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Thread: How do you feel about incest?

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Llamas View Post
    However, I'm not sure I agree that it'd make molestation acceptable... how would it do that? Unless there was a blanket "all incest is fine", which I most certainly do not even remotely advocate.
    I never said this. I even specifically explained that wasn't what I was saying.

    Again,

    This isn't an issue of commonplace or acceptance because molestation will never become acceptable and never did I argue that making incest legal will make it so. But it would create tons of weird legal loopholes and situations where burying legitimate claims of molestation and rape is easier than it already is.
    Legal loopholes and gray areas do not mean acceptance. They mean that something that is considered unacceptable and morally wrong becomes harder to detect, prove, and prosecute. Anti-incest laws exist to protect victims of molestation and rape. You take away those laws, you take away those protections. This is not the same thing as molestation becoming acceptable, but the same thing as it becoming easier. I am not saying that it makes molestation acceptable. I am not saying that it makes molestation acceptable.

    The problem is that "all incest is fine" is really the only incest legalization you can have if you're including immediate family and you can't even possibly argue that you can make exceptions where it's legal sometimes and not other times because the law doesn't work that way. You can't do something like that on a case-by-case basis. It's all or nothing and any person who actually understands how these issues work will gladly take nothing even if it may screw over some responsible couples because of the issues at stake.
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  2. #42
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    Wow, sorry, there was a weird line jump in your post that caused me to mis-read:

    "This isn't an issue of commonplace or acceptance because molestation will never become acceptable and never did
    I argue that making incest legal will make it so."

    I read the second line on its own, and figured the first sentence was mis-typed and was supposed to read, "...because molestation has never become acceptable and never will." My mistake; going to bed because I'm obviously thrown off by strange line breaks and inventing meanings for sentences.

    Edit: my mis-reading didn't make any sense, either... how could you possibly say that it will never become acceptable, and then in the next line say that making incest legal will make it so? Fuck.
    Last edited by Llamas; 03-14-2013 at 07:04 PM.
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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vera;1496959.
    To all those defending incest from a purely intellectual or logical standpoint, rather than because of a personal experience and conviction - why?
    Why not?

    Surely, no one in this thread is advocating molestation, exploitation, or generations of inbreeding.

    I'm still not sure exactly how I feel about it, but Jakebert's argument is definitely something I very foolishly overlooked, and the best argument against incest. Ideally, it would be possible to differentiate between the different relationships, but since that is impossible, I agree that it should be banned. I'm still not entirely convinced that it is inherently bad though. Basically what I said about polygamy earlier, though I think that would be significantly easier to control.
    Last edited by WebDudette; 03-14-2013 at 09:27 PM.
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  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jakebert View Post
    Legal loopholes and gray areas do not mean acceptance. They mean that something that is considered unacceptable and morally wrong becomes harder to detect, prove, and prosecute. Anti-incest laws exist to protect victims of molestation and rape. You take away those laws, you take away those protections. This is not the same thing as molestation becoming acceptable, but the same thing as it becoming easier. I am not saying that it makes molestation acceptable. I am not saying that it makes molestation acceptable.

    The problem is that "all incest is fine" is really the only incest legalization you can have if you're including immediate family and you can't even possibly argue that you can make exceptions where it's legal sometimes and not other times because the law doesn't work that way. You can't do something like that on a case-by-case basis. It's all or nothing and any person who actually understands how these issues work will gladly take nothing even if it may screw over some responsible couples because of the issues at stake.
    First, just because something hasn't a general acceptance among the population, doesn't mean it is wrong. Just look at gay marriage. It was not too long ago that it was not only illegal, but frowned upon among most people.

    And no one here has said that "all incest is fine". Molestation of a young child is not okay under any circumstance. We are talking about two adults related by blood who are consentingly willing to have sex. You would have one law saying that incest with a minor or a person not giving consent is illegal. Another law would say that two consenting adults, as long as they don't turn pregnant, can if they will, have sex. If you are going with the "Oh but what if they do get pregnant, should they be forced to take an abortion?", then we can be very strict and say that only homosexuals are allowed to participate in incest, or sterile couples.

    It is weird, it is icky, but there is nothing wrong with it per se.
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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebDudette View Post
    Why not?

    Surely, no one in this thread is advocating molestation, exploitation, or generations of inbreeding.

    I'm still not sure exactly how I feel about it, but Jakebert's argument is definitely something I very foolishly overlooked, and the best argument against incest. Ideally, it would be possible to differentiate between the different relationships, but since that is impossible, I agree that it should be banned. I'm still not entirely convinced that it is inherently bad though. Basically what I said about polygamy earlier, though I think that would be significantly easier to control.
    Why not? Because it's pointless and a waste of energy. If we're all in agreement that it's probably best that it is illegal, and while some freak accidents may occur where incest might be okay or more acceptable, generally there are a fucking million reasons why we shouldn't legislate or morally accept all incest as harmless, then what the fuck are we arguing about?

    I'm just sick to death of people entering arguments out to prove a generally disagreed upon, "edgy" side of things for no good reason. You look like an asshole doing it, since all you're out to exemplify is your own dumbass arguments and rationalizations. Cut it out, it's so pointless.
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vera View Post
    Why not? Because it's pointless and a waste of energy. If we're all in agreement that it's probably best that it is illegal, and while some freak accidents may occur where incest might be okay or more acceptable, generally there are a fucking million reasons why we shouldn't legislate or morally accept all incest as harmless, then what the fuck are we arguing about?

    I'm just sick to death of people entering arguments out to prove a generally disagreed upon, "edgy" side of things for no good reason. You look like an asshole doing it, since all you're out to exemplify is your own dumbass arguments and rationalizations. Cut it out, it's so pointless.
    Personally, I wasn't arguing... you actually kinda jumped all over my posts unprovoked. And the thread was about how people feel about incest, and not just "should it be legal". I think it needs to stay illegal, but that doesn't mean my thoughts on it are black and white. It is an interesting topic and I'm finding the variation in posts about it to be interesting.
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  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebDudette View Post
    Why not? I'm still not sure exactly how I feel about it
    It should be uncomfortable for you.

    This should have only been Bighead bashing thread.

    Vera posts, Wheelchairman posted, the bbs is coming back. :d

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Llamas View Post
    It's off topic... but basically because I think people are adding to our over-population problems for completely selfish reasons. It's totally uneconomical, and there's simply zero reason for it. Hell, I'd be cool with capping a person's biological reproduction at two children. I understand wanting a child (even though I see no reason to have a baby when there are plenty who are up for adoption and need a home). I understand wanting that child to have a sibling. Beyond that, there is just no good reason for having more kids. And I say this as someone whose mother had 4 children, and whose brother had 5... :-/
    Sorry for dragging you off topic, thanks for the explanation though. I can see how that would be efficient in urban areas.
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  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vera View Post
    Why not? Because it's pointless and a waste of energy. If we're all in agreement that it's probably best that it is illegal, and while some freak accidents may occur where incest might be okay or more acceptable, generally there are a fucking million reasons why we shouldn't legislate or morally accept all incest as harmless, then what the fuck are we arguing about?

    I'm just sick to death of people entering arguments out to prove a generally disagreed upon, "edgy" side of things for no good reason. You look like an asshole doing it, since all you're out to exemplify is your own dumbass arguments and rationalizations. Cut it out, it's so pointless.
    It was an interesting discussion, I learned some things. Good enough for me. There is a good reason I never made any clear cut, black and white statements or decisions in this thread, because I knew I was not particularly knowledgeable.

    If you feel it's such a waste of time and energy, why participate at all? Besides, aren't a large percentage of discussions and arguments useless? Like, literally everything on this forum? Aside from Moto, you're really the only person being confrontational and shit, so that's cool.
    Last edited by WebDudette; 03-15-2013 at 05:38 PM.
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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Llamas View Post
    Personally, I wasn't arguing... you actually kinda jumped all over my posts unprovoked. And the thread was about how people feel about incest, and not just "should it be legal". I think it needs to stay illegal, but that doesn't mean my thoughts on it are black and white. It is an interesting topic and I'm finding the variation in posts about it to be interesting.
    You agreed with a spam post promoting incest and started rambling on about comparisons to arguments against homosexuality. Unprovoked? Well, it provoked me. So ..that happened.

    Congratulations on your academic selfless interest in the variation of posts.

    WebDudette - You just missed by point by about a mile, but okay.

    Sure.

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