? No not really, however he did nothing to prevent it either. His measures to counteract the crisis have not been particularly great. Although I wouldn't find it hard to believe that he exacerbated the problem.

The various human rights scandals are well scandalous.

It's hard to get perspective though. Because I personally believe he was godawful. Worst president in recent history. But was he really worse than Reagan? I think a lot of parallels could be drawn.

The invasion of Afghanistan was the right thing to do. The invasion of Iraq was clearly the wrong thing to do. Too bad that things are going better now in Iraq but going so miserably in Afghanistan, that's kinda ironic.

The lies about believing in small government but forcing Christian conservative morality even upon states with the highest number of atheists (yes Oregon did appreciate those faith based initiatives....) is just annoying.

So I think he's a terrible president. But I need more time and a larger frame of reference to truly compare. He might end up simply as history's least memorable president. Certainly glad to close this chapter on the Bush dynasty.

JoY
11-25-2008, 06:07 AM
Supposedly it takes a good 40 years for history to truly judge a president.

This seems true because the opposition will always try and portray the current president as the worst president of all time.

Was the economic crisis his fault? No not really, however he did nothing to prevent it either. His measures to counteract the crisis have not been particularly great. Although I wouldn't find it hard to believe that he exacerbated the problem.

The various human rights scandals are well scandalous.

It's hard to get perspective though. Because I personally believe he was godawful. Worst president in recent history. But was he really worse than Reagan? I think a lot of parallels could be drawn.

The invasion of Afghanistan was the right thing to do. The invasion of Iraq was clearly the wrong thing to do. Too bad that things are going better now in Iraq but going so miserably in Afghanistan, that's kinda ironic.

The lies about believing in small government but forcing Christian conservative morality even upon states with the highest number of atheists (yes Oregon did appreciate those faith based initiatives....) is just annoying.

So I think he's a terrible president. But I need more time and a larger frame of reference to truly compare. He might end up simply as history's least memorable president. Certainly glad to close this chapter on the Bush dynasty.

great post. (because I agree. how nice to be subjective) I won't be able to word my opinion so clearly, but I'll try anyway.

not only will the opposition try to portray him as the worst ever, only time will learn if certain problems were caused directly/indirectly by his influence & were "his fault" so to say, or were part of "normal" fluctuation & couldn't really have been avoided. smaller problems had been piling up for years, maybe they just happened to escalate during his presidency. question is; for how many years (before his presidency) had these smaller problems been piling up & how did he contribute to those problems to make them escalate? you can't know how things would've gone in those 8 years with another president & now there is a new president, how things will evolve in the future.

I think the economic crisis, as you said, was waiting to happen, but he did a lousy job limiting the consequences. I don't know much about his interventions for damage control, while I have tried to stay updated... which makes me feel like there wasn't a whole lot of damage control in the first place. early in the year 2007 the book "when the dollar collapses" came out in the Netherlands. everybody was just waiting for it to happen, but it seems like the reaction to it was like a cat in the headlights of a car.

I remember our debates at the dinnertable about invading Iraq. I seem to remember almost my entire family was against it, but there were some firy debates, so I'm not sure. all I was thinking was; who the hell do you think you are? what the fuck do you think you're doing? what in god's name do you think this will accomplish? & how in the hell are you going to fix & undo what you're about to start?

I'm not just talking about the meassurable consequences, but also about the message it gives off. the world was like; "ooo, hostile!", but not just that; because American culture binds the nation so strongly, because most of America has a very dominant "we"-feeling & pride (which is in many ways awesome), retards (& god knows stupid people are everywhere) with no opinion of their own became incredibly fanatic about invading the Middle East, like "show them how it's done", they actually got excited & passionate about a freaking warzone. it was truly creepy to watch. just be careful what kind of message you send out to your people, because not everyone can put things into perspective & has the ratio to understand what's going on & put together an opinion on it being right or wrong.

whatever Obama will do, at least the world received a loud & clear message from America, that this time they want to do things differently. it's like his election cleared America's name in the eyes of the world in advance (because he's still got to prove his worth & with the high expectations, I fear the man won't be able to live upto them, but still will do a much better job than Bush has ever done).

anyway, one thing will always be priceless about Bush; think of all the Bush-jokes that have been entertaining the entire planet & will for years to come.

jacknife737
11-25-2008, 09:31 AM
It seems a bit silly to claim before his presidency is over that he will be seen as the "worst president ever".

The faults of his administration are indeed numerous; the handling of the financial crisis (not his fault, but clearly mis-managed). Human rights abuses at Gitmo, Abu Ghraib, and the deportation of innocent people to countries where they faced torture such as Maher Arar. As well the miss-managing of Katrina. The overall corruption of his administration, such as the Alberto Gonzales affair at the scandal invovling the hireing of US civil servents to serve in Iraq (ie asking them questions during the interviews about Roe v Wade).

Also, i think most importantly is what Rove and Bush's campaign war room did to American society and political landscape is quite signifant. The way they ran their campaign (ie by forming a "base" of supporters and then enraging them to ensure participating) clearly led to a polarization of American society. I also feel that they have doomed the GOP to constant electoral defeat unless it manages to reform itself.

As for the foreign policy, this cannot be assessed with certainty today. It will be up to history to judge it. Afghanistan was indeed the correct course of action, but the focus on Iraq has allowed chaos and anarchy to flourish and the new president will be forced to reevaluate US strategy here. Iraq is another story all together. I'm opposed to the Iraq war for practical, rather then ideological reasons. I think the removal off Sadam Hussein was the correct course of action; as well i fully support reconstruction efforts. However, it is clear that there was a major lack of planning on behalf of Rumsfeld and Bush, et al; most noticeably the lack of a plan to deal with the insurgency and insufficient troop levels needed for pacification. Yet Iraq today is pretty stable, and its future is indeed bright. So perhaps Bush may yet be vindicated in this respect.

Little_Miss_1565
11-25-2008, 10:59 AM
I can't wait to find out how the Republican party feels about the newly expanded executive powers of the president once Bam takes office!

wheelchairman
11-25-2008, 11:23 AM
I can't wait to find out how the Republican party feels about the newly expanded executive powers of the president once Bam takes office!

Is that a joke about big black cocks? tsk tsk tsk how tasteless Little Miss!

Little_Miss_1565
11-25-2008, 02:51 PM
Is that a joke about big black cocks? tsk tsk tsk how tasteless Little Miss!

I think you're projecting!

Mota Boy
11-26-2008, 07:41 AM
Here's a challenge: see how many major Bush initiatives you can name.

No Child Left Behind

Tax Cuts

Department of Homeland Security

Afghanistan War

Iraq War

There are almost certainly more, but that's all I can think of for now.

NCLB is widely considered a failure, and is attacked by both Democrats and Republicans. The tax cuts will soon be repealed. The DoHC was a clusterfuck, the full force of whose incompetence only emerged in the aftermath of Katrina. Afghanistan has been getting worse and Iraq was turned around by a combination of a switching the generals on the ground and events beyond our control.

Something else you'll note: nothing from the second term. Since winning reelection in 2004 and being in control of a Republican House and Senate, the White House has been unable to get a single major piece of legislation passed.

I think history will excoriate the Bush Administration as being controlled by idealogues on foreign policy while turning over domestic policy to party strategists obsessed with leaving behind a legacy of a permanent Republican majority. And we know how that turned out.

sKratch
11-26-2008, 11:14 AM
I can't wait to find out how the Republican party feels about the newly expanded executive powers of the president once Bam takes office!

Would be best if he rescinded them.

Vera
11-27-2008, 02:22 AM
Here's a challenge: see how many major Bush initiatives you can name.

The Patriot Act (? I guess?)

Smash_Returns
12-03-2008, 09:18 AM
He never received an opposing viewpoint in his discussions on major policies (got caught up in groupthink) which made pretty much all of them completely fail.

Which is why Obama is appointing such a diverse cabinet.

Overall, while I feel that he had lots of failed policies, none of the worst stuff was truly his fault.

Things beyond his control:
9/11
Katrina
Mortgage Crisis

Balancing those and two wars (one justified, one unjustified). He really wasn't TERRIBLE.

Balancing all those issues gets him a positive mark
Iraq gets him a negative mark
Failed Policies gets him a negative mark

So... I'll give him a D/C-

pyrimid
12-04-2008, 10:21 PM
Which is why Obama is appointing such a diverse cabinet.



What have you been smoking, and can I have some...

The majority of his appointments have been Clinton Cronies, and the only republican is the secretary of defense, Gates (he will be screwed either way, if he does a good job Obama will take the credit for it, if he dose a bad job he will be fired and they will say look at the bad republican). Napolitano as the director of homeland security? She has forced Arizona in to near bankruptcy, ($5 Billion deficit), and the southern border (I know I line 30 Minutes from the border) is not secured in any way, everyday I see truck loads of drugs coming across the border, and not the good kind.

What I am concerned about is that it is just going to be politics as usual in DC and Obama will not do anything new, and 4 years from now it won’t be much different than at the end of the Carter Presidency. Mediocre is not what I want in a president, he has said a lot and I hope he lives up to the peoples expectations and his legacy is not that he was just "the first black President".

NGNM85
12-07-2008, 09:55 PM
If I believed in God I would say there is a special place in hell for George W. Bush. I suspect his name will, deservedly, be uttered, in the years to come, with the same sort of contempt which one often accompanies "Nixon" for earlier generations, at least. We owe it to ourselves, and to the world that this vulgar little man's legacy cannot, and must not, be rehabilitated. It is to our eternal shame that he was able to govern in such an unconscionable manner with impunity, it should be our greatest hope that we, and the future generations through our guidance, will learn the very potent lessons of this period, to make sure nothing like this happens again.

pyrimid
12-08-2008, 12:41 AM
If I believed in God I would say there is a special place in hell for George W. Bush. I suspect his name will, deservedly, be uttered, in the years to come, with the same sort of contempt which one often accompanies "Nixon" for earlier generations, at least. We owe it to ourselves, and to the world that this vulgar little man's legacy cannot, and must not, be rehabilitated. It is to our eternal shame that he was able to govern in such an unconscionable manner with impunity, it should be our greatest hope that we, and the future generations through our guidance, will learn the very potent lessons of this period, to make sure nothing like this happens again.

Wow you really hate bush, (I know there is a joke there) but do you really think any other politicians are any better.

Yes things are fucked up but the whole political system needs to be restructured. With the ability to gain such power and money just by being a politician, I feel that almost all of the modern eras of politicians are corrupt in one form or another.

What is to be done about this, I am not sure if we need to tear it all down or continue to hope that some will eventually make changes.

I was for Obama becoming president, but now that I see his picks for his cabinet, I am starting to question the hope and change line. Their does not seem to be any real change coming, at least none that I can see yet.

Can you tell me any different?

If so please do, I am begining to really question things.

jacknife737
12-08-2008, 01:40 AM
Non of Obama's cabinet apointments have not gone against any of his policy positions, which is why i'm puzzled to some of the minor uproar some of them have caused (mainly on the blogsophere).


As for "change", well i think it's quite obvious, that his staff selections represent a clear divergence from the Bush White House. I mean, who did you expect him to appoint, people with zero Washington experience? He needs folks who know how to run an effective administration.

pyrimid
12-08-2008, 02:12 AM
Non of Obama's cabinet apointments have not gone against any of his policy positions, which is why i'm puzzled to some of the minor uproar some of them have caused (mainly on the blogsophere).


As for "change", well i think it's quite obvious, that his staff selections represent a clear divergence from the Bush White House. I mean, who did you expect him to appoint, people with zero Washington experience? He needs folks who know how to run an effective administration.

So you are saying that “Washington Politics” as usual is good enough for you, as long as it is not the bush administration.

What the blogs are all pissed about is that Obama said that “Washington Politics” was not the way he was going to be, and that his administration was going to bring change to “business as usual”. Taking us back to the Clinton Era is what seems to be going on.

jacknife737
12-08-2008, 02:36 AM
I don’t consider “Washington politics” to be a derogatory term. The former members of the Clinton team who have since joined Obama are simply the best people for the job. “Washington politics” to me represents experience and realism, I was never caught up in this “fairy tale” that some people have created about the Obama campaign.

And as I just mentioned in the previous post, Obama was mostly referring to the eight previous years of Bush when referencing “change”. Obama was quite open with his position on policies, if you couldn’t tell he would be like Clinton, then quite frankly, you weren’t paying attention. The Clinton administration ran a very efficient and effective government, I can only hope that Obama’s is similar in nature.

pyrimid
12-08-2008, 03:37 AM
I don’t consider “Washington politics” to be a derogatory term. The former members of the Clinton team who have since joined Obama are simply the best people for the job. “Washington politics” to me represents experience and realism, I was never caught up in this “fairy tale” that some people have created about the Obama campaign.

And as I just mentioned in the previous post, Obama was mostly referring to the eight previous years of Bush when referencing “change”. Obama was quite open with his position on policies, if you couldn’t tell he would be like Clinton, then quite frankly, you weren’t paying attention. The Clinton administration ran a very efficient and effective government, I can only hope that Obama’s is similar in nature.

Do you know what was done by the military while Bill Clinton was Commander and Chief?

Military actions under Clinton-
1992-1996 – Bosnia, Croatia, Serbia
1992 -- Kuwait
1992-2003 -- Iraq. U.S. & U. K. conducting aerial reconnaissance and bombings.
1992-95 – Somalia
1993-Present -- Bosnia-Herzegovina.
1993 -- Macedonia.
1994-95 -- Haiti.
1994 -- Macedonia.
1995 -- Bosnia. NATO bombing of Bosnian Serbs. Operation Deliberate Force
1996 -- Central African Republic.
1996, Iraqi Operation Desert Strike
1997 -- Albania. Operation Silver Wake
1997 -- Congo and Gabon.
1997 -- Sierra Leone.
1997 -- Cambodia.
1998 -- Iraq. US-led bombing campaign against Iraq Operation Desert Fox
1998 -- Guinea-Bissau.
1998 - 1999 Kenya and Tanzania.
1998 -- Afghanistan and Sudan. Operation Infinite Reach
1998 -- Liberia.
1999 - 2001 East Timor.
1999 – Serbia, Kosovo Operation Allied Force
As well as the privatization of tens of thousands of military jobs, and the corporation Halliburton becomes used for operations on foreign soil that is deemed to controversial for U.S. Military to be involved with.

jacknife737
12-08-2008, 11:42 AM
Look, this thread isn't about Clinton's presidency, so let's not turn it into one.

But to answer your question, I am well aware of what occurred under Clinton, and to be honest, i don't have any major objections to most of those military actions that you just listed.

But, as I said, let's keep this thread on topic.

pyrimid
12-09-2008, 02:35 AM
Look, this thread isn't about Clinton's presidency, so let's not turn it into one.

But to answer your question, I am well aware of what occurred under Clinton, and to be honest, i don't have any major objections to most of those military actions that you just listed.

But, as I said, let's keep this thread on topic.

Well then we have to look at more bush bashing and round the camp fire we go telling stories about how evil bush is.

Personally I don't think bush did that bad a job.

NGNM85
12-19-2008, 08:26 PM
Do you know what was done by the military while Bill Clinton was Commander and Chief?

Military actions under Clinton-
1992-1996 – Bosnia, Croatia, Serbia
1992 -- Kuwait
1992-2003 -- Iraq. U.S. & U. K. conducting aerial reconnaissance and bombings.
1992-95 – Somalia
1993-Present -- Bosnia-Herzegovina.
1993 -- Macedonia.
1994-95 -- Haiti.
1994 -- Macedonia.
1995 -- Bosnia. NATO bombing of Bosnian Serbs. Operation Deliberate Force
1996 -- Central African Republic.
1996, Iraqi Operation Desert Strike
1997 -- Albania. Operation Silver Wake
1997 -- Congo and Gabon.
1997 -- Sierra Leone.
1997 -- Cambodia.
1998 -- Iraq. US-led bombing campaign against Iraq Operation Desert Fox
1998 -- Guinea-Bissau.
1998 - 1999 Kenya and Tanzania.
1998 -- Afghanistan and Sudan. Operation Infinite Reach
1998 -- Liberia.
1999 - 2001 East Timor.
1999 – Serbia, Kosovo Operation Allied Force
As well as the privatization of tens of thousands of military jobs, and the corporation Halliburton becomes used for operations on foreign soil that is deemed to controversial for U.S. Military to be involved with.

It looks like you left out the assault on al-shifa in Sudan which cost thousands of lives. But the fact remains, most of these actions are considered criminal under established guidelines; Nuremberg, Geneva, etc., however, if you believe in those standards, and you apply them equally, the Bush administration is even worse. He's worse on all fronts, the economy, foreign policy, social policy, etc. Now, it may seem senseless to quibble between the lesser of two evils, but we've only got two choices in this country right now, if you care at all about the country or society, or the world, you choose the lesser evil. I wasn't thrilled by John Kerry, but he was less objectionable than the other choice, I was essentially voting AGAINST George Bush. I have no illusions about Obama, but again, I had to pick the better of the two.

Oxygene
12-21-2008, 04:15 AM
is a wonderfull thing in and of itself anyway.. why ruin it by talking about it :)

But to add something constructive: my biggest problem was his reelection... it completley destroyed my faith in the sanity of the american people. Although you cannot throw the baby out with the bathwater, it still was a huge blow. Some of it was reset by electing barack obama.

metalmania
12-21-2008, 01:16 PM
hehe i guess weapon incs. sold thousands of weapon in unknown or known countries and a million people died only in middleeast(the interior civils) oh i forgot im sorry that gas-oil incs. in same time;their weath's increased ;) his false,colonist policies made new fanatic east people and its not good.cause it becomes our world to hell.now he's gone and new person came and they're trying this colonist image with new one ;) our world must save from west's colonist view and east's fanatism;i hope our world becomes heaven.maybe we cant see it maybe our kids cant see it maybe our grandchilds cant see it :D but a generation will see the sunny days one day!i do believe!

Al Coholic
12-21-2008, 01:51 PM
Nothing about the presidency really shocked me. I didn't feel the Iraq war was necessary, there were no WMDs, and we've wasted a lot of money. I thought the tax cuts to the wealthy and benefit cuts to the poor were assinine. I felt the deficit spending has gotten to catastrophic levels, and we waste way too much (something like 12?%) of our budget just paying down interest on loans. The environmental deregulation was blatant, and is still ongoing right now. This was all in his first term. What I found ridiculous was that he was re-elected. And despite all the reports coming out saying we did lie about Iraq, and the tarnishing of the justice department, and the relief failure of our own people in Katrina... a fifth of the people in this country still like the guy.

Just goes to show how far religious pandering and a TV persona will get you.

metalmania
12-21-2008, 02:01 PM
Nothing about the presidency really shocked me. I didn't feel the Iraq war was necessary, there were no WMDs, and we've wasted a lot of money. I thought the tax cuts to the wealthy and benefit cuts to the poor were assinine. I felt the deficit spending has gotten to catastrophic levels, and we waste way too much (something like 12?%) of our budget just paying down interest on loans. The environmental deregulation was blatant, and is still ongoing right now. This was all in his first term. What I found ridiculous was that he was re-elected. And despite all the reports coming out saying we did lie about Iraq, and the tarnishing of the justice department, and the relief failure of our own people in Katrina... a fifth of the people in this country still like the guy.

Just goes to show how far religious pandering and a TV persona will get you.
yes dude i join your view about iraq war.it was a big lie and they couldnt find mass destruction mass in iraq!remember why did they go to iraq!(they didnt go there for to overturn to saddam,i dont like him but everybody knows the reality now)for to find these weapons and to bring the freedom there:D (big lie) but now!!!they couldnt find these weapons,and they couldnt bring freedom there and only chaos domanites there.you re or we re re sitting in hot houses and watching death news on tv everyday! so its tragedy!and same events will be in kafkasia!so do not beleive to these lies ;) so dont beleive the lies of emperialism

Llamas
12-21-2008, 07:01 PM
One of my Republican friends says he's "back on the Bush bandwagon" in the last few months cause he's convinced Bush has become a fiscal liberal.

wheelchairman
12-21-2008, 10:43 PM
Whats English for Kafkasia?

Wild guess, the Caucasus.

HornyPope
12-21-2008, 11:11 PM
Wild guess, the Caucasus.

Lol, no. I'm pretty sure it's spelled Couscous.

0r4ng3
12-21-2008, 11:14 PM
And here I thought it was always spelled Carcass.

metalmania
12-22-2008, 07:10 AM
hehe i like this term abot kafkasia.its very strong ,powerful name anyway.if you coriosity the policy of these men about these geography:you have to read the "THE NEW COLD WAR/SECRET OF COLOURLY REVOLUTIONS" by MARK MACKINNON.you can understand their politic games (soros,and his awares),cia,ned...) in sybria,crotia,russia,georgia,ukraine,blacksea,kırg hısistan,iran,iraq,afghanistan........

wheelchairman
12-22-2008, 07:25 AM
hehe i like this term abot kafkasia.its very strong ,powerful name anyway.if you coriosity the policy of these men about these geography:you have to read the "THE NEW COLD WAR/SECRET OF COLOURLY REVOLUTIONS" by MARK MACKINNON.you can understand their politic games (soros,and his awares),cia,ned...) in sybria,crotia,russia,georgia,ukraine,blacksea,kırg hısistan,iran,iraq,afghanistan........
Holy crap the Caucasus wants to invade Sorø? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sor%C3%B8)

metalmania
12-22-2008, 10:36 AM
Holy crap the Caucasus wants to invade Sorø? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sor%C3%B8)
hm can you explain what's mean of your qusetion?

DexterWannabe
12-22-2008, 04:23 PM
Bush is one of the best presidents ever. He kept America safe after 9/11 and brought liberty to the Middle East. He had the balls to do the job and in the future we will se that his moves were right. Saddam was dangerous and needed to be removed. The global war on terror will continue for a long time and we will defeat the terrorists.
Hooah.

pyrimid
12-22-2008, 11:39 PM
bush is one of the best presidents ever. He kept america safe after 9/11 and brought liberty to the middle east. He had the balls to do the job and in the future we will se that his moves were right. Saddam was dangerous and needed to be removed. The global war on terror will continue for a long time and we will defeat the terrorists.
Hooah.

de oppresso liber

Not Ozymandias
12-27-2008, 05:58 PM
Pros?
Ha ha, no.

metalmania
12-28-2008, 11:27 AM
shoessss! :D
we re just using them for walking but a man'd remind shoes's other sense to us! .
therefore shoes can be a perfect protestaion tool! ;)

metalmania
12-31-2008, 02:59 PM
bush's shoes number is 42,is it right? :D:D

mrs_hollandova
01-01-2009, 08:48 AM
Bush was actually the best president ever, because when you look at him, you see USA :D

metalmania
01-01-2009, 12:13 PM
aha she is a perfect bush fan but i guess he hasnt got a photo on the beach so isnt bad?:D:D:D

findout5
01-06-2009, 03:00 PM
I only like his daughters :p
He is probably one of the worst presidents ever! He fucked up the US and the rest of the world. How the americans were dumb enough to vote twice for him is a mystery to me!

Cock Joke
01-06-2009, 03:59 PM
Bush was actually the best president ever, because when you look at him, you see USA :D

When Bush does push-ups, he's not pushing himself up, he's pushing the earth down!

Duskygrin
01-12-2009, 03:20 PM
The best thing about Bush is his bushims. And the Pretzel incident.

I think they misunderestimated him: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7809160.stm

metalmania
01-13-2009, 02:42 PM
bush made a project.its name was THE BIG MIDDLEEAST PROJECT.supposedly this project was a perfect peace system for middleaest and he found partners for this project(turkey,israel,egyp...) but now we all saw :this project became to hell for middleaest since 2002.and now folks re killing other folks,governments re attacking to other governments.this BMP collapsed cause it was game of emperialism and this project was enemy of this line but i think this bad policy is producting the new ideas.this geography was cradle of the civilizations but now.same place is the bloodlake by foolisht projects.bush was just a pawn in this chessboard and world waits for new pawns