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Thread: Why Government meddles in Russian Government affairs?

  1. #1
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    Default Why Government meddles in Russian Government affairs?

    I hate Bush 'n his dirt business why America want to make a control under Russia, i hope Putin will do smth,what a nice state of affairs i like american simple people i mean folk

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    Yes, it's really too bad that the U.S. is preventing Russia from destroying the private industry, scaring off foreign investors. It's also too bad that mean old America is angry that kindly father Putin has abolished the direct election of governors and instead made them puppets of the prime minister. It's also horrible that we're trying to meddle in the affairs of the Ukraine. Were it not for us and the horrifically atrocious E.U., the Ukraine would've gone through with a perfectly fine, if rigged, election (but legitimate leadership is only a burden to a government, is it not?). All in all, it's too bad that the U.S. has said so many horrible things about Chechnya while valiant Putin has held his tongue at every instance where he could criticize U.S. policy in regards to Iraq...


    You need to get your news through an internet service, as the Russian government currently controls all local media in the country. Sure, maybe I've been brainwashed too (shoutout to the New Radicals), but not nearly as severely as your police state has brainwashed you.


    Oh yeah, and likewise, I hope that Russia turns out well, I really, really want them to and Russian citizens rock the casbah. But, to me, Putin is an even worse leader than Bush, at least domestically.
    “It is a strange paradox that today’s central banks are generally staffed by economists, who by and large profess a belief in a theory which says that their jobs are, at the best, unnecessary, and more likely wealth-destroying. Needless to say, this is not a point widely discussed among respectable economists. Nevertheless, it is an issue worth pondering.”

    George Cooper, The Origin of Economic Crises

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    Mota Boy, you're acting imature now, it's not like people DONT want Putin!
    i agree, he aint no good leader, but in my opinion there AINT no good leaders.
    But truly there is not much of a difference between Putin's ways of controlling the medias and Bush's ways.
    Putin makes sure to have everything under his control for his own favour of course, Bush makes sure to have just as much under his controll that is needed to make sure he will rule the country, then not even count a ingle one of the votes from people that voted for anyone else.
    It's true because dont come telling me that the Democrats in the USA actually has got a say in the government, and the fact that USA has got a president too, makes it just so clear that Bush has just the same powers as an extremely powerful dictator, as he's got during these circumstances.
    Bush knows his ways of manipulating if he needs to, Putin does the same.
    The fact that Bush is hand picking the judgers of highest court, will have about the same influence as Putin's way of removing the local governours.
    Though the situation in Russia is not the same as in USA.
    In Russia they have a giant problem wich they have not yet solved, wich no Liberals or Social Democrats could fix.
    The problem im talking about is the one that occured after the Soviet Union fell, im quite sure you know what im talking about.
    The capitalists bought everything that the state once owned and now we have a huge gap between the classes, there aint no middle class, there are the richies and the starving.
    The richies got away with buying everything they saw very cheap after the fall of the Soviet Union. Those who were poor back in then are doing much worse now, while those who were rich back in then are doing much better now, so in my opinion, the whole situation just got worse.
    To reach some sort of possible equality in Russia, Putin, who is on the starving class' side, has a great mission and he's got the trust of the people that he will do something about it.
    By removing the local governours, he makes sure that nobody can change the country to become a Communist regime in the Stalinist way that it once has faced because he knows that simply does not work. But he even removed all chances for the neighbourhoods where the richies live, to cut themselves off from the rest of Russia in order to feed themselves on the starving people's share in the rest of the country.
    I dont like leadership of any kind but tell me, considering the situation in Russia right now, wasnt this simply the best thing to do?

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    Hey, Satanic Surfer, I'm not replying to you because you've never learned to paragraph properly (something vital to long posts) and because your probably off topic.

    Russian politics is a mess. However you can hardly be angry at the US for fiddling with Russian affairs. We all know Russia fiddles with everything else, I mean there was a reason for why earlier last year the Georgien people were afraid of Russian intervention. And of course, there is the Kremlin's candidate in Ukraine. I mean obviously invested interests there.

    Putin for his entire "elected" career, has never tried to make America an enemy. In many cases I think he wants to befriend and get the aid of America. If you don't like it, and the legal opposition to the Putin regime, is still quite large, then join one of those groups that knows the elections are rigged and fake and all that.

    But then again, you support Putin, in which case I find you to be nothing but a drone.
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    LOL, for fucks sake, wheelchairman!
    No offence really but im getting quite annoyed now. No, not because of you or anyone else, but that you seem to think i support Putin. That is nothing more than complete madness for me!
    As i mentioned more than once, i do not support political leaders of any kind!
    I would like to see the final solution in Russia, just as anywhere else.
    I want a Socialist society without government, state and beaurocracy.
    Im a Liberal Socialist, a Militant left wing Extremist, whatever you wanna call me... i believe in direct action towards Fascism and so on, so on and so on... but i do not believe in Putin, i do NOT think he is a good leader, and i know that i did mention that!
    Maybe you would have got that if you did not select wich parts of my text, you would have read and understood. For i do not support Putin, though i think he's a more intelligent man than Bush ever will be.
    Yet, Putin is a Socialist leader, wich makes him hell much of a better choise for me than those piles of Capitalist politicans out there. Putin has centralized his power extremely much but there is nothing that claims that a centralized government cannot lead a country as well as an open one.
    Take a look at China for example, of course they're a Communist regime but for the Marxist part of it for example, they are doing quite well. They have evolved much quicker than any other country in the world, yet they have a centralized power wich im STILL against.
    While George W Bush would never put a strike for equality or justice, the stuff that Putin now has done has been necessary because if the people in the wealthy parts would elect their local leaders, they would run the risks of wars inside of Russia, starvation and poverty.
    And we all know what would happen if the Stalinist Communists would gain the power once again, there wouldent be much left!
    Therefor, all im saying is that the actions Putin took were necessary to remain peace and to block out that classgap!
    Or do you not agree? In such case, tell me so!

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    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    Russian politics is a mess. However you can hardly be angry at the US for fiddling with Russian affairs. We all know Russia fiddles with everything else, I mean there was a reason for why earlier last year the Georgien people were afraid of Russian intervention. And of course, there is the Kremlin's candidate in Ukraine. I mean obviously invested interests there.

    Russian politics are a mess? And American aren't? ROFL At least Russia isn't 50%/50% split about whether it's good to invade countries without any reason.... As a matter of fact Russia didn't invade or bomb even one single country since USSR fell....

    As for 'fiddling with everything else' - no offence sir, but you're a retard... I'd like to see one concrete example of Russia trying to get involved in foreign affairs that don't concern it... And no, you can't bring up Chechnya, because those separatist scumbags are and were a part of Russia....

    Georgians were afraid of Russian intervention? Boo-fucking-hoo, did anything happen? Also keep in mind that USA stations their troops there nowadays....

    Ukraine elections? Do you honestly think that USA and EU weren't syphoning cash to the Uschenko camp? According to various stats they invested from $100,000,000 to $200,000,000 into his campaign... Russia's contribution to Yanukovich was much smaller, ranging somewhere under 10 million $ + that two day visit by Putin to Ukraine... I'm not sure how the fuck you can even compare those two types of interventions, especially if you'll consider that Ukraine is Russia's neighbor, not USA's.... And that about 40% of Ukraine's population are ethnic Russians, not Americans....

    The bottom line is - after the fall of USSR, Russia is no longer the "evil empire" that all the western countries painted it out to be. The real threat to modern society is USA, which is the only country fiddling with others right now, and when I say "fiddling" I mean bombing... "Axis of Evil", Iraq invasion and occupation, threats to Iran and North Korea... Wake up and smell the roses, or rather which direction the shit smell comes from.

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    SatanistGuy- I wasn't talking to you. Like I said, I didn't read your post. I did notice however that you consider Putin to be a socialist, that's kinda dumb.

    Russian politics are a mess? And American aren't? ROFL At least Russia isn't 50%/50% split about whether it's good to invade countries without any reason.... As a matter of fact Russia didn't invade or bomb even one single country since USSR fell....
    While American elections are messed up, that's not the point. However the American elections aren't nearly as rigged as the Russian ones. I mean, it's clear to everyone that Putin was never elected to power. The Russian Federation was a part of the first coalition against Iraq, and quite obviously, did bomb it.
    As for 'fiddling with everything else' - no offence sir, but you're a retard... I'd like to see one concrete example of Russia trying to get involved in foreign affairs that don't concern it... And no, you can't bring up Chechnya, because those separatist scumbags are and were a part of Russia....
    I could expect that response from a Russian Nationalist. Let me guess, you also hate Jews and Gypsies correct? And either Serbs or Albanians. I wonder what you think of the Nazbols.

    Georgians were afraid of Russian intervention? Boo-fucking-hoo, did anything happen? Also keep in mind that USA stations their troops there nowadays....
    In what way is that relevant?

    Ukraine elections? Do you honestly think that USA and EU weren't syphoning cash to the Uschenko camp? According to various stats they invested from $100,000,000 to $200,000,000 into his campaign... Russia's contribution to Yanukovich was much smaller, ranging somewhere under 10 million $ + that two day visit by Putin to Ukraine... I'm not sure how the fuck you can even compare those two types of interventions, especially if you'll consider that Ukraine is Russia's neighbor, not USA's.... And that about 40% of Ukraine's population are ethnic Russians, not Americans....
    You and I both know, that those stats aren't worth a thing. But the fact that you're supporting Russian intervention in countries it should leave alone, as a good thing, is ridiculous. (and you'll go and reply and say that the EU and the US does it. My response will be, who gives a fuck? I don't like them either.)
    The bottom line is - after the fall of USSR, Russia is no longer the "evil empire" that all the western countries painted it out to be. The real threat to modern society is USA, which is the only country fiddling with others right now, and when I say "fiddling" I mean bombing... "Axis of Evil", Iraq invasion and occupation, threats to Iran and North Korea... Wake up and smell the roses, or rather which direction the shit smell comes from.
    Russian Oppression of Chechnya is worse. Putin's declaration that he will now use America's Pre-Emptive strike policy is also disgusting in itself, he will use it on smaller nations to exploit them for Russia's benefit. Something you probably support. The fact that Putin is stripping away what little democracy Russia has is also disturbing.

    Putin is a terrible leader, who was never even elected. I am not anti-Russian, so don't try playing that card. You won't find another Dane who drinks Kvas, owns soviet-paraphnilia, travelled the Trans-Siberian, and is a supporter of Stolichnaya. However your leader is a dick.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mota Boy
    Yes, it's really too bad that the U.S. is preventing Russia from destroying the private industry, scaring off foreign investors. It's also too bad that mean old America is angry that kindly father Putin has abolished the direct election of governors and instead made them puppets of the prime minister. It's also horrible that we're trying to meddle in the affairs of the Ukraine. Were it not for us and the horrifically atrocious E.U., the Ukraine would've gone through with a perfectly fine, if rigged, election (but legitimate leadership is only a burden to a government, is it not?). All in all, it's too bad that the U.S. has said so many horrible things about Chechnya while valiant Putin has held his tongue at every instance where he could criticize U.S. policy in regards to Iraq...


    You need to get your news through an internet service, as the Russian government currently controls all local media in the country. Sure, maybe I've been brainwashed too (shoutout to the New Radicals), but not nearly as severely as your police state has brainwashed you.


    Oh yeah, and likewise, I hope that Russia turns out well, I really, really want them to and Russian citizens rock the casbah. But, to me, Putin is an even worse leader than Bush, at least domestically.

    Mmmmmmmmmmmmm..... Where do I start?

    "Yes, it's really too bad that the U.S. is preventing Russia from destroying the private industry, scaring off foreign investors." - so if the investors are foreign, tax evasion is perfectly legal? Now I get it... They should've just let UKOS get off the hook... I mean, who cares if they owe billions of dollars in back taxes... Right? *clapping hands*

    "It's also too bad that mean old America is angry that kindly father Putin has abolished the direct election of governors and instead made them puppets of the prime minister. " - you certainly know lots about the elections reform, including that the prime minister himself picks the governors... Your endless wisdom and knowledge certainly amaze me, but I'd suggest you to read some more about the changes before writing BS... What you wrote here is simply untrue, so congrats. *clapping hands*. I won't bother with full explanation since you're currently clueless on the topic, but let's just put it this way - prime minister won't pick the governors, as a matter of fact the process is more complicated... Two nominations for a governor for each region will be handpicked by Putin's direct representatives, after which the names of the people will be forwarded to his chief of staff who will run background checks (mafia connections, money in bank, etc...), then forward his decision to Putin... And then the parliament has to vote on whether to accept the candidate or not. While it might look too complicated for an American (no offence), it's a necessary measure, considering that a lot of governors in the past had active criminal connections, or simply used their finances or influence to get the position...

    "It's also horrible that we're trying to meddle in the affairs of the Ukraine. Were it not for us and the horrifically atrocious E.U., the Ukraine would've gone through with a perfectly fine, if rigged, election (but legitimate leadership is only a burden to a government, is it not?)." - no, as a matter of fact 40% ethnic Russian population in Ukraine should be thankful for the USA fiddling in their internal affairs and syphoning hundreds of millions of dollars to Yuschenko camp... I mean, Yuschenko is an overall great guy, except that he's a fucking nationalist (which no one in USA seems to understand), has commited electoral fraud as well (somehow 95%+ of eligible voters voted in Western Ukraine - Yuschenko's bastion of support, and no one cried "wolf" this time), and his closest ally Julia Timoshenko (to whom he promised the seat of Prime Minister once elected) is wanted by Interpol in connection to bribery... But yeah, otherwise he's cool, so let's all thank USA once again for picking their man... Yesterday Bin Laden, today Yuchenko, tomorrow = ?

    "All in all, it's too bad that the U.S. has said so many horrible things about Chechnya while valiant Putin has held his tongue at every instance where he could criticize U.S. policy in regards to Iraq..." - yeah, I must agree with you here... The Russian invasion of Chechnya was horrible. They bombed hospitals, weddings, tv stations and even hotels. And they didn't even have an excuse to bomb them, after all Chechnya wasn't responsible for 9/11, like Iraq was... And of course Chechnya was an independent country, unlike Iraq, which everyone knows was always an American colony.

    "But, to me, Putin is an even worse leader than Bush, at least domestically." - of course, after all Putin only tries to double the country's Gross Domestic Product by 2010, curb corrupt officials, politicians, and law enforcement agencies.... All of that is bullshit, and rather unnecessary. Bush is definitely doing a much better job... And it's okay that the dollar's value is falling. And it's okay that more and more Americans are jobless. And it's okay that people have no access to health care. And it's more than okay to give out overpriced no-bid Pentagon contracts to companies like Halliburton... I mean at least the guy's got a heart, who cares that he can't pronounce "nuclear" and reads books upside down... And that Putin guy is just evil, EVIL, EVIL, EVIL!!!!!!!



    *sigh*

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    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    While American elections are messed up, that's not the point. However the American elections aren't nearly as rigged as the Russian ones. I mean, it's clear to everyone that Putin was never elected to power. The Russian Federation was a part of the first coalition against Iraq, and quite obviously, did bomb it.
    I'm still waiting for some facts..... So far you couldn't have been further off the mark... Russia never invaded Iraq, and Putin won by a landslide in both his elections... He had no need to rig them, since he had 0 worthy opponents. I won't bother researching the stats for you, but I remember it was around 60-70% of the votes that he got.

    The United States, especially Secretary of State James Baker, assembled a coalition of forces to join it in opposing Iraq, consisting of soldiers from 34 countries: Afghanistan, Argentina, Australia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Canada, Czechoslovakia, Denmark, Egypt, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Honduras, Italy, Kuwait, Morocco, The Netherlands, Niger, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, South Korea, Spain, Syria, Turkey, the United Arab Emirates, the United Kingdom and the United States itself
    - taken from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War


    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    I could expect that response from a Russian Nationalist. Let me guess, you also hate Jews and Gypsies correct? And either Serbs or Albanians. I wonder what you think of the Nazbols.
    Albanians yes, others no. And Nazbols are just plain silly. Limonov should honestly rot in jail for inciting hatred and violence.

    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    You and I both know, that those stats aren't worth a thing. But the fact that you're supporting Russian intervention in countries it should leave alone, as a good thing, is ridiculous. (and you'll go and reply and say that the EU and the US does it. My response will be, who gives a fuck? I don't like them either.)
    Stats aren't worth a thing, but your opinions do, right? Countries? The only recent example I remember was Ukraine, and as I've mentioned before 40% of its population are RUSSIAN, so I would consider it to be a good thing to defend their interests... While I still wonder whose interests Americans and Europeans were protecting.

    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    Russian Oppression of Chechnya is worse. Putin's declaration that he will now use America's Pre-Emptive strike policy is also disgusting in itself, he will use it on smaller nations to exploit them for Russia's benefit. Something you probably support. The fact that Putin is stripping away what little democracy Russia has is also disturbing.
    Oppression? You honestly have no idea WTF you're talking about... Checnya is an integral part of Russian Federation and was for the last 2-3 centuries. Period. If Northern Denmark decides to separate itself from the rest of the country, what would you do, let it go? I'm really not sure since when protecting a country's integrity called "oppression". But okay, feel free to support the bastards that were responsible for Nord-ost, Beslan, and dozens of bombings and kidnappings around the country... If you do, you're really as good as them.

    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    Putin is a terrible leader, who was never even elected. I am not anti-Russian, so don't try playing that card. You won't find another Dane who drinks Kvas, owns soviet-paraphnilia, travelled the Trans-Siberian, and is a supporter of Stolichnaya. However your leader is a dick.
    He's not my leader, I'm Canadian, and left the country back in '91. But I'm glad to see a strong leader trying to take care of my birth country when it's at such a miserable stage of existence. Sure, he is not perfect, and he uses force to accomplish whatever he wants... But at least he's a stronger leader than Yeltzin and Gorbachyov, and seems to truly care about the country and not his personal gains. For that he has my respect and support. Also - I still want to see proof as to him not being elected... I'm sure you have it, living in Denmark and all.

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    You can claim that my being in Denmark means that I have no proof of the rigged Russian elections. But the fact that you, without any sources, claim that Putin got 70% of the vote, just shows that you never bothered to criticize your sources. Personally I would guess that a lot of rigging goes into all Eastern European elections, most especially Russia. Let's face it, he's about as elected as Lukashenko.

    And you're quite right, I had heard that the USSR had participated in the Gulf War. (this was before the name change,) I was wrong.

    Ah right, a dislike for all Albanians across the board, a true sign of a rational mind. At least we agree on the Nazbols, however the Nazbols have the right idea on the Chechnya issue, if not for the wrong reasons.

    The argument, of the Russian population in Ukraine, needing defence from Russia, is ridiculous, and reminiscent of Hitler's excuse to meddle in neighbor countries. If Putin cares about the average Russian's interests, then why isn't he doing more in Latvia? They do have a fascist who hates Russians in charge after all.

    I'm not saying that Chechnya should be an independent nation. However, Chechnya certainly will never function properly with the Russian military oppressing it. Obviously this has proven to be the wrong answer to the problem. And you can't in your right mind, associate all Chechnyans with the terrorist movement. That is as stupid as thinking all Albanians are evil.

    The strong leader, is reminiscent of why people vote for fascists. They always want a strong leader. Personally I think Dyuganov was better, I'm not wild about him, but better than Putin. Although what the USSR lacks is a real socialist party in the first place, you have like 20 bizarre ones instead.
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