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View Full Version : Rap doesn't age well



bighead384
12-19-2012, 07:51 PM
It seems to me that generally speaking, rap doesn't age well. The one exception being the late 80s early 90s era, but in my mind, that's different because that was the era that basically started rap as we know it. Artists from that era were actually pioneers. But since then, there aren't that many rap artists from 10+ years ago that are looked back at fondly (unless of course, they're still active and popular today). There may be the exception here or there, but it happens much less often in rap than in other genres. With rock music, entire subgenres from decades past are listened to and loved just as much as the fans that existed during that era. And to be honest, I think the reason is that rap songs often have less things about them that really grab you as something you'd want to hold on to for years.

PS: If anything could make JohnnyNemesis start posting again, it would be this thread.

RageAndLov
12-20-2012, 06:54 AM
It seems to me that generally speaking, rap doesn't age well. The one exception being the late 80s early 90s era, but in my mind, that's different because that was the era that basically started rap as we know it. Artists from that era were actually pioneers. But since then, there aren't that many rap artists from 10+ years ago that are looked back at fondly (unless of course, they're still active and popular today). There may be the exception here or there, but it happens much less often in rap than in other genres. With rock music, entire subgenres from decades past are listened to and loved just as much as the fans that existed during that era. And to be honest, I think the reason is that rap songs often have less things about them that really grab you as something you'd want to hold on to for years.

I don't really know if this is the case. Rap tends to take very contemporary themes into the songs, while a lot of rock genres may deal with a lot of abstract nearly-meaningless subjects. If rappers are rapping about how bad Bush Sr. is, they are not very relevant for today, while rockers might sing about the love over the mountains that you felt in your heart, that is relevant as long as humans are in existence.

bighead384
12-20-2012, 07:03 AM
I don't really know if this is the case. Rap tends to take very contemporary themes into the songs, while a lot of rock genres may deal with a lot of abstract nearly-meaningless subjects. If rappers are rapping about how bad Bush Sr. is, they are not very relevant for today, while rockers might sing about the love over the mountains that you felt in your heart, that is relevant as long as humans are in existence.

That might be something to take into account, but to be honest, it's kind of a stretch to think that fully or even mostly explains it. It's not as if there's some terrible stigma attached to otherwise good songs that have outdated subject matter.

Big City Liberals and their allies love defending rap from guys like me. I'm surprised this thread hasn't gotten many replies.

Raku
12-20-2012, 01:16 PM
That might be something to take into account, but to be honest, it's kind of a stretch to think that fully or even mostly explains it. It's not as if there's some terrible stigma attached to otherwise good songs that have outdated subject matter.

Big City Liberals and their allies love defending rap from guys like me. I'm surprised this thread hasn't gotten many replies.
Why drag politics into this? =/

Anyway, the only rap I enjoy is from the 80s, and 90s (basically the early form like you said).

Although I do enjoy the rap mixed with rock (Zebrahead, and Bloodhound Gang are two examples).

Llamas
12-20-2012, 06:10 PM
I don't really care what music "ages well" because I like what I like. However, "10+ years ago" was basically the 90s. Anyway, I really like some of the popular rap hits from the early 2000's, like Shake it Fast, and a bunch of songs from Nelly and Ludacris. I dunno when Busta Rhymes was popular, but he had some really good ones, as well. Oh, and fricken' Outkast! They were awesome. Eminem, Jay Z, Snoop Dogg, Atmosphere, The Roots, Lupe Fiasco, Kid Cudi, Brother Ali, are and were active in other decades, so I guess they're not included for some reason.

Oh, and Nas and Mos Def were pretty good. And Jurassic 5!! I dunno... I dunno if rap "ages well" overall, but I personally enjoy a lot of rap from the early 2000s and late 90s.

Dulce
01-09-2013, 04:39 PM
The one & only TUPAC. He's hella fine but his lyrics are what did it for me. I wish he'd be making more music. RIP.

prettyflyforablackchick
01-09-2013, 06:43 PM
Honestly, I feel like it's exactly the opposite. Then again, I have fond memories of playing Sega Genesis with my favorite uncle while '90s gangsta rap blasted in the background, so I might be a little biased.

Jason_Voorhees
01-10-2013, 05:51 AM
Wow. I mean, no disrespect to you guys or anything, but I can't stand rap or hip hop. The only rap I can tolerate is Eminem, because it's actually original and funny, it's not just about cars, bling bling, gold teeth, bitches, smokin weed, blah blah blah that every single rapper "sings" about. It's a joke. Turn on any popular radio station in your community and guaranteed within ten minutes you will want to die. It's all autotuned, with no passion, no heart, no talent, generic dime a dozen garbage, I can't tell any of the songs apart! They all sound exactly the same to me. Again, sorry for being rude, I don't mean to disrespect anyone who likes rap, if you like rap, that's cool. I have friends who like rap, I have family members who like rap.. I just personally cannot stand the sound of it.

Llamas
01-10-2013, 06:07 AM
Wow. I mean, no disrespect to you guys or anything, but I can't stand rap or hip hop. The only rap I can tolerate is Eminem, because it's actually original and funny, it's not just about cars, bling bling, gold teeth, bitches, smokin weed, blah blah blah that every single rapper "sings" about. It's a joke. Turn on any popular radio station in your community and guaranteed within ten minutes you will want to die. It's all autotuned, with no passion, no heart, no talent, generic dime a dozen garbage, I can't tell any of the songs apart! They all sound exactly the same to me. Again, sorry for being rude, I don't mean to disrespect anyone who likes rap, if you like rap, that's cool. I have friends who like rap, I have family members who like rap.. I just personally cannot stand the sound of it.

You're not looking very hard if you think all rap is about cars, bling bling, gold teeth, bitches, smoking weed, etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbEwHJX95QE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22l1sf5JZD0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-mAMH5S6VA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fl5OovFrYzc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO18F4aKGzQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcoT7dYtUMk

I could go on and on, but that should be enough for now. None of those songs are about anything close to what you mentioned. Some are political, others are life commentary, and so on. At least four of them use no autotune or anything like that, and two of those rappers very often use live instrumentation. Don't judge an entire genre when you've only heard the biggest hits on the radio. Most of the biggest rock hits are about sex and drugs, too.

bighead384
01-10-2013, 06:32 AM
Honestly, I feel like it's exactly the opposite. Then again, I'm black, so I might be a little biased.

Yeah, I can see how you would think that. lol.

Anyway, that sounds like it's just a bit of nostalgia attached to a few songs rather than an observation about the whole genre.

XYlophonetreeZ
01-10-2013, 12:34 PM
Haven't I seen you post some stuff along the lines of how you dislike hip-hop in general? How can it age well if you don't like it in the first place?

Llamas
01-11-2013, 06:22 AM
Haven't I seen you post some stuff along the lines of how you dislike hip-hop in general? How can it age well if you don't like it in the first place?
Exactly. How does someone who doesn't like rap know if it ages well? That's like saying, "I hate wine and don't drink it, but dry Rieslings do not age well."

bighead384
01-11-2013, 07:28 AM
Easy. Because you can judge others connection to the music. Between people I know personally, and music critics, magazines/tv, no one cares to revisit about 97% of once popular rap that's around 10+ years old. For example, when you go to bar or you're driving around in your friend's car, do you hear anyone playing say, the 2nd most popular single from a rap album that was moderately successful in 2001? No, cause' no one gives a shit about that anymore. There isn't even a niche for it, or some nostalgic value. Again, there's always the exception, and I'm not about to do a research study here, but to me, it's a pretty obvious thing.

Tiny Vessels
01-11-2013, 08:20 AM
Easy. Because you can judge others connection to the music. Between people I know personally, and music critics, magazines/tv, no one cares to revisit about 97% of once popular rap that's around 10+ years old. For example, when you go to bar or you're driving around in your friend's car, do you hear anyone playing say, the 2nd most popular single from a rap album that was moderately successful in 2001? No, cause' no one gives a shit about that anymore. There isn't even a niche for it, or some nostalgic value. Again, there's always the exception, and I'm not about to do a research study here, but to me, it's a pretty obvious thing.

When "old" rap songs come on at the bar me and my friends are all out there dancing and just loving it. When "new" rap songs come on it all depends on what song it is and if we like it we will go out and dance. Our favorite "new" song to dance to is the Cupid Shuffle.

bighead384
01-11-2013, 08:29 AM
When "old" rap songs come on at the bar me and my friends are all out there dancing and just loving it. When "new" rap songs come on it all depends on what song it is and if we like it we will go out and dance. Our favorite "new" song to dance to is the Cupid Shuffle.

Well, like I said, there are some exceptions. "Party Up" by DMX is one of my favorite throwbacks to surprise people with. But I would still say that generally speaking, what I've said is true.

Llamas
01-11-2013, 11:47 AM
Easy. Because you can judge others connection to the music. Between people I know personally, and music critics, magazines/tv, no one cares to revisit about 97% of once popular rap that's around 10+ years old. For example, when you go to bar or you're driving around in your friend's car, do you hear anyone playing say, the 2nd most popular single from a rap album that was moderately successful in 2001? No, cause' no one gives a shit about that anymore. There isn't even a niche for it, or some nostalgic value. Again, there's always the exception, and I'm not about to do a research study here, but to me, it's a pretty obvious thing.

You don't really hear the second most popular single from a pop or rock album from 2002, either.

bighead384
01-12-2013, 11:33 AM
You don't really hear the second most popular single from a pop or rock album from 2002, either.
Not true. These groups started with commercial or critical success around year 2001, declined, but are still respected as worthwhile listens or throwbacks:

Chevelle, Tacking Back Sunday, Coheed and Cambria, Unwritten Law, AFI, Alien Ant Farm, Andrew WK, Jimmy Eat World, Queens of the Stone Age, Thursday, The Used.

Can't really think of equivalent situations with rap. Just seems like everyone forgets about the singles and albums. Even rap fans.

Llamas
01-12-2013, 11:58 AM
Not true. These groups started with commercial or critical success around year 2001, declined, but are still respected as worthwhile listens or throwbacks:

Chevelle, Tacking Back Sunday, Coheed and Cambria, Unwritten Law, AFI, Alien Ant Farm, Andrew WK, Jimmy Eat World, Queens of the Stone Age, Thursday, The Used.

Can't really think of equivalent situations with rap. Just seems like everyone forgets about the singles and albums. Even rap fans.

Apparently you don't know many mainstream rap fans. Ludacris, Nelly, Outkast, Lil Kim, Missy Elliot, Lil Wayne, DMX, and Dr Dre are all examples of rappers who got their first big success around the year 2001, declined, but are still respected as worthwhile listens or throwbacks. This is probably the least informed discussion you've attempted on this bbs.

Seriously, Party Up (In Here) goes along nicely with The Next episode and Forgot About Dre, Hot in Here and Country Grammar and Ride Wit Me, Hey Ya and Miss Jackson and The Way You Move and Roses, Roll Out and Move Bitch and What's Your Fantasy... etc, etc... they're all rap hits from that time period which people listen to as good throwbacks and positive memories. In fact, I might throw on that Ludacris album later.

bighead384
01-12-2013, 12:15 PM
Apparently you don't know many mainstream rap fans. Ludacris, Nelly, Outkast, Lil Kim, Missy Elliot, Lil Wayne, DMX, and Dr Dre are all examples of rappers who got their first big success around the year 2001, declined, but are still respected as worthwhile listens or throwbacks. This is probably the least informed discussion you've attempted on this bbs.

Dr. Dre is a rap legend, he doesn't belong on this list. Lil Wayne was popular VERY recently and kind of still is. And I never hear Nelly songs, I don't know where you get that. Furthermore, the albums that made these artists popular aren't really respected. Instead of trying to zero in on the few exceptions, why don't you just admit that it's true?

Llamas
01-12-2013, 12:16 PM
Lol, you're hopeless. No wonder you don't have any decent friends.

bighead384
01-12-2013, 12:18 PM
Whatever. Unless it's like some epic classic album or single, most rap stuff is quickly forgotten.

_Lost_
01-12-2013, 06:31 PM
I hear Nelly songs all the time on the radio here...

bighead384
01-13-2013, 11:09 AM
Fine, but Llamas' list was very poor, and those are probably just about the only examples you could *sort of* use. But of course, she's going point those exceptions out just to make it more exhausting.

More on the rock end that legitimately meets the aforementioned standards: Coldplay, Deftones, Jimmy Eat World, System of a Down, Interpol, The Vines, Mars Volta, The Mountain Goats, Sum 41, Minus the Bear, The Strokes.

Face it: Whether it's critical or commercial or just throwbacks, rock has WAYYY more staying power than rap. You'd be hard pressed to think of more rap examples without making serious stretches.

Llamas
01-13-2013, 12:10 PM
Haha, I just heard Outkast being played during the Falcons/Seahawks playoff game ;)

_Lost_
01-13-2013, 12:22 PM
The Vines had that one hit ages ago that played a bunch on fuse, but considering their lack of EVER touring at all, especially in the U.S., and the singer's career crippling mental illnesses, I don't see how you consider them to have any staying power in the U.S....

There are easily way more rock bands that were "one and done" when it came to popular singles or albums.

Little_Miss_1565
01-13-2013, 12:34 PM
I'm impressed that Bighead went as long as he did without posting something about black people.

bighead384
01-13-2013, 12:50 PM
You'd be hard pressed to think of more rap examples without making serious stretches.


Haha, I just heard Outkast being played during the Falcons/Seahawks playoff game ;)

Point in case. :)

And yeah, Lost, there's a lot of rock bands where that's the case. That doesn't mean rock bands with staying power are rare, though.

Llamas
01-13-2013, 01:00 PM
The Vines had that one hit ages ago that played a bunch on fuse, but considering their lack of EVER touring at all, especially in the U.S., and the singer's career crippling mental illnesses, I don't see how you consider them to have any staying power in the U.S....

There are easily way more rock bands that were "one and done" when it came to popular singles or albums.

The Vines were definitely one and done. There are also just way, wayyyy more rock bands to choose from than rappers.


I'm impressed that Bighead went as long as he did without posting something about black people.

Me, too.


Point in case. :)

? Dyslexic idiom time?

bighead384
01-13-2013, 01:20 PM
Based on the sort of things being said, I think I made my point.

Llamas
01-13-2013, 02:38 PM
Okay, you're right, bighead. :) Feel better now?

bighead384
01-13-2013, 06:38 PM
Okay, you're right, bighead. :) Feel better now?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zymqOEDLYnU

Retard
01-20-2013, 02:59 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvhOVkH-2z4

This is the only Lil Wayne song I actually like. This came out like five years ago now? Maybe a little less. Great fucking song.