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Thread: Asian Tsunami (Donations?)

  1. #1
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    Exclamation Asian Tsunami (Donations?)

    Hello to you all,

    I wasn't sure if this belonged in the political area of the forum, but it seems the closest for it. I was just thinking about the disaster in and around the Indian Ocean, and how much it makes my heart ache.

    It’s hard to imagine the synchronized death of 190,000 people, and the fact that figure keeps rising is a disturbing one, to say the least. You can't imagine what that’s like, even after you've seen the images and interviews. Your home wrecked, family dead or missing in front of your eyes, no basic toilet or facilities, and no food. And those are the more fortunate ones.

    I just feel this makes the war in Iraq completely shadowed, and perhaps even September the 11th, no matter how horrific both of those are. So I ask from you all, if you will be donating any money to the cause. I for one will be trying to donate as much as I can, which so far is around £50, but every little helps. I ask from you all to at least consider donation, putting that western money where it can be used best.

    I also ask what the offspring’s/noodles opinion is on this, as I know he has good political views, and was wondering if he has, or is considering donating any amount.

    Thank you for your time, I just hope you can all reply maturely.

  2. #2
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    I would say the war in Iraq is worse. It's an occupation and continued oppression of a group of people by another group of people. And it will end up killing more and more.

    The tragedy in South East Asia, is obviously a tragedy. Although unless Noodles hates those rice-boys, he isn't going to have much of a different opinion than anyone else, that he feels sympathy for them.

    But then again, you find 9/11 to be a worse tragedy than the Iraq war, so obviously you're confused.
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    were collecting money at church for the red cross to help victims in the tsunami disaster
    "I am the lizard king. I can do anything."
    -Jim Morrison

    The System Has Failed

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    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairman
    But then again, you find 9/11 to be a worse tragedy than the Iraq war, so obviously you're confused.
    9/11 IS a worse tradedy than the Iraq war. It precipated the Iraq war. You cannot deny this.

    My logic is flawless.

    PS: Regieme change is necessary, all the dictators need to go. Short term pain, long term gain. If we were all hippies nothing would ever get solved and the UN would sit idley by while people die. The law is a means to an end not an end itself, breaking international law is no crime when it's tyrants that hide behind it.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by RXP
    9/11 IS a worse tradedy than the Iraq war. It precipated the Iraq war. You cannot deny this.

    My logic is flawless.

    PS: Regieme change is necessary, all the dictators need to go. Short term pain, long term gain. If we were all hippies nothing would ever get solved and the UN would sit idley by while people die. The law is a means to an end not an end itself, breaking international law is no crime when it's tyrants that hide behind it.
    A string of lies and propaganda precipitated the Iraq war. In which you can claim that the greatest tragedies in the world happen whenever leaders make decisions.

    P.S. Regime change for another regime is futile and stupid. The Americans are the hindrance to Iraqi democracy now. And they were always going to be. Saddam didn't have to go, he was relatively tame against his people compared to our allies in this war, and he had no power to do anything outside of his country. What we have now in Iraq, is the exact same Ba'athist political infrastructure being used by Americans to run Iraq.
    Quote Originally Posted by T-6005 View Post
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    Why do you think there was no upheavel in Iraq pre regime change? Because one man was there and his power was supreme.

    What would have been your solution to the problem? Infact pro UN/international law/hippies never seem to make normative arguments of what ought to happen merely critise what has happened. They are content to sit idle and let the world rot because their heart bleeds more for the deaths a regieme change war causes then the deaths under that same regieme which stay cloaked.

    If the US stay in for the long term Iraq is better off, however, if public opinion changes it's not. It's the same story as Vietnam. If the US had public opinon they would have won, easily. But the hippy protests meant all those deaths were in vain. That's why I like GWB, he's got his population brainwashed so they should stay in for the long term.

    Also pre 9/11 Bush was going to be isolationst. When the planes hit that all went out the window. It was 9/11 which was the spark which meant they had an excuse to go into Iraq. It was 9/11 which enabled Bush's propaganda machien to whip the population into a frenzy over Al-quida. Without 9/11 none of that would have happened.
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    The history of the Iraqi regime, is a history of social upheaval. From the beginning it was a representation of two factors at power, in the early 70's it was the communists and the Ba'athists running Iraq, and Iraq flourished. The fact that Saddam took reigns and cut out not only the left-wing of the ba'athists, but also the entire communist party (basically from existence) was an example of a social upheaval by his own new ruling class.

    Since then, he was able to mobilize the masses for continuous war, which does wonders for sheeping the people. There was a major uprising in Iraq in the early 90's, however they were indecisive and were eventually slaughtered like sheeps at the alter.

    Right now, though real social upheaval is taking place in Iraq. The Iraqi people were able to live with a dictator who was one of their own, but a foreign occupying government promising democracy at gunpoint, was too much, and now the resistance movement has as much support and more than it did during it's peak under Saddam.

    What I would've preferred to happen with Saddam and Iraq? Absolutely nothing. A contained and sheeped dictator is no worse than any other leader in the world, especially America. It's hypocritical to liberate the Iraqis, while the CIA funds right-wing death squads in Columbia.
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    also, 9/11 had no effect on the Iraq war. It only was able to instill inside the US people a sense of confidence in their leader, which made his propaganda more succesful. The invasion of Iraq was a plan long before the concept of 9/11 was.
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    That's the argument my dad uses all the time: hypocracy. But as I say to him no one acts out of the pure goodness of their hearts, no such thing as a free meal. Everyone has selfish interests at heart.

    What seems to happen to me is that once people are liberated they go crazy, they see an opporunity to take control and new dawn. I will admit I have no idea how to stop this, people are their own worst enemy. Mass purging sounds about right, but then that would make me no better than Saddam? But at least I'd be working towards a better goal surely? If the ends justify the means....
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    Saddam thought his goals were the greater good as well. In fact, Ba'athism is a truly fascinating ideology. He just had to make sure it was implemented without hindrance.

    The Iraqi's haven't been liberated yet, so I don't think you can say that they have gone crazy from liberation. Perhaps they're frustrated with their new rulers?
    Quote Originally Posted by T-6005 View Post
    I do no be following, fortune prick me if I do no.

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