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florent
10-26-2004, 11:35 AM
oh boy, the board finally sort-of works again. I must be the first to notice this, huh? I wasn't an active member on the BBS either, so it's not like you guys missed me .

Eitherway, I'm doing this project, and I want to know the public opinion, I guessed I could get the most opinions using the internet.
Over here (the netherlands) there is a big debate about whether prisoners should be locked up alone or with two prisoners on one cell, and a lot of prisons experimented with it. It just happens with criminals who committed small crimes (no murderers and stuff) and on choice of the prisoner.
Now or project mainly concerns the psychological effects for the prisoners, nonetheless we would like an idea how people think about it.

So the question is:
Do you think there should be two prisoners in one jail cell?

wheelchairman
10-26-2004, 11:50 AM
Hard to say. I'd need to do much more research on conditions in prisons. And you do realize prisons vary vastly from country to country? I am sure the prisons of the Netherlands are very different from America's for example. Or Iraq's for that matter....

DeadPool
10-26-2004, 01:39 PM
you are lucky to live in a country that you can choose this man..
look for brazil's criminal system.. you dont know with you laugh or you cry when you realize that about 20 guys stay in the same small cell.. its madness..

if i could choose, i want to be with another one.. so, that is my vote.

TrendyAsshole
10-26-2004, 03:45 PM
just throw them in the hole, theres plenty of people in there

Jebus
10-26-2004, 04:37 PM
just throw them in the hole, theres plenty of people in there
hah, just like the jews.

SicN Twisted
10-26-2004, 11:47 PM
We wouldn't need to even worry about prison overcrowded if we'd legalize drugs. 1/3rd of prisoners are non violent drug offenders.

Kitten
10-27-2004, 09:24 AM
I say they should be in a cell with someone else. As long as both are non-violent offenders, and they are matched to get along well, it would decrease space problems in prisons and decrease anti-social behaviour regarding them having no one to really talk to when they might need it.
As for legalising drugs, you'd be asking for a shitfight there. Medicinal Maurijauna for terminal patients, I agree with, recreational use not for the sole purpose of relieving pain, no.
Then again, there should be better rehabilitation programs for drug users. Methadone (sp) is all well and good, but aren't they just trading one addiction for another?

florent
10-27-2004, 09:30 AM
Hard to say. I'd need to do much more research on conditions in prisons. And you do realize prisons vary vastly from country to country? I am sure the prisons of the Netherlands are very different from America's for example. Or Iraq's for that matter....

soz, shoudl've been more clear. I do not persť mean dutch prisoners, I'm wondering about the ethical side, about what people think about it.

The question could refer to any country with a decent prison (decent as in clean and now tortures).


thank you all for the input. I have nothing much to comment, since I don't have a clear stand on the subject. Most of you wrote some good, valid, arguments (except for the dude who wants to throw them in a hole).

franib
10-27-2004, 11:33 AM
basically I think prison should be made as unpleasant as possible an experience to teach the prisoners a lesson. There are arguments for both sides:

1) if a prisoner is in his/her own room, then it would hopefully cause loneliness.

2) However if a prisoner is stuck in a room with someone they really can't get on with then they would be unhappy.

From a tax payer's point of view, it's cheaper to put two guys in one room so this is a bonus cos the saved money can be used for something useful and beneficial to the rest of society.

But i don't think the prisoners should have any say in whether or not they have their own room or not.

wheelchairman
10-27-2004, 11:58 AM
You obviously know nothing then.

People don't do crime because they think prison is fantastic. As it is already in America, rape is not an uncommon thing among guys. Who would voluntarily put themselves into that?

No my friend, people commit crimes because they form a part of a class that has no opportunities. So they must resort to crime, every nation has a class like this. They unfortunately they are usually segregated by race, like blacks and latinos are expected to be more violent than white people.

In Europe we expect middle eastern immigrants to be more violence. However even before we had these immigrants we had the same kinds of crimes. So what needs to change is not the violent oppression of this class of people, but the alleviation of their material needs.

But fuck, heaven forbid we act logically.

NOAMR
10-27-2004, 12:01 PM
I think that's very egoistic. If they are alone, and u make them as unpleasant as possible, they will be frustraded. Do u really think they don't know it's wrong, and if they don't know, they would change their mind by sitting alone? They should get more self esteem, then they won't hate the society as mush neither. Maybe also some therapy's, so they can handle their agression.

Kitten
10-27-2004, 03:14 PM
You obviously know nothing then.

People don't do crime because they think prison is fantastic. As it is already in America, rape is not an uncommon thing among guys. Who would voluntarily put themselves into that?

No my friend, people commit crimes because they form a part of a class that has no opportunities. So they must resort to crime, every nation has a class like this. They unfortunately they are usually segregated by race, like blacks and latinos are expected to be more violent than white people.

In Europe we expect middle eastern immigrants to be more violence. However even before we had these immigrants we had the same kinds of crimes. So what needs to change is not the violent oppression of this class of people, but the alleviation of their material needs.

But fuck, heaven forbid we act logically.

Explain the people that can hold a full time and quite fulfilling job and go out and serially rape women or men then. Some of them are quite well to do.
No one class has a lack of oppurtunities, a lot of people come from backgrounds where it seems to be the case, but they moved above that and made their own oppurtunities. Saying that society makes them that way is a fucking copout. Can they not rise above the stereotypes and prove that they can do something other than crime?
As for people who sell drugs, they are looking to make a profit, of course they don't think the cops will sniff them out, yet when they get caught, they carry on about how society forces them into a mould. Boo hoo.
No one is born inferior, they make themselves that way because it is easier than trying to rise above things that stand in their way.

Kitten
10-27-2004, 03:16 PM
basically I think prison should be made as unpleasant as possible an experience to teach the prisoners a lesson. There are arguments for both sides:

1) if a prisoner is in his/her own room, then it would hopefully cause loneliness.

2) However if a prisoner is stuck in a room with someone they really can't get on with then they would be unhappy.

From a tax payer's point of view, it's cheaper to put two guys in one room so this is a bonus cos the saved money can be used for something useful and beneficial to the rest of society.

But i don't think the prisoners should have any say in whether or not they have their own room or not.

I agree to the point about taxes. But should we put a non-violent offender, perhaps a first timer in such an unpleasent place that they feel the need to turn to violent crime, because they did it in jail just to stay above water?
That would be creating a whole new set of problems.

Mota Boy
10-27-2004, 03:59 PM
I support it, but as long as you don't shake the cell to make them fight.

wheelchairman
10-27-2004, 10:22 PM
Explain the people that can hold a full time and quite fulfilling job and go out and serially rape women or men then. Some of them are quite well to do.
No one class has a lack of oppurtunities, a lot of people come from backgrounds where it seems to be the case, but they moved above that and made their own oppurtunities. Saying that society makes them that way is a fucking copout. Can they not rise above the stereotypes and prove that they can do something other than crime?
As for people who sell drugs, they are looking to make a profit, of course they don't think the cops will sniff them out, yet when they get caught, they carry on about how society forces them into a mould. Boo hoo.
No one is born inferior, they make themselves that way because it is easier than trying to rise above things that stand in their way.

Ignorance. This would be the typical testimonial of someone who's grown up in the upper middle class.

It's obvious that there is a particular class that is more prone to crime. Why on Earth do you think the majority of prisoners come from homes where the parents either have no jobs, or where they have to work several part time jobs?

Society does not allow for the majority of the lower class 'to rise above itself'. That is a stupid idea altogether in the first place. People are not poor, and unemployed because they are lazy. They are because there is no choice.

As for the rapest, I thought this was about non-violent crime? But yes I am not denying that some crime is perpetrated by higher classes. But the vast majority of crime is done by the broad disenfranchised class of people who can't work in this society. Why do you think there is more crime in the ghettoes than in Orange County?

honestly, don't be so naive.