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View Full Version : Judge orders 'don't ask, don't tell' injunction



Static_Martyr
10-12-2010, 01:50 PM
So U.S. District Judge Virginia Phillips issued a federal injunction to block the enforcement of "don't ask, don't tell" today. (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101012/ap_on_re_us/us_gays_in_military)

It's interesting to see this taken care of so plainly and simply, after the president (and pretty much anyone else with the authority to do anything about it) has basically avoided the issue since day one with only the occasional nod in its general direction. I, for one, am glad :D Equal rights FTW! I only wonder how long it'll be before uber-cons and rednecks the country over will be rushing to appeal this decision (can they even do that?).

I always thought that DADT was like saying that we shouldn't outlaw discrimination against blacks (or religious people) in the workplace because it might offend someone who hates blacks (or religious people).

WebDudette
10-12-2010, 01:55 PM
How long? I'm sure they already are.

I heard something from Clinton a few months ago, he said when he passed it the intention was that people could be gay in the army, even openly gay. But they couldn't go to a gay pride parade in uniform and stuff like that. the only reason they even created it was so that gays wouldn't be completely banned.

I don't even get what the whole thing is about, what are they afraid gays will do? I mean, something like 1/3rd of women in the military are raped and I'm pretty sure it's not gay guys doing that.

Anyway, this is great news. I hope it sticks. A lot of great advancements have been made lately.

Harleyquiiinn
10-12-2010, 01:58 PM
Separation of powers rulez :cool:

Retard
10-12-2010, 03:39 PM
So glad that this has been gotten rid of..... hooray for gays!

now theres more people who can go into the millitary and not me!!!

randman21
10-12-2010, 04:15 PM
It's interesting to see this taken care of so plainly and simply
Almost disarmingly so. It definitely doesn't seem like this whole thing is over just like that. But for now, I drink for teh gheyz. Another moment to be proud of. :)

mario_spaghettio
10-17-2010, 02:02 PM
Hopefully the gays are separated from the straight males just as males and females are separated for certain situations.

wheelchairman
10-17-2010, 02:04 PM
Seems to me that Don't Ask, Don't Tell was instated so that Republican senators couldn't be conscripted.

mario_spaghettio
10-17-2010, 03:08 PM
Seems to me that Don't Ask, Don't Tell was instated so that Republican senators couldn't be conscripted.I'm convinced that all outed gay republicans are actually just liberal democrats who infiltrated the Republican Party in attempt to sabotage it.

wheelchairman
10-17-2010, 09:08 PM
Had they been Brits I would've assumed they just went to the same boarding school. HA!

T-6005
10-17-2010, 09:32 PM
I have no fucking idea what the two of you are talking about.

Static_Martyr
10-18-2010, 01:43 PM
I have no fucking idea what the two of you are talking about.

Well, see, this comment:


Hopefully the gays are separated from the straight males just as males and females are separated for certain situations.

refers, of course, to the army and how the troops are organized --- males and females separately. Mario says he wants gay guys (and presumably, lesbians) to be in different barracks than straights. Mr. Wheelchairman then says:


Seems to me that Don't Ask, Don't Tell was instated so that Republican senators couldn't be conscripted.

Which implies that Republican senators are gay (they can't be drafted 'cause they're gay, see? :D).

Mario says something unremarkable about said gay congressman, then Mr. Wheelchairman replies:


Had they been Brits I would've assumed they just went to the same boarding school. HA!

Wherein boarding school = many young guys in close quarters = easy ground for gay jokes :)

[/don't explain the joke]

Static_Martyr
10-19-2010, 01:26 PM
Slight update: The Justice Department has appealed the ruling. (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101019/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_gays_in_military_recruiting)


Following last week's court ruling that struck down a 1993 law banning gays from serving openly, the military has suspended enforcement of the rule known as "don't ask, don't tell." The Justice Department is appealing the decision and has asked the courts for a temporary stay on the ruling.

The Defense Department said it would comply with the law and had frozen any discharge cases. But at least one case was reported of a man being turned away from an Army recruiting office in Austin, Texas.

That happened in Texas? Hm. Really? What a surprise :rolleyes:


Recruiters also have been told to inform potential recruits that the moratorium on enforcement of "don't ask, don't tell" could be reversed at any point, if the ruling is appealed or the court grants a stay, she said.

Gotta protect the "rights" of people who are ascairt of teh gays. Fair process and all....

T-6005
10-19-2010, 10:52 PM
I was kidding.

Also, in my view Don't Ask Don't Tell violate the entire point of the first amendment. The right to declare your religion without persecution, to speak without retribution, and to assemble in support of a cause without repression are clearly demarcated. At least two of those rights have - in the spirit of the law as well as the letter - a clear extension into the Don't Ask Don't Tell policy. Unless homosexuality were in clear violation of a state or federal law - and it's frightening how close some people seem to view it - it should have been viewed by laymen (if perhaps not so simply by lawmakers) as an umbrella case into the supposedly fundamental right to freedom of expression. Instead we've reached the opposite effect, where the law has been pulled into a state of paradox through complacency.

I'm shocked it took so long to come to this. Before the objections start - it's a simplistic take on the argument, but only because the argument itself should never have gone beyond the basic premise. In violating Don't Ask, Don't Tell, the soldier would only be exercising a first amendment right without - either in word or deed - intimating a connection with illicit acts.

Say someone comes out as a pedophile in the army under freedom of speech. That is a statement which implies an act of illegality. Clearly not alright. But homosexuality does not do that, which is an essential difference protected both under the United States Bill of Rights and the UN Charter of Human Rights.

Of course, there's too much literature on the hypermasculinity and homophobia tied into the military-industrial complex brought into the modern era by Harry Truman to simply overturn Don't Ask, Don't Tell with logic. In a word where point A led to point B, however, that should have been it.

Static_Martyr
10-20-2010, 06:02 PM
I was kidding.

Oh I know, I was just being a dick :D

samseby
10-21-2010, 01:05 PM
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2010/10/appeals-court-rules-dont-ask-dont-tell-should-remain-in-force/1

Well ...

Static_Martyr
10-21-2010, 02:10 PM
http://content.usatoday.com/communit...ain-in-force/1

Well ...

Well, that's definitely odd, but the reasoning seems fair. It's only temporary, at least until the appeals process is complete. Hopefully the appeal will falter and the ruling will be final, and then we can be done with this BS once and for all.

Llamas
10-25-2010, 03:57 PM
I heard something from Clinton a few months ago, he said when he passed it the intention was that people could be gay in the army, even openly gay. But they couldn't go to a gay pride parade in uniform and stuff like that. the only reason they even created it was so that gays wouldn't be completely banned.
I have a hard time believing that, since Clinton voted against gay marriage (well actually he signed the Defense of Marriage act into law). None of the US's presidents have actually been supportive of gays.


I don't even get what the whole thing is about, what are they afraid gays will do? I mean, something like 1/3rd of women in the military are raped and I'm pretty sure it's not gay guys doing that.

From what a gather, the arguments against it are either: 1) I'm religious and I can't ever support homosexuality!! 2) I'm a homophobic male who thinks that all gay men are attracted to me and wanna fuck me.

But I have heard one moderately decent argument. In the military, men and women are separated in attempt to eliminate romantic and sexual relationships; if gays are allowed, the separation is pointless. The problem with this argument, though, is that relationships happen regardless of separation, and DADT doesn't prevent gays from being in the military... they just have to keep it a secret. What I say to these people is, sorry relationships aren't so black and white that you can just separate people by gender. Figure something else out.

WebDudette
10-25-2010, 04:04 PM
People are always like 'well, you have to be able to trust your fellow soldiers!', so I feel like DADT is counterproductive because it literally forces people to lie.

Yeah, I was skeptical of the Clinton thing, it was just something he said a few months ago.

wheelchairman
10-25-2010, 04:06 PM
Well Bri, according to volume 2 of his autobiography, the Don't Ask, Don't Tell clause was a compromise, where he wanted full acceptance.

I never read volume 1, and of volume 2 I don't think I passed page 100. And whether or not you want to take a gifted politician/liar at his word, is up to you. It makes sense though.

I find it really hard to understand this issue. I also find the idea of people volunteering for military service really hard to understand.

Paint_It_Black
10-26-2010, 07:33 AM
something like 1/3rd of women in the military are raped

I think in reality most women in the military have been sexually assaulted in some way. Considering how much pressure is on them not to report it, or to allow it to be brushed aside after they do report it, any actual statistics on this have to be considered to be very conservative estimates.

I know this isn't what the thread is about, but I'm always surprised this issue doesn't get more attention.

WebDudette
10-26-2010, 04:21 PM
It pisses me off every time I think about it, and I'm sure you're right.

mario_spaghettio
10-27-2010, 11:54 PM
I think in reality most women in the military have been sexually assaulted in some way. Considering how much pressure is on them not to report it, or to allow it to be brushed aside after they do report it, any actual statistics on this have to be considered to be very conservative estimates.

I know this isn't what the thread is about, but I'm always surprised this issue doesn't get more attention.I think every single woman that was ever in the military was raped at least twice a day.

coke_a_holic
10-29-2010, 01:34 AM
The rapings will continue until morale improves!