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View Full Version : Memory of Light to be split into three books.



T-6005
04-07-2009, 07:03 AM
I don't know if anyone will care aside from Per, but it's good enough for me.

The last volume of the Wheel of Time will apparently be split into three volumes, released a year apart in November of 2009, 2010, and 2011.

Which kind of sucks. I love the Wheel of Time, and if Brandon Sanderson can do a decent job on it I'm cool with a few more books. But waiting so long is just so frustrating. It's an overarching plot that Robert Jordan wanted condensed into one book, and now it's THREE books. Released a year apart each. I WANT TO KNOW THE END.

The first of the three will be called The Gathering Storm.

I think if the first book does come out in November, I'll start rereading the series in July sometime.

wheelchairman
04-08-2009, 07:58 AM
I'm also planning on starting in July cause I heard November/December as well. Robert Jordan was deadset on having the books come out in one volume. So this really sucks. It means that I may even have to read the series again by the last one, just because you forget so much when there are already 13 volumes with an average of 800 pages.

T-6005
04-08-2009, 10:52 AM
Yeah, I read a bunch of opinions about how the books should be released six months apart each so that the cycle is complete within a year of this November, but apparently the author doesn't think he can have it prepared that quickly - it takes too long to go over in the editing process. But apparently the date set is the outside probability.

All the same, I'm pretty annoyed about it - even learning that apparently it isn't possible to bind 750,000 words into one book.

wheelchairman
04-08-2009, 04:37 PM
Robert Jordan did say that he expected them to discover a new way of printing just to get the final book(s) in one hard back edition instead of separating them. You would think they would fulfill a dying man's last wish.


Oh man this is like Dune all over again, except interesting.

T-6005
04-08-2009, 04:47 PM
Robert Jordan did say that he expected them to discover a new way of printing just to get the final book(s) in one hard back edition instead of separating them. You would think they would fulfill a dying man's last wish.


Oh man this is like Dune all over again, except interesting.
He said it'll be one volume even IF they have to invent a new way to bind. I think it's really funny that in the 21th century we still can't bind such large books. So much for the future.

Apparently his wife thinks that if he'd had to, he wouldn't have done it, since it's practically impossible. But who knows.

I think 2 years is just such a damn long time for books. The author who's finishing it has a blog post about the decision to split the books. If you're interested in checking out any of the Brandon Sanderson's actual work, I suggest you get Elantris first - it's quite decent. The first two Mistborn books by him are also pretty good, but the third one blows.

Here's his blog post about it. http://www.brandonsanderson.com/article/56/Splitting-AMOL

wheelchairman
04-08-2009, 05:37 PM
I'll check him out probably. But I'm not sure if I want to check him out before or after I finish wheel of time. Because if I like his works then I will appreciate what he did to wheel of time. If I don't, I might not notice how he ruined wheel of time.

Quite the dilemma.

T-6005
04-08-2009, 05:48 PM
Well, I already know it won't be as good as if Robert Jordan had written it. I just wanted it to be good enough. That was the initial reason I checked out his books - to see if he'd do a decent job.

If he writes it like the first two Mistborns, it'll be pretty good - not amazing, but good enough for me to read the end. I didn't mind the third Mistborn either, just the plot ended stupidly. Since the plot's already set for this, I'm cool with that too. Elantris is my favorite book of his - it's worth a quick read.

Paint_It_Black
04-10-2009, 08:03 AM
I'm pretty torn on this. When Robert Jordan died I assumed the series would never be completed, and that was a huge disappointment. So I should be very excited by this news. And yet I'm not.

It just doesn't feel right. I honestly can't decide if I want to read these new ones or not. Especially since they are being split now. And is this guy really the best guy for the job? Maybe they should have waited a little longer before choosing him as the Jordan Reborn.

I wonder if this guy will consciously attempt to emulate Jordan's style or if he'll try to make it his own. Either way has drawbacks.

Creating three books out of what should have been one feels a bit like milking a dead cow, but I suppose if there's really enough content to justify it then I'll try not to be cynical about that.

wheelchairman
04-10-2009, 08:06 AM
From what I've read, even before he died he excepted the last book to be about 2000 pages, which means he had enough notes, etc. to justify such a prediction, or even had enough material. So I don't think it's a stretch that 2000 pages could be made into 3 volumes.

It's just a buzzkill. They should release them simultaneously then, bad marketing strategy perhaps but easier on the reader.

T-6005
04-10-2009, 10:58 AM
The thing is, they're expecting it to be around 750,000 words. With that, it's so long that editing process would take forever - were the books to be released simultaneously they would only be released sometime next year or even in 2011. Apparently they preferred to give the fans at least something to read this year, even if it isn't the entirety of the last story arc.

Paint_It_Black
04-11-2009, 01:20 AM
Pretty sure the fans would gladly wait. Pretty sure they want some quick money.

I'm not always this cynical, honestly.

T-6005
04-11-2009, 09:39 AM
Pretty sure the fans would gladly wait. Pretty sure they want some quick money.

I'm not always this cynical, honestly.

It's always possible - to be honest, however, I don't want to wait. I want the entirety of the book NOW, and if I can't have the entire book I want at least a little something.

Offspring-Junkie
04-12-2009, 02:23 AM
I'm not much of a reader, so I can't imagine how it is to wait for a book. I read two books this year, one even in English, that's more than I usually do. And I don't know Robert Jordan.

wheelchairman
04-12-2009, 08:04 AM
Get the fuck out of this thread hobo.

T-6005
09-03-2009, 10:52 AM
I'm just about done rereading Eye of the World, and though I know exactly what happens from here on in I'm still pretty engaged in this story.

What I really like are the little touches around the edges, like meeting peripheral characters that have a tendency to reappear later - Basel Gill and Lamgwin at the inn, Tallanvor in the palace and such. Even Else Grinwell in the farm and Bayle Domon on the ship running from Trollocs eventually get brought back into the story, but Robert Jordan just lets them go their own way for a while.

I mean, even Padan Fain isn't mentioned by name after Baerlon, and he turns out to be pretty fucking important.

It's pretty great.

wheelchairman
09-03-2009, 03:54 PM
What I noticed is that even small insignificant places later have a role in the books. On their way to Caemlyn (can't remember which part, whether pre or post Four Kings) they pass some place called "____ Springs" (my memory sucks) which is where Gareth Bryne late retires as you may recall.

And even Salidar is on the map. It amazes me how much looks to be pre-planned just by all the details. All the little freaking details. :p

I also started recently (a few months ago) and am now in the middle of the 4th book. Which is pretty boring in the beginning, but there is more humor which is enjoyable.

We see Floran Gelb for the first time here. I don't remember why he's important, but his name is memorable. You also find out who Bors is in this book, I couldn't remember which Whitecloak, even though I suspected.

wheelchairman
09-04-2009, 05:12 AM
I've always liked that its Kaf and Tabac, and not tobacco and coffee as well.

And another thing I like is that I strongly suspect he makes up the names of roots, plants and fruits more often than not so that we'll just imagine them or whatever. The same with when he describes sword fights, except that in the first book or two you don't "know" the names of the different moves.

T-6005
09-04-2009, 12:45 PM
I do like the whole Tabac/Kaf thing as well, but I'm still more of a fan of how things tend to come back.

In the first book, there's that clear Lord of the Rings influence and so a lot of things just seem made up to impress the reader with cool titles - Lan's Malkieri heritage, Thom's past with Morgase in Caemlyn - actually get explained in later books as real events which influence the world, instead of just being "check out this cool title that this character has."

Even the Worms they meet in the Blight at the end of the first book are mentioned - by Sammael, I think - later on, tying everything together. Lan says two words to Ragan when riding into Fal Dara, and that character actually comes back to be a part - a small part, but a part nonetheless - of the series.

But most of all, I like how after the first book saidar and saidin aren't limitless sources of magic - how they work and their limitations are more clearly explained than in almost any other fantasy series.

Here's a question, though - how the hell does Bela (that's right, the horse) survive all of this? If I remember correctly, in Knife of Dreams she's Siuan's horse. It's like how has this horse survived as a named character this long?

wheelchairman
09-04-2009, 01:21 PM
I've actually always liked that about Bela actually. Pretty obvious though:

Rand takes Bela to Emond's Field, Egwene takes Bela out of Emond's field and eventually to Tar Valon where Bela is left behind once Egwene, Nynaeve and Elayne leave Tar Valon (first with Liandrin, and then again on the errand that Siuan sends them on). When Siuan is deposed she takes Bela on her escape with the former Domani keeper and Logaine.

Actually I had forgotten how much Logaine becomes one of my favorite characters. Or how we hear about Mazrim Taim so much and how he seems to almost be an allusion to the role that Sammael plays in the former age.

I also love hearing about the Age of Legends because it is so science-fictiony in that fantasy/Star Wars way.

What I really want to know more about is the Seanchan and the lands east of the Aiel Waste.

The only real problem with the books is that Rand sucks to read.

T-6005
09-04-2009, 01:54 PM
The only real problem with the books is that Rand sucks to read.
Ugh, I totally agree. He's alright in the first books, but by Fires of Heaven I was looking forward to Mat and Perrin's chapters most of all (particularly Mat's). Although Mat starts getting awesome halfway through The Dragon Reborn.

I was actually disappointed when Robert Jordan confirmed in an interview that Mazrim Taim wasn't Demandred. Demandred and Sammael have really similar stories, though - Sammael was Lews Therin's friend, they rediscovered swordfighting or something, and then when Lews Therin did something or other Sammael got jealous. Demandred was pretty much jealous and second best in the world from the start, though.

I like that the Forsaken aren't homogeneous for the most part, though - they've all got different ways of acting and carrying out their plans, and it's more interesting to watch than if it were "Oh look it's all these bad guys acting together."

Until she got neutered (in Salidar the character lost all appeal for me) Moghedien was my favorite Forsaken.

wheelchairman
09-04-2009, 02:08 PM
They seemed either inactive or subservient to Ishamael though until he dies of course. Although Lanfear is very much herself. I do like that we find out it was her who first opened the seal to the Dark One's prison in the Age of Legends, and that apparently the Age of Legends lasted for hundreds of thousands of years (as opposed to the 3000 in this current age). Apparently in an attempt to find a new source of the one power that both males and females could use.

But yeah Mat is easily the most entertaining to read, Perrin is far too much duty. And really there are just way too many volumes where he's attempting to save Faile from the Shaido, that lasted too long and was too boring. It is a pity that book 11 (I think) only spans one day, I mean its an interesting read but it was not the best use of pages.

Also that book 12 ends with Mat entering the Tower of Ghenjeii (where apparently Moiraine is, and where the Aelfinn and the Eelfinn, those people who live in the twisted doorways, live.) I mean I want to see him save her goddamnit.

I was never interested in Moghedien, I'm much more interested in the two new ones that appear, who are hinted to be reincarnations of old forsaken, I believe the female one is Ishamael although I'm not certain, and the male one might be Lanfear, but again I remember that those two didn't fully fit.

Also what happens to that really tall Myrdraal.

Actually that one forsaken who attempts to relive the age of legends and uses people as pets, that's fascinating.

Also remember those two old Aes Sedai that Moiraine visists? I think one was called Vandene, they were close sisters. They appear in the second book I think, later on one of them turns out to be Black Ajah. Fairly cool that they play a small role in the second book and such large roles later on.

Right now I've been trying to remember the name of that older women Mat has a relationship with who is a regent of some coastal nation. But I just can't place my finger on which one it is, and I can't seem to find it on the map. :(

T-6005
09-04-2009, 03:43 PM
But yeah Mat is easily the most entertaining to read, Perrin is far too much duty. And really there are just way too many volumes where he's attempting to save Faile from the Shaido, that lasted too long and was too boring. It is a pity that book 11 (I think) only spans one day, I mean its an interesting read but it was not the best use of pages.

I'll agree that that plot arc lasted way, way too long. And I couldn't care less about what happens to Galina. The whole POV with her was sort of annoying.


Also that book 12 ends with Mat entering the Tower of Ghenjeii (where apparently Moiraine is, and where the Aelfinn and the Eelfinn, those people who live in the twisted doorways, live.) I mean I want to see him save her goddamnit.

I like the friendship between Mat and Brigitte, and how the Tower of Ghenjei is mentioned in the first book by Bayle Domon, and then again in the World of Dreams by Brigitte. I hope Moiraine's rescue doesn't take too long - she hasn't been truly relevant since her death, and since all of the other characters are so much more powerful than she ever was now, I'm not sure it's such a great idea bringing her back.


I was never interested in Moghedien, I'm much more interested in the two new ones that appear, who are hinted to be reincarnations of old forsaken, I believe the female one is Ishamael although I'm not certain, and the male one might be Lanfear, but again I remember that those two didn't fully fit.

I liked Moghedien because she was really meticulous and devious and tries to essentially stay behind the scene, but her actions get more and more erratic as she sees her plans failing. I think the biggest draw for Moghedien was back when no one knew where she was, and everyone was wondering. It's kind of what they've done with Mesaana, though we know she's in the White Tower now. Pretty sure Demandred's the only one we know nothing about.

Also, I'm pretty sure O'sangar (the male one) is Aginor reincarnated, since he mentions creating the Trollocs right before he is killed. And if that's who he is, then Ar'angar is Balthamel (we also see that Ar'angar is sex-obsessed, and Aginor mentions Balthamel remembering "pleasures of the flesh" or some such when they're fighting at the Eye of the World) and Ishamael is probably reborn as Moridin.


Also remember those two old Aes Sedai that Moiraine visists? I think one was called Vandene, they were close sisters. They appear in the second book I think, later on one of them turns out to be Black Ajah. Fairly cool that they play a small role in the second book and such large roles later on.

Right now I've been trying to remember the name of that older women Mat has a relationship with who is a regent of some coastal nation. But I just can't place my finger on which one it is, and I can't seem to find it on the map. :(
I thought one of the old sisters was killed? And then one of the three remaining Aes Sedai is a Darkfriend.

And the queen is Queen Tylin in Ebou Dar. I think the gholam rips her head off right after Mat leaves.

While we're at it - is Verin Black Ajah? It sure as hell seems like it sometimes.

wheelchairman
09-05-2009, 08:51 AM
Mat and Birgitte are a great couple, kind of almost want to see them end up getting together, especially since (forgot the name of her partner) is a baby now and she was ripped out of the pattern.

It's not that I think she'll play a great role, I just think it'd be great to have her alive again, that and it's always fun to read Mat playing the hero because he hates it so much.

Ah yes Moridin. I think you are right. For some reason I had thought that O'sangaar had to formerly have been a female. Its been too long since I read these books so all the later volumes are kinda hazy in detail. I did remember that they really couldn't be Ishamael or Lanfear because its almost stated explicity at some point, I just couldn't remember the reason.

Does Queen Tylin die? I'm not entirely certain she does. The gholam though is some crazy stuff.

T-6005
09-05-2009, 09:58 AM
It's definitely cool to have Mat and Brigitte in scenes together. My favorite scene with them was when they went out drinking, and then again when they're speaking in the old tongue.

Speaking of people being mentioned again, is Noam (the old dude who falls in with Mat and the Redarms in Ebou Dar) related to Jain Farstrider? Or perhaps even is him? I think he mentions it at one point, and I thought it was a totally cool way to bring everything back together.

T-6005
09-06-2009, 04:07 PM
Also, at the beginning of the The Great Hunt, Mat's kind of a jackass. I mean, even knowing it's a reaction to Rand's comments, it's going a little strong. There's sneering, so you know it's bad.

T-6005
10-08-2009, 12:56 AM
So, several things which have reminded me why exactly I love this series recently - I'm halfway through Lord of Chaos (Book 6).

First of all, I'd completely forgotten that Galad was Rand's half-brother. Tigraine and Taringail had a son, Galad, but then Tigraine became Shaiel and had Rand, while Taringail married Morgase and had Elayne and Gawyn. So Galad is half-sibling to Rand, Gawyn and Elayne while Rand can still be all ga-ga over Elayne because they aren't truly related (his father was Janduin). Not to mention that Tigraine's brother Luc went to the Blight and seemingly merged with Isam, Lan's nephew, to become Perrin's enemy Slayer. Pretty badass. Also, am I crazy or did Thom have Taringail killed - Morgase's POV says he died in a "hunting accident?"

Second, Alliandre (Queen of Ghealdan) and her note to Rand. He's all caught up in Carhien and Andor, Tear and the "Aiel nation," but it's nice to be reminded that the rest of the world exists, and Alliandre is the first one to openly swear to him. She's had brushes and meeting with Masema but sends him a direct note. I know she eventually joins Perrin and Faile's party but I really hope she survives to be the first ruler to keep her promise (technically Illian's Council of Nine gave the country to Rand once he killed Sammael, but Alliandre's promise predates that).

And lastly - Mat is finally awesome. He's on his way down to the border with Illian, which I'm pretty sure means he's going to head to Ebou Dar soon, which is probably my favorite episode of the entire Wheel of Time aside from debateably Perrin's "Two Rivers Campaign" and Mat's whole Carhien expedition, from strategizing in the battle to killing Couladin.

EDIT - Holy crap, how did I not notice this before. I mean, we know Mazrim Taim is a darkfriend since he used the phrase "Let the Lord of Chaos Rule," but I never put that together with him holding off the madness for 15 years until just now.

Also, up until Moridin shows up I always had an impression of Demandred as a giant badass. He could do things no other Forsaken could do, like block closing gateways, and he's the only one we still don't know the identity of, and Lews Therin has a pretty strong hankering after him and Ishamael when he first appears in Rand's head. But in books 10 and 11, if I recall, they mildly neuter him.

Paint_It_Black
10-08-2009, 01:09 AM
Quick question. How do you get motivated to start reading the whole fucking series again? Seriously. I want to but I can't seem to do it.

T-6005
10-08-2009, 01:12 AM
Quick question. How do you get motivated to start reading the whole fucking series again? Seriously. I want to but I can't seem to do it.

Oh, it's totally easy. Start halfway through book 2, read to the end and then skip to halfway through book 3. The Shadow Rising is the first fully grippable book. I've read literally the entire way through and most of the first 3 books is predictable fantasy (Dai Shan, Diademed Battle Lord of the Malkieri... seriously?).

Also, the first of the 3 (hopefully) last books comes out late this month. Maybe by the time you're done it'll be in paperback.

Paint_It_Black
10-08-2009, 01:17 AM
This month? Sweet. Well that's some motivation right there.

So skipping book one is ok in your opinion? Because I think a lot of my dismay comes from the prospect of reading that one again. I almost couldn't get beyond it the first time.

T-6005
10-08-2009, 01:20 AM
This month? Sweet. Well that's some motivation right there.

So skipping book one is ok in your opinion? Because I think a lot of my dismay comes from the prospect of reading that one again. I almost couldn't get beyond it the first time.

Yeah, one of my favorite aspects of the Wheel of Time is that they lose a lot of the mysticism that plagues most Fantasy novels in books three and four. And especially if you've read them before they really aren't that important since you know who Rand is and what Perrin can do and about Mat's dagger and the Horn of Valere.

To be honest, the first time I ever read the Wheel of Time I started with the Dragon Reborn. If I'd started with either The Great Hunt or The Eye of the World I might never have picked up the next one.

wheelchairman
10-08-2009, 09:25 AM
Well as mentioned in the beginning of this thread, even in book 1 Jordan references or hints at things that become big deals later on. So that's kinda neat. But yeah you gotta trudge through it. Especially book one as I've also read it the most I guess. Or remember it the most.

I think it is worth it to read the entire series over again though.

Also I finished book 4 but haven't started book 5 yet. :(

Book 4 was great though. And I realized that thing about Galad and Rand halfway through book 4. :p

wheelchairman
10-27-2009, 08:32 PM
Just finished book 5, it was pretty good. It sets up a lot of my favorite plot twists, Moiraine dying (which we can finally read about now in the new book), the Aes Sedai from the White Tower coming to Rand (I love the end of Book 6, so gripping!), etc. I can't wait to go on.

I have The Gathering Storm though, got it a week ago in the mail. My parents ordered it as a birthday gift, I was rather surprised that it arrived because as far as I knew it wasn't out yet.

I read Brandon Sanderson's foreward, and was encouraged when he said that we should imagine it more as a sequel with a new director, he tried to stay true to the characters etc.

Flipping through it though, you could see that it was differently formatted than the Jordan books. I don't think I will be disappointed though.

T-6005
10-27-2009, 08:38 PM
I'm halfway through Book 9. I think it might be one of my favorites because the female characters are finally toned down. Egwene in particular is insufferable until she becomes Amyrlin. And of course there's the whole Mat in Ebou Dar storyline still going.

I have a coupon for 25% off the book though, which is nice. I don't know if it's out yet but I know I'm still going to finish Crossroads of Twilight and Knife of Dreams before I start it.

wheelchairman
10-27-2009, 10:44 PM
Well check to see how long the coupon is valid of course.

Yeah Egwene is getting particularly annoying in book 5, but you know it will be tempered when the Wise Ones find out all the stuff she's done. I would imagine understanding ji'e'toh is the major point of growth for her, which I guess is why she had to be annoying in the first place.*

Nynaeve I don't think I ever really appreciated as much as I do know after this reading. She's flat out the most hypocritical (but perhaps human) character in the story, these most fun to read, the most stubborn, the most loyal, person. I love it.

I also like how book 6 starts out with Demandred's point of view.

I am not looking forward to book 10 or 11, whichever one happens within the span of a day. Omg.

*notice how I put ji'e'toh in itallics?

T-6005
10-27-2009, 11:13 PM
I might have done the same. Some words you just feel need to be in italics because he wrote them like that - like ashandarei.

Personally, I find Demandred criminally underused for several reasons. Apparently Sammael doesn't hate Lews Therin nearly as much as Demandred. Second, Asmodean mentions that Demandred was the only person he'd ever known who could block a closing gateway - somehow the fact that he's the one to say it is cool. Then in book 9 Moridin mentions that Osan'gar and Demandred were supposed to keep an eye on Rand - we know that Osan'gar was Corlan Dashiva, but who's Demandred? He's still got his secret identity going, whereas almost everyone else's has been compromised to some extent.

Ishamael became Moridin.
Moghedien and Cyndane, who is Lanfear I think, are Moridin's pets, essentially.
Asmodean is dead.
Be'lal is dead.
Rahvin is dead.
Sammael is dead.
Balthamel/Aran'gar is Halima, Egwene's friend.
Aginor/Osan'gar was killed at the cleansing of saidin.
Graendal is in Arad Doman somewhere as Lady Basene, I think.
Semirhage was Tuon's True Voice of the Blood, but Rand captured her.
Mesaana is in the White Tower - I actually wonder who Mesaana is. From what we've seen it's possible to hide your ability to channel, but is it actually possible to have weaves that make it seem like you channel less? Because if it isn't, then Mesaana can't be one of the sisters, since someone would have noticed how insanely strong she is, so she must be someone who can't channel in the Tower. Though it doesn't make much sense if she isn't someone who can channel since that mostly leaves servants.

Demandred remains the only one we know nothing about, and for the first few books I pretty much saw him as a badass from the few things you know about him - but now that Moridin's back and has that whole True Power business he's become rather less impressive.

wheelchairman
10-27-2009, 11:27 PM
If you haven't read this before, you should check it out.
http://library.tarvalon.net/index.php?title=The_Strike_at_Shayol_Ghul

A very short story for Robert Jordan about... well the title gives it away.

Rahvin to me was completely unsatisfying as a villain, similar to Sammael. You just don't hate them enough to really care yet, although its nice they are out of the way.

I actually really enjoyed it whenever Lanfear came along and then Lews Therin just seemed to be uncontrollable. I loved hearing about Mierin and I desperately want to know more.

And Asmodean has an unfortunate end, I would very much like to know who killed him. He actually was very interesting to see up close and personal, it would've been nice if he elaborated more on the age of legends, same with Moghedien in book six (haven't got far yet, but I assume we don't know much) and the same with Birgitte for that matter, although I recall she begins to lose her earlier memories.

Asmodean actually was really good because you could tell he just didn't care about people in a Patrick Bateman sort of way. Just himself. I could've used more Asmodean.

Also I do believe its hinted at, at some point, that one of the forsaken is a servant in the one tower, perhaps from Alviarin's point of view. Its entirely possible since Moghedien apparently was a very succesful servant while spying on Liandrin. Should she get punished she would just use a bit of compulsion, etc.

I look forward to book 6, I hope Nynaeve cures Siuan & co in this book, I love that. Book 6 and 8 have some of the better cliffhangers, along with book 11. That may be why 9 has such a strong start.

Except I don't think book 6 ends in a cliffhanger, its just interesting.

T-6005
11-04-2009, 01:42 AM
Still haven't picked up the newest book since I haven't started Knife of Dreams, but I thought this was significant, somehow.

Siuan is Egwene's (and our) most significant source of information concerning the hidden history of the White Tower, and the things that are Sealed to the Flame and so limited only to the Keeper and the Amyrlin. When Alviarin (Black Ajah) comes back to the White Tower from Tremalking after the cleansing of saidin (when all the Sea Folk Islanders, I forget what they're called, are dying) she mentions that she's coming out of the Ninth Repository of the Library, of which there are twelve official ones and one unofficial, the Thirteenth Repository. She also mentions that the three sisters she meets in the Library are from the Sea Folk, and are Brown Ajah and directly in charge of the Thirteenth Repository. I wonder, does that mean that the Sea Folk are directly aware of the White Tower's secret histories? That would make them the second official source aside from Siuan and Leane - although it seems unlikely that even Brown sister would be allowed to know the secret histories if they are supposed to be secret, otherwise the Brown Ajah as a whole would absolutely know of them.

wheelchairman
11-09-2009, 04:59 PM
Heh I wouldn't know. I just finished book 6 and picked up on what you are talking about with Luc earlier. Although I don't know if he's merged with Isam, I suppose that hasn't been hinted to much as of yet.

Again I love the end of book 6. Working with Lews Therin to get out of that box, I used to find Lews Therin annoying but he's getting more and more entertaining. I'm also a sucker for Rand around women though, so Min entering is fun. Although here starts the Perrin/Faile quarrel, which seemingly lasted forever, I consider it the start of her being kidnapped, a plot that I've mentioned was dragged on for too many books.

I'm looking forward to book 7, Nynaeve breaking her block and finding Lan, Rand killing Sammael and taking Illian. More looking forward to book 8 the cleansing of Saidin, and book 9 is where I feel I get to the books that I don't know so well.

T-6005
11-12-2009, 07:28 PM
I just finished the new book, and I'm actually quite impressed with Brandon Sanderson. If you're reading this Per, know that there are no spoilers below except for one tiny one that is mentioned in advance. It's pretty much safe.

It's not that his writing is particularly great or that he mimics Robert Jordan exactly or anything like that. It's just that at the beginning of this thread we were talking about whether the extension from one book into three was deliberate and meant to stretch out the series artificially.

After reading this book and getting a feel for how Sanderson was going to handle the Wheel of Time, I actually believe that the length isn't exaggerated - Sanderson works diligently to bring important plot points into a satisfying resolution and actually manages to take the sprawling, complex almost-mess Jordan left and bring the story back to a point where you see it as manageable. At the same time he does his best to answer niggling questions that have plagued fans since pretty much the second book, and personally I really appreciate it.

Even in such a long book he couldn't give enough time to each character to suit me - and, as usual, Rand gets far too much attention - but I like the way he's changed the narrative. Instead of long, multiple-chapter sequences focusing on a single character he keeps the action moving, never allowing the action to get too bogged down on a single character.

Hardly a spoiler at all, but I'll warn your just in case since I was talking about Demandred earlier - POSSIBLE TINY INSIGNIFICANT SPOILER - At the beginning of the book in the prologue my favorite Forsaken, Demandred, finally gets his due in a small way. Graendal is at a meeting with Moridin, Mesaana and Demandred after the events at the end of Knife of Dreams (namely us finding out who Anath really is) and Graendal is totally pissed at not knowing who Demandred is masquerading as. She actually says that she would trade all of her information on Semirhage, Moridin, Mogedien and Mesaana for even a hint of where he was. She also says that if it weren't for Lews Therin, Demandred very likely would have been the Dragon himself. This is the spoiler part, by the way - when Moridin asks him if he'll be ready, Demandred says "My rule is secure, we gather for war. We will be ready." So I'm trying to figure out who he is. I'm assuming he must be under the people who work for Rand, since he was supposed to "Keep an eye on him" in earlier books. With Robert Jordan flat out denying that Mazrim Taim is Demandred - which would have been my number one guess - we're left with either his existence as a male channeler who is near in power to Rand or one who can't channel. Since Logain is the only one who is near in power that we know of, he seems the most likely suspect, and he does have Min's viewing of glory and power to come, perhaps above all men, but it seems unlikely that he could really have worked so hard for Rand if he was really Demandred. Not to mention that Logain was the one to actually capture Semirhage at the end of Knife of dreams.

Continuing on from that - I just needed another paragraph.

Failing him being Logain, Demandred can't be an Asha'man. When he says his rule is secure, it leads me to assume that he must be one either one of the Stewards for the Dragon Reborn in Carhien, Tear or Illian (though two of those previously had a Forsaken in power, Be'lal in Tear and Sammael in Illian). Which leaves Demandred actually being the Steward in Carhien, Dobraine Taborwin. Although I hardly think Dobraine would have allowed himself to almost die - he was stabbed pretty badly and needed Healing. Same goes for Darlin - he fought Mat at one point without using the Power during the Aiel attack on the Stone, so it seems likely he isn't Demandred. I think it's unlikely he could be a Borderland ruler, as well, since they've all run down south to see Rand and their rules are all far from secure at this point.

So here's my guess - Demandred is King Roedran of Murandy. We don't hear much of him until he hires Talmanes and the Band, and apparently uses that well enough to semi-unify Murandy. Also, Talmanes mentions in Knife of Dreams that King Roedran has two copies of the general's book that Mat is always quoting (Fog and Steel by Comadrin I think.).

wheelchairman
11-21-2009, 12:41 PM
I've decided to skip your spoiler section because well it'll be funner to read it when I know what you're talking about. :p

I just finished book 7 and I think its underappreciated. Rand doesn't seem nearly as moody as I remember which I suppose comes later on. Although it isn't great either, it's still not bad. I always loved that fog scene with the rebels, and then when Flinn heals Rand and that one Aes Sedai (Sumeko?) practically leaps all over him for more info on healing.

I also love how the viewpoints change a lot more often. So even in the scenes where Rand is the focus we get them from Min's point of view, which is much less trying than Rand's brooding.

It's also has a start to a great story line and a horrible story line. I don't want to complain about the Perrin/Faile thing again, but yeah they've just started heading towards Ghealdan. However Mat in Ebou Dar with Tylin is just fantastic to read. I love it. And I'm very much looking forward to that whole thing on the farm with the bowl of winds.

The end though Rand meets a man in Shadar Logoth who can channel but cannot be sensed, so either he's using the "true power" as the Forsaken call it, or perhaps he was using Saidar and Rand just didn't pick up on the goosebumps (seems unlikely though.)

And I think you are right about Moridin being Ishamael. The beginning of book 8 has a few pages from his viewpoint where it seems knowledge and the quest for it is his motivation, which is in line with Ishamael the philosopher of the previous age.

I also found it interesting that Min viewed Moiraine as being crucial to winning the last battle. Of course none of the readers at this point when the book came out knew about the tower of ghenjeii.

Anyways I'm glad you liked the new book, I look forward to reading it. A guy I talked to let slip that the story line of Mat going after Moiraine goes nowhere in this book, which is a huge disappointment for me. Oh well. Also a little bummed that there is no Mat in book 8. I already know this but still that sucks.

I've pretty much stopped watching movies at this point in the series, I find it too captivating. Any other things you want to add on Sanderson's writing style? I've been reading his reviews of the books as I read them and while they aren't meant to be insightful, I do find them that way nonetheless.

Also I think you'll enjoy this:
Wheel of Time lolcats:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php#/group.php?v=photos&gid=230802300561

T-6005
11-21-2009, 01:29 PM
Haha, the Wheel of Time lolcats are awesome. I especially like the Asmodean one. "You? No!"

wheelchairman
12-27-2009, 07:42 AM
Almost finished with book 10. We get a brief description of Mesaana sans disguise, and Alviarin remembers her face as vaguely familiar, I would imagine that this is because Mesaana uses the one power to add the ageless quality to her face.

I noticed that too about the Brown sisters guarding the 13th repository, although with Aes Sedai it would be rather easy to make them keep secrets, a simple promise for example.

Book 10 is not nearly as bad as I remember, I think it was likely a disappointment because we had to wait for it so long. It is actually quite nice to get a peripheral view of the events. The only parts that seem to drag are the Perrin/Faile/Shaido bits and the siege of Caemlyn bits. Of course those parts go on for at least a hundred pages, but once you are done its a bit better.

I also like how in book 10 earlier on we see Alviarin's return from the point of Elaida's view, and then later on from the point of Alviarin.

The viewpoints of people from the Black Ajah/darkfriends and the forsaken still remain the more interesting narratives to read from.

I am really looking forward to the resolution of the situation with Egwene and Halima/Osan'gar.

I'm toying with the idea from what I've read with interviews that WoT takes place in a previous history of our world, and I'm hoping that the resolution won't involve Rand destroying the one power and thus somehow destroying the Dark One, that'd be lame and too predictable. Besides the Matrix sort of did that already.

Now to finish book 10 and actually get the story moving. I'm looking forward to reading the prequel book as I've been paying more attention to who knew who 20 years ago, etc. So that should be more interesting this time around. :)

It's gotten to a point where I'm having a difficult time remembering who did what recently, that was important. The difficulty lies in that there is so much, and the index at the book is useless whenever I need it.

You were right about Vandene/Adeleas, and it looks obvious which person is the darkfriend of the suspected 3, unfortunately that's one I already forgot the name of. I think it was Merilille, but it was someone who had snuck into Caemlyn, although that might have more to do with her escape from the Sea Folk with the young apprentice.

Also I was wrong about the climax of book 8, it was actually the climax of book 9 that I was looking forward to. I've made that mistake before in previous re-readings, but its still disappointing.

Sidewinder
12-27-2009, 09:53 AM
Would anyone recommend getting into this series despite its questionable ending?

wheelchairman
12-27-2009, 07:53 PM
There hasn't been an ending yet... :)

And definitely, I find it the most re-readable series of books I've ever read. Definitely worth the investment of time. But you have to avoid spoilers.

Shit I've met so many people reading them on the tram, it's awesome.

Paint_It_Black
12-27-2009, 08:17 PM
Would anyone recommend getting into this series despite its questionable ending?

I recommended this series to people even when I thought it was never going to get an ending. It's that enjoyable.

T-6005
03-26-2010, 06:53 AM
So, Richard and Per. Just in case you're interested, I've gotten really into a new fantasy series. Not quite as much, obviously, but I hardly ever get sucked into series like this, so it's pretty significant.

I'm talking about the Malazan Book of the Fallen series. Essentially they're a set of books detailing the history of the Malazan Empire, and it's pretty awesome - I'm on the seventh book now, and though the first book was hard to get into until about 3/4 of the way (a la Eye of the World) you soon get used to the fact that it's Steven Erikson's style to bring disparate elements into some pretty epic confrontations at the end. The books are written in a pretty bleak style but I still absolutely recommend them for people who like the Wheel of Time. Which is you two.

wheelchairman
03-26-2010, 09:40 AM
Coincidentally I finished The Gathering Storm last night. I thought it was excellent. I only noticed the jarring differences in the first few chapters, the rest seemed to fit more or less seamlessly. I felt like he used the wrong words for different peoples narratives, but that was a small thing.

That thing with Verin was pretty cool.

Anyways I'll check out that book series you mentioned. Right now I want to finish some Michael Crichton books, then read the Mistborn trilogy, and then read A Game of Thrones. It comes highly endorsed from Richard.

T-6005
03-26-2010, 10:54 AM
A Games of Thrones and George RR Martin's books are pretty good. I don't know if I'd read them more than once, though.

Mistborn's pretty fantastic for the first two books, but I really disliked the ending of the third book - it felt like kind of a copout to me. Still, the first two are worth it.

Paint_It_Black
04-27-2010, 04:02 AM
A Games of Thrones and George RR Martin's books are pretty good. I don't know if I'd read them more than once, though.

I've read the Song of Ice and Fire series three times I think. I love it. Once I finish Wheel of Time I'm going back to read that again.

So, Wheel of Time. I finally got going. I'm getting towards the end of the second book now. I read at work whenever I have time and in doing so I have discovered two other employees reading the same series. I think they both said they had read the first two or three books when they first came out and only now got around to starting up again. And they both happen to be reading the second book at the moment, just like me. The Wheel weaves as the Wheel wills, I suppose.

Eye of the World was waaaay better than I remembered. It must help knowing what is to come and already liking the characters. I started to think I judged it too harshly the first time, but I'm fairly certain now I just liked it so much this time because I already am familiar with how it all progresses. It was actually really enjoyable revisiting all the characters when they had no power or knowledge of who or what they are and all that. I had expected it to be boring but that was not the case at all.

There were a few surprises. I had not remembered that Mat started speaking in the Old Tongue in book one. Things like that. Great foreshadowing that would be nearly impossible to notice until you read the whole thing a second time. And events which had originally seemed to be fairly questionable deus ex machina the first time now were clearly unconcious manifestations of the Power. Moiraine commented on Bela not needing Healing, but the explosion when Rand and Mat were trapped in the inn with the barred windows was a much more obvious example and never actually stated in the book. But it was obvious to me this time, of course.

I should have written this much sooner because I've already forgotten most of what I wanted to comment on from book one.

Oh, I really like Nynaeve this time. She annoyed me quite a bit originally. Not sure why I feel differently now. Her romantic involvement still feels like it comes out of nowhere, but I'm ok with it. Nynaeve and Lan are both private people who try to avoid showing what they are feeling, except anger in Nynaeve's case of course. And we never had much narrative written from their perspective in which we could have gotten hints, but having said that everything from Nynaeve's perspective did involve trying to impress/compete with Lan. So anyway, I quite liked how suddenly there's this romantic angle but it's not that sudden when you really think about it.

Mins viewings are much more enjoyable when you have the benefit of knowing what they mean.

Apparently I had completely forgotten that Rand looks like an Aielman. Odd.

Moving on to book two. I did not remember the Seanchan showing up so quickly. They might have even been alluded to in book one, I've already forgotten again. I still find the Seanchan less interesting than most other subplots, but again better than I remembered. I thought Domon meeting Egeanin came much later. Huh.

Thom is back already? I could have sworn that was dragged out longer. Not a complaint though. I love Thom.

Mat is more annoying than I remember. I did remember that Mat doesn't become awesome until much later in the series, but I didn't remember him being so annoying at first. But I suppose it makes sense. He was the least mature of the three to begin with, and then Perrin and Rand matured quickly with the manifestation of their respective gifts. And all Mat has got so far is basically a horrible disease.

Right now Rand is the most enjoyable character. I remember that shifts to Perrin and then finally Mat. I'll be interested to see if I feel the same way this time and exactly where the shifts take place.

I'm enjoying the series as much this time as I did the first time. I've forgotten so much, but what I do remember heightens the enjoyment.

Enough rambling for now. I'm not even going to bother checking for errors so please forgive any spelling mistakes.

Paint_It_Black
07-18-2010, 10:30 AM
Who the fuck did kill Asmodean? Jordan apparently claimed there were enough clues to figure it out in the very book in which it happened. Fuck him, I'm glad he died. Has to be one of the Chosen, right? Who else could have basically just paralyzed him with fear? Or Shadar Haran, but he was not introduced yet and so Jordan's assertion regarding clues would not hold up. I like the theory that it was one (or both) of the two servants in the hallway when Rand is going after Rahvin. That holds up pretty well. A Forsaken using Illusion. But I'm not quite so convinced any of them would have the balls to get that close to the action. What with balefire flying around. And if there was another Forsaken there why not just blast Rand in the back? The Great Lord had not ordered Rand to be left alone at this point. But ok, it still seems like it must be a Forsaken who killed Asmodean. But if they used the Power, someone should have sensed it being used, shouldn't they? Rand and Aviendha were both very close. If the Power wasn't used, why was he not able to put up any apparent resistance? I suppose the True Source could have been used, or whatever the Dark One's power is called. Most Forsaken seem to dislike using that though. And Moridin had not been introduced yet. Who the fuck did it?

I'm 200 pages into Lord of Chaos now. Amusingly I've bought this book at least three times now. The reasons are boring so just make something up if you want to know.

Book three was as much of an improvement over book 2 as book 2 was over book 1. If I remember correctly now. Good stuff. Everyone heading to Tear and all that. Rand really starting to become the Dragon Reborn.

Book 4 is simply awesome. I can't say if it's one of the best because I don't remember the others well enough, and by the time I read the others again I will have forgotten why I loved book 4 so much. But I'm going to say it almost has to be one of the best. The Aiel backstory. The Two Rivers battle. The beginning of Matt becoming awesome. The breaking of the White Tower. Asmodean. Excellent.

Book 5. Matt. Battles. Awesomeness. The entire last three chapters or so of pure distilled awesomeness. The ending possibly equals or surpasses even the best bits of book 4. Maybe. But overall, not as great as book 4. First time in the series that a book is not clearly better than the one before it. But it's just because book 4 was so damn good and not a criticism of book 5.

I prefer referring to the books by numbers instead of names. The names kinda suck.

So I noticed something. The writing style of the books seems to increase in maturity with each subsequent book, as well as the content. I have complained at times that the early books were too childish. I thought perhaps Jordan just hadn't really decided at first what he wanted his style to be. But I get it now. The style of writing, every aspect of the narrative, matures as the characters mature. Book one is childish because the protagonists are barely more than children. The literary style grows with them. This isn't something to criticize at all. This is genius. This isn't a failure to plan ahead. This is the ultimate example of masterfully planning ahead. I am awed.

So glad I'm reading them all again.

I'm also following along the chapter summaries here (http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/books/index.html) in order to catch loads of things I might otherwise miss. Every few chapters I consult the guide. A guy at work who started reading them at exactly the same time as me is now an entire book ahead of me. He speculated my obsessive guide-reading might be to blame. I told him I just have more sex. But it's probably actually the guide. Totally worth it.

T-6005
07-19-2010, 01:05 AM
I'll only say it once more. I only recommend three decent fantasy series to anyone.

1. Robert Jordan's The Wheel of Time
2. Steven Erikson's Malazan Book of the Fallen
3. George RR Martin's Song of Fire And Ice.

I recommend the third with reservations. Once you've read the second series you'll understand why it's almost right up there with Wheel of Time. Seriously. First book's alright, second book's, good... give it until the third book and you'll be done.

wheelchairman
07-19-2010, 06:25 AM
Book 4 is simply awesome. I can't say if it's one of the best because I don't remember the others well enough, and by the time I read the others again I will have forgotten why I loved book 4 so much. But I'm going to say it almost has to be one of the best. The Aiel backstory. The Two Rivers battle. The beginning of Matt becoming awesome. The breaking of the White Tower. Asmodean. Excellent.



Book 4 is also the book where Robert Jordan's sense of humor becomes more noticable and present. This might be because nothing much happens for the first few hundred pages in book 4, so the humor helps the reader ignore that. :p


So I noticed something. The writing style of the books seems to increase in maturity with each subsequent book, as well as the content. I have complained at times that the early books were too childish. I thought perhaps Jordan just hadn't really decided at first what he wanted his style to be. But I get it now. The style of writing, every aspect of the narrative, matures as the characters mature. Book one is childish because the protagonists are barely more than children. The literary style grows with them. This isn't something to criticize at all. This is genius. This isn't a failure to plan ahead. This is the ultimate example of masterfully planning ahead. I am awed.
Definitely noticed this as well in my most recent read-through. It is rather impressive. The narrative style of any character (and all the characters have well-rounded backgrounds) changes with the character, their traumas have lasting effects, etc.

I'm also following along the chapter summaries here (http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/books/index.html) in order to catch loads of things I might otherwise miss. Every few chapters I consult the guide. A guy at work who started reading them at exactly the same time as me is now an entire book ahead of me. He speculated my obsessive guide-reading might be to blame. I told him I just have more sex. But it's probably actually the guide. Totally worth it.
I'm a total glutton for that kind of thing. The Mistborn books all have chapter annotations online, that was half the fun of reading those books (the annotations.) I'd definitely read the chapter guides for WoT, however I am not planning on re-reading the series again for a few years.

I'm planning on starting Elantris soon, after I finish A Clash of Kings.

Maartje's gotten into fantasy as well. She just started A Game of Thrones. (She finished the Mistborn books and went into A Song of Fire and Ice.)

I believe that the next Wheel of Time book is due out in October.

Paint_It_Black
07-20-2010, 02:31 AM
Ice and Fire. Just to be nit-picky.

How are you liking it? You must be liking it well enough since you're still going, and even got Tizz reading them. After I strongly encouraged you to read them I got nervous because I realized I hadn't read them in quite a while. Maybe they aren't as good as I remember. It would be mildly embarrassing to push something so strongly and then realize I completely overrated it. I definitely need to read them again as soon as I'm done with WoT. Then I might even try whatever that series is that Mr. T is recommending. Anything that gets placed between WoT and Ice and Fire deserves consideration.


This might be because nothing much happens for the first few hundred pages in book 4, so the humor helps the reader ignore that. :p

Yes, I might have giggled a few times. Yeah, giggled. I'd like to say I chuckle in a manly fashion, but when reading I have a tendency to giggle excessively at moderately amusing things. Anyway. Can't say I've really noticed a lot of humor in his writing, and most of what is there is a bit too...obvious maybe? But then when I want humor I just read Pratchett so it's all good. Although, I did enjoy the bit in book 6 where Davram Bashere comments on the difficulty of giving decent burials to trees. Seemed Pratchettesque.

So, no one has any solid ideas on who killed Asmodean then?

I just commented on a typo on Brandon Sanderson's facebook and asked for a job as an editor. Fingers crossed.

T-6005
11-02-2010, 07:09 PM
First of all, Richard, it's fairly certain that it was either Graendal or Slayer who killed Asmodean. Almost certainly the former.

Secondly, Towers of Midnight came out today. I have yet to pick it up since I am extremely poor right now, but as soon as I get some cash flow I'm buying it and reading the shit out of it. This is apparently the book that deals with Mat's journey to the Tower of Ghenjei.

Since it focuses on Mat, I also wouldn't mind some more Tuon. I came to appreciate her a lot and then she left.

wheelchairman
11-03-2010, 09:29 AM
The book arrived in the mail today. That was pretty awesome.

T-6005
11-03-2010, 05:48 PM
Sweet. Don't be ruining shit for me.

Paint_It_Black
06-05-2013, 06:59 PM
So, you guys finished the series yet? My copy of the final book should be arriving any day now. I dislike reading hardback but I've just devoured The Gathering Storm and Towers of Midnight and can't wait for paperback.

After re-reading the first 11 books I was starting to feel a little burned out on the series but as soon as I started The Gathering Storm I felt my enthusiasm surge again. Not sure if it's due to the quality of the writing or just finally getting to read something I hadn't read before. Or perhaps both. So far I have to say Sanderson is doing a fine job. I can only think of one section that felt jarring to me, one section that didn't feel like WoT at all. Some of the characters feel a little different, but not to the point of distraction. The humor present in Mat's chapters, for example, is much more direct now.

I really like a lot of the little details Sanderson throws in. References to things from past books that often haven't been mentioned for a very long time. Fans remember little details and when they are mentioned again you feel like you are being rewarded for remembering. I'm assuming that Sanderson, as a fan himself, gets this. Sometimes I feel like I'm reading professional grade fanfic, and then I realize that is exactly what is actually happening. And somehow it's not a bad thing at all.

I wish Sanderson would continue to write stories set in the WoT world. I would be fine with entirely new characters. I just really like the world, the places and the people. I like that I can immediately tell that a character is from Illian, so I do. I like that Tairens won't shut up about fish. I like that people from Cairhien see intrigue in everything. I like that Shienarans have topknots, people from Arrafel have bells in their hair, Saldaens have funny noses and Ebou Dari will stab you. I've taken all this in in a way I've never experienced with any other franchise and I don't want it to stop. I read that Jordan's people do not want his world to go open source, but really, why not? It could be a lasting, living, monument to the man. The world would have been a poorer place if Star Trek had died with Rodenberry. And Lucas has set Star Wars free. Why does Jordan's magnificent world have to die with him? Yeah I'm comparing tv/film to books there, but still.

Paint_It_Black
08-09-2013, 04:58 PM
Done.

Anyone else? Anyone?

Feel weird now.

T-6005
08-11-2013, 07:20 AM
Finished a few months ago.

I don't know if I've outgrown the books, but for whatever reason these last three have felt rather unsatisfying. Sanderson's writing is alright - I enjoyed the Mistborn series, I suppose - but the books, especially the last book, were full-on plot point resolution and little else.

Tarmon Gai'don was really only made by how badass Mat and some of the Asha'man were - that part with Androl and the portals was so badass it was borderline absurd. Rand continued his trend of the last five books with me not particularly caring about him at all, and unfortunately in the last book Perrin joined him there.

I am glad I reached the end of it - I started the series with The Dragon Reborn in like 1998 or 99, so it's been a while waiting for the end. It's bittersweet, and I would have preferred Robert Jordan to finish it himself. But as an ending, it's alright. There was so much to resolve I don't know how much better it could have been done.

Paint_It_Black
08-11-2013, 08:17 AM
Tarmon Gai'don was really only made by how badass Mat and some of the Asha'man were - that part with Androl and the portals was so badass it was borderline absurd. Rand continued his trend of the last five books with me not particularly caring about him at all, and unfortunately in the last book Perrin joined him there.

I think I stopped caring about Rand after he sat on a mountain for five minutes and all his troubles went away. I know the story needed him to get back on track but it was a bit sudden for me. Also, I suppose I was happy for him that he was more like his old self again, but the dark Rand was so much more interesting. I stopped caring about Perrin a very long time ago, unfortunately. Then my indifference sadly turned to outright annoyance, almost entirely because of Fail. I did really end up liking how his powers developed though. But who cares? It's all about Mat and the fantastic cast of supporting characters. Androl was fucking amazing indeed. Ballsy move, giving so much screen time to a character we basically don't know at all. A gamble that really paid off there.

Ultimately, I could criticize a lot of things, really quite a terrible amount of things...but I choose not to. The burden placed on Sanderson when chosen to finish this series was immense. Maybe "burden" isn't right. But I'm thinking that death is lighter than a feather, while finishing someone else's epic fantasy series beloved my millions is probably heavier than a mountain. Or something. I just really think he did very, very well considering the enormity of the task.

The final book, however, was certainly the weakest. While I wanted full-on plot point resolution I didn't want it to feel like obligatory plot point resolution. When I had about 50 pages left of the book I started to get really nervous that some things were going to get rushed or just left out entirely and unfortunately that was the case. Also, somehow, Tarmon Gai'don itself didn't feel anywhere near as impressive as the cleansing of saidin. But maybe that's just me.

I definitely am coming away from this series with a very positive view of the whole thing. I've read most of the books twice and I really doubt I'll ever read any of them again now, but I don't regret any of the time I've devoted to them. Even though you basically know how it's all going to end from the very beginning.

I'm now throwing myself into some of the Horus Heresy novels and then I think I'll read A Dance With Dragons. I find myself desperately needing some grimdark after WoT gave me happy endings pretty much all around. I sort of wish more major characters had been killed off, but then again, I always knew they wouldn't be.

T-6005
08-11-2013, 09:27 AM
I'll tell you what I told Per. Read the Malazan Book of the Fallen series. The first book is... okay, but from the second onwards it is fantastic. I think it's my favorite fantasy series.